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Author Topic: Rosch taking orders on OU Bouyancy device.  (Read 105207 times)

Offline hartiberlin

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Re: Rosch taking orders on OU Bouyancy device.
« Reply #15 on: April 27, 2015, 02:22:34 AM »
Here you can see a chart which tells you, how much
mechanical output power such a paternoster system can
deliver depending on the height and the liters per minute pumped
into the floats...

At about 4.5 meters deepth you can see, that if around 300 liters air are delivered by a pump
it can not output more than  about 200 Watts mechanically at the upper gear axis at maximum...

If you pump only around 100 Liters air down to 4.5 Meters deepth,
you can only get around less than 100 Watts out...
So you see, that it is impossible by using normal physics formulas to extract 4.8 KWatts,
what they claim !

Here is the chart:

http://www.overunity.de/1797/rosch-auftriebskraftwerk-gaia-auftriebs-kraftwerk-wie-es-funktioniert/dlattach/attach/14592/image//

it was made by using all the current physics formulas by the engineer Dipl. Ing. Bruggmüller report calculations
by user uatu from the allmystery forum.
Here is the calculation of engineer Brugmueller:
http://gaia.ws1.eu/files/Wirkungsgrad_eines_Auftriebskraftwerks_pb.pdf

Here is an Excel Spreadsheet to calculate it all:
http://gaia.ws1.eu/files/berechnung-auftrieb.xls

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Rosch taking orders on OU Bouyancy device.
« Reply #15 on: April 27, 2015, 02:22:34 AM »

Offline Philip Hardcastle

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Re: Rosch taking orders on OU Bouyancy device.
« Reply #16 on: April 27, 2015, 02:36:15 AM »
I am concerned by the level of investors who I understand have bought into this, I have sent Stirling quite a few emails suggesting he should not give them any positive promotion, but Stirling is gung-ho on doing otherwise.


As to how the scam can be done, might I suggest that a close inspection of the float chambers might be a good idea, perhaps they hold highly compressed air, or a battery powered cylinder. Given the size of the floats it would be easy to hide 50% of the volume for the purpose of hidden compressed air storage.


Indeed if a hidden compressed air tank is within the float then it would be a trivial mechanism to let them bleed the highly compressed air continuously into the remainder of the float chamber,  after all it would be disguised with the operation of the visible compressed air injection at the bottom. The operating time would then be limited to the bleed rate of the hidden cylinders, probably 2 hours going by what Hartiberlin has noted.


If so there would be no need to have any hidden drive to the actual chain, and so no rattling.

Offline hartiberlin

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Re: Rosch taking orders on OU Bouyancy device.
« Reply #17 on: April 27, 2015, 02:47:12 AM »
Well no, the scam is probably done by a hidden cable going through these hollow wall hoider rods
to the tube and then directly into the generator, which is probably only idling
from the buoyancy and the hidden power cable is then directly wired to the generator output plugs
so that it seems, the generator is all doing the 4.8 KWatts output... but in reallity it is just idling
and does never see a load.

So the whole thing is just powered by the grid.

You could test this, if the main power for this building would
be shut down.
If then this KPP will still work I will appologize, but it is highly possible,
that then this KPP will also stop working...

Offline hartiberlin

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Re: Rosch taking orders on OU Bouyancy device.
« Reply #18 on: April 27, 2015, 02:50:41 AM »
I asked Mr. Reuter from Gaia to do this test to shut down the main power supply
of the whole building complex to see if it still works, but he got mad about me and just only called names...

Another proof that there is something fishy...they really don´t want to proof it,
that it really works...

Offline ramset

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Re: Rosch taking orders on OU Bouyancy device.
« Reply #19 on: April 27, 2015, 03:15:14 AM »
so what does this mean?
within two hours of the first delivery the scam will be revealed [longest run time to date??] ,or perhaps sooner if they need to hook to the mains to get it working in the first place.

and these men all are known individuals with lives ,families and homes?
Do they not fear retribution from scammed persons as well as financial government penalties or prison sentences?

at what personal cost would they take such a risk??

that sounds even crazier in this day and age of instant worldwide media..


Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Rosch taking orders on OU Bouyancy device.
« Reply #19 on: April 27, 2015, 03:15:14 AM »
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Offline MarkE

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Re: Rosch taking orders on OU Bouyancy device.
« Reply #20 on: April 27, 2015, 03:31:39 AM »
so what does this mean?
within two hours of the first delivery the scam will be revealed [longest run time to date??] ,or perhaps sooner if they need to hook to the mains to get it working in the first place.

and these men all are known individuals with lives ,families and homes?
Do they not fear retribution from scammed persons as well as financial government penalties or prison sentences?

at what personal cost would they take such a risk??

that sounds even crazier in this day and age of instant worldwide media..
Well what does that suggest to you about delivery?  Does it suggest Perendev?  Does it suggest Magnacoaster?  Does it suggest Steorn?

Here is a bit of an observation and a riddle:  They have this machine that is supposed to be sloshing around weights with at least 5kW kinetic energy.  Does the machine vibrate heavily?  Do they secure the machine to the floor?  I don't see any bolts in the flange plate on the floor.   But they do attach pipes to the wall as Stefan has noted several times.   

Offline hartiberlin

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Re: Rosch taking orders on OU Bouyancy device.
« Reply #21 on: April 27, 2015, 03:34:51 AM »
well  ramset.
that is also a question, what still puzzles me...

The money they will make with it is not soo much, that they could hide on
an island for years in this modern world of top detectives and money
always leaves trails...

Well lets just still wait a few days, until we will get more test reports from
more technical people. Until now we have only this one witness report
which was only somebody with not much technical knowledge.

At least we have a few first pictures...
Gaia seems wanted to wait, until they will publish themself more infos
cause they wanted to have more visitors paying 40 Euros entrance fees...

but so far not many people have visited this event.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Rosch taking orders on OU Bouyancy device.
« Reply #21 on: April 27, 2015, 03:34:51 AM »
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Offline ramset

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Re: Rosch taking orders on OU Bouyancy device.
« Reply #22 on: April 27, 2015, 03:43:09 AM »
Mark E
Soo the laws in their country are very Weak?
no real enforcement to worry about?
and they'll only sell to little old lady's that wouldn't hurt a fly
if you robbed them ??

where I come from guys that do what you suggest here walk into shovels and much worse.
there is no amount of money that is worth that.

** I see Stefan posted whilst I was Plunking the keys.
yes we shall see hopefully

Chet K


Offline hartiberlin

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Re: Rosch taking orders on OU Bouyancy device.
« Reply #23 on: April 27, 2015, 03:48:16 AM »
Yes MarkE you are right the device should be also bolted to the floor
and it seems it is not...

Well lets just wait for a good video of it where we can also
see and hear the device.

Gaia seems to have wanted to build up the tension so high, that
they though many people would flock to their demo events during the
next days, but so far only around maybe 20 people have visited there.

They just wanted to get the entrance fees of 40 EUros for just seeing
the device for around 1 hour and then the next groups should
come in and see it and so on...
That is probably why they only publised no photos and videos yet, so
the people would come and pay their entrance fees...

Also as the device runs it costs around 30 cents/KWh, so if they have already
burned 500 KWh from the grid in about 1 week, it has costs them already 150 Euros to have wasted this
electricity there from the grid by showing it and working on it during the last days...

They published only the picture of the power meter showing 482 KWh so far...
http://gaia-energy.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/250415-rosch-gaia-aukw-besichtigung03-752x211.jpg

Well, so it seems they need the people to visit them so the entrance fees could compensate
their new big electricity bill... ;)

Offline TinselKoala

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Re: Rosch taking orders on OU Bouyancy device.
« Reply #24 on: April 27, 2015, 03:49:23 AM »
There certainly are laws in Germany. Just ask Mike Brady (Perendev). What these people expect to get out of all of this is not clear to me either. Maybe it's a new reality show or Candid Camera clone, to see how many people can actually be duped.

But it really looks like there is a "crisis of belief". Not many people have bothered to attend the "demonstration"... and no wonder! Why attend something so obviously staged, and pay money for it to boot? As I understand it, attendees cannot even approach the thing closely, and of course no measurements of anything are allowed. And Stefan's "Pull the mains plug to the building" test suggestion just makes the claimants mad, rather than being seen as a perfect opportunity to prove the skeptics wrong.

"Rosch: Believe it or Leave!"  I think I'll have some bumper stickers printed up with that saying on it. 


Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Rosch taking orders on OU Bouyancy device.
« Reply #24 on: April 27, 2015, 03:49:23 AM »
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Offline MarkE

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Re: Rosch taking orders on OU Bouyancy device.
« Reply #25 on: April 27, 2015, 04:01:17 AM »
Mark E
Soo the laws in their country are very Weak?
no real enforcement to worry about?
and they'll only sell to little old lady's that wouldn't hurt a fly
if you robbed them ??

where I come from guys that do what you suggest here walk into shovels and much worse.
there is no amount of money that is worth that.

** I see Stefan posted whilst I was Plunking the keys.
yes we shall see hopefully

Chet K
Chet, history is littered with brazen frauds.  The strict anti-fraud laws in Germany did not stop Mike Brady from his brazen fraud.  Some people go to great lengths to present false claims.  Surely you remember Steorn who according to their filed financial reports burned through over 20 million euros.  Steorn's own jury found unanimously that Steorn failed to ever demonstrate production of energy.  Yet Steorn claimed from the outset that they had proven to do so multiple times.  Steorn over the years told a number of whopper stories that were ultimately proven false.  One of those included a claim by Steorn that they had made their system work during the Spring of 2009, which was before their jury disbanded and subsequently made their public declaration.

Another scam artist Carl Tilley, hired Al Unser to drive his fraud mobile around a track as part of his promotion.  The DeLorean had a "break down" in one of the axles.  An observer offered parts from his DeLorean that was on the scene.  Nothing doing.  Carl Tilley and his wife became fugitives.  John Rohner spent around $100,000. on one trade show alone promoting engines that never worked and he never had any idea how to make work.  He has been found liable on all charges by the SEC in his civil case.  Odds are high that he will face criminal charges when that case is done.

In matters of controversy:  Always examine the direct data.  Side data, such as how much money someone spends, or if they have famous people endorsing them is often very misleading.

Offline hartiberlin

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Re: Rosch taking orders on OU Bouyancy device.
« Reply #26 on: April 27, 2015, 04:03:28 AM »
Well the problem is also, the whole concept was setup as selling kits !

So the question is, if these kits will ever get delivered at all and if,
how long will it take until the buyers would be able to build it up
themself and if it will not work at the buyers homes, Rosch and Gaia
could still blame the buyers, that they had done something wrong...

So it is a very complex situation.

Also  Gaia claimed in the past, that the about 250 to 300 people who have preordered
the device and already have paid 2400 Euros until now, can decide after the
prototype is ready, if they want to have kits and pay the rest of about 12.000 Eruos still
or quit and get their money back. But they told it like everybody would have a chance to come
to the Austria Gaia offices ( As Gaia is from Austria) and could have a good look at it with no
hurrying and that it would be shown in all details to all Gaia members and then they could decide
if they would order the kit or not and get their money back.

Now we hear today, that Gaia and Rosch are telling the visitors, that  the preorder guys
have to decide until the 6th of March, if they want the kits or not and will only
have a chance to see the prototype there in Spich in Germany...
So all the Austrian Gaia members would need to travel to Spich in Germany to see
the device and then decide in a hurry until the 6th of May...which is just ridiculous,
without real measurements being done...
And only on this last day the 6th of May are a few measurements allowed only
by electricians with approved papers and the measurement points where they will
be able to measure are only provided by Rosch... so no real measurements will be
probably be able to be made...and each electrician can only have 1 hour to make
measurements...really ridiculous...

Well...that is why I don´t trust the whole thing anymore and Mr. Dohmen CEO from Rosch
also lied to us the overunity.de measurement team in last October by telling us,
that a second small 2 Meter machine existed, which
was not true.

Regards, Stefan.

Offline MarkE

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Re: Rosch taking orders on OU Bouyancy device.
« Reply #27 on: April 27, 2015, 04:05:30 AM »
In four words:  Buoyancy drives don't work.

Offline hartiberlin

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Re: Rosch taking orders on OU Bouyancy device.
« Reply #28 on: April 27, 2015, 04:14:05 AM »
@TinselKoala

yes, you are right. The normal visitors only can get to a distance of 5 Meters to it,
where there is a chain. so not nearer...
They have 2 white infrared heating plates there as the load and a few lamps.

The visitor today said, one could only hear strange noises, but could not really see,
if the generator was turning..
Well even no ladder there to go up and see it from the close distance...
so he was very disappointed...
at least they serve some juices and some breads ( fingerfood) for the 40 Euros entrance fee.

But that is all you get to see there...and to technical questions Mr. Beiser
did not answer much and the other guy Mr. Otto, also from Gaia , just only said:
Believe it and buy... or get lost...

not very friendly.....

Offline sterlinga

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Re: Rosch taking orders on OU Bouyancy device.
« Reply #29 on: April 27, 2015, 07:42:01 AM »
I've posted the following at: http://peswiki.com/index.php/Blog:GAIA%27s_AuKW_Demo#Rumblings

There are some rumblings over at Overunity.com about this demonstration. The general sentiment seems to be that this must surely be some kind of scam. Scientifically, the numbers just don't add up. And they're not happy with the lack of access to the apparatus to take measurements. The security perimeter is 5 meters.
Meanwhile, the folks at GAIA are miffed at the skepticism in what to them is a straightforward demonstration of the first in a series of 500 production devices. This isn't transparent on rollers like the previous Plexiglas one, because it's designed for function, providing power, not proof.
It seems to me that both sides need more empathy for one another. GAIA needs to realize that extraordinary claims are going to require extraordinary proof. Those two fastening points of the tube to the wall are obvious points of possible trickery. This could be dispelled by cutting the power to the facility and showing that the device still runs. They shouldn't be put off by such a suggestion, but be grateful for it, as a good idea.
Meanwhile the skeptics should realize that from GAIA's point of view, they see this as a disruptive technology, and they need to keep their security apparatus wired up, and if they shut the power, that become compromised. This is just one thing that comes to mind to me as why GAIA might resist such a suggestion.
I have to admit that as I look at the numbers and info and the lack of transparency on the part of GAIA, I'm becoming more skeptical.
If this is a fraud of some kind, I doubt that very many people are in on it. Maybe two or three at most. The rest are blindly following along, thinking it is real because it looks real.
Tilley and others had a lot of people fooled.
Of course, I want this to be real.
I would hope that GAIA will allow some third party individuals to be present when the AuKW 1 is disassembled at the end of the demo May 6, so that the observers can see that the two fastening points are just that: fasteners, with no trickery embedded. At a minimum, they should allow 2-3 insider GAIA individuals to be present to observe this and report what they see.
Now that I have a better idea of what this demo entails and what the set-up is, I don't see why GAIA might be expecting big numbers to show up. The control panel is too complicated for most people. They can't see inside the tube. They can't get close. They can't climb high enough to look down inside. They just hear it operating. They could do that via YouTube.
If I had been in charge of the demonstration, I would have made sure that it was obvious that it was a stand-alone system with no way for external power to be applied. The supporting mechanism must be transparent. An easy way to do this would be to have the support mechanism removable, such as by having three fasteners so one could be removed at a time, leaving two to hold it in place. Or the supporting rods could be made see-through. I would have made the measurement instruments simple, not complex.
I'm not ready to put these guys in the Top 5. Not enough evidence yet.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Rosch taking orders on OU Bouyancy device.
« Reply #29 on: April 27, 2015, 07:42:01 AM »

 

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