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Author Topic: Are scalar waves BS?  (Read 39698 times)

Offline dieter

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Re: Are scalar waves BS?
« Reply #15 on: January 27, 2015, 04:46:07 AM »
As far as I know, Richard Feynman refers frequently to the "A-Field" which seems to be an other word for Scalar / longitudinal  waves. The reason why your Prof denies its existence is because at some point it was decided that they don't exist in order to simplify Electro engineering, at the time of Heaviside and Steinmetz.


http://functionspace.org/topic/3370/Longitudinal-Electromagnetic-Waves

http://farside.ph.utexas.edu/teaching/em/lectures/node51.html


http://hitoshi.berkeley.edu/230A/HW4sol.pdf


There is a detailed document by a russian guy about tesla's scalar wave research, but it is rather suspicious, since it seems as if the man observed Tesla 24/7...




www.teslasociety.ch/info/doc/Teslacar.pdf


http://secretsofcoldelectricity.com/pdf-downloads/
(scroll to secrets of cold war technology pdf)


Anyway, according to such sources it is an electrostatic phenomenon, but a very powerfull one.


According to other sources you can pulse a toroid coil and the scalar wave will be emitted from the center of the toroid.


For a walkie talkie they would however be rather useless, unless it is equipped with a sniper scope and you'd aim at the receiver precisely. At least, that's how I understand "longitudinal".


But it may be possible to use reflectors, like the ionosphere.


BR

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Are scalar waves BS?
« Reply #15 on: January 27, 2015, 04:46:07 AM »

Offline pomodoro

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Re: Are scalar waves BS?
« Reply #16 on: January 27, 2015, 05:00:09 AM »
Unfortunately real scientists have never been able to detect these waves. Only the odd crazy ones like Bearden. My advice is not to waste your time as you are going against one  hundred years of research multiplied by thousands of researchers. Utilize your passion in another less researched but similar field.

Offline dieter

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Re: Are scalar waves BS?
« Reply #17 on: January 27, 2015, 05:20:04 AM »
Pomodoro, guess you're wrong. Like light that can be longitudinal, but isn't in nature, so can "electrical" waves. And by following your guidence, the "real" scientists simply never tried it, even if they woulda have been able.


But ok, longitudinal waves may very well be useless. Except maybe to save and focus Energy in point to point transmission.


BR


Offline pomodoro

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Re: Are scalar waves BS?
« Reply #18 on: January 27, 2015, 07:39:21 AM »
So, there are reputable research papers proving light is scalar ?

Offline conradelektro

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Re: Are scalar waves BS?
« Reply #19 on: January 27, 2015, 08:57:37 AM »
@dz93: I did some experiments along the ideas of Prof. Dr.-Ing. Konstantin Meyl (see the attached diagrams and photo).

http://www.meyl.eu/go/index.php?dir=30_Books&page=1&sublevel=0

I bought the first two books Documentation (1) on Scalar Wave Technology and Documentation (2) on Scalar Wave Medicine) .

Well, the books are not very good and leave almost everything open (from an electronics point of view, but lots of esoterica). I could not detect anything useful, but it could be my fault.

The most paradox fact: One needs a connection between receiver and transmitter, a wire which can not be left out, if one wants to transmit anything. A connection through ground (earth) failed.

In a widely publicized video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LD8OkbumcY0 Meyl drives a little toy boat in a small basin, but a wire leads from the transmitter to the basin and the water in the basin contains a lot of salt to make it conductive (so that there is an electrical connection between transmitter and receiver). Therefore, Meyl does not transmit saclar waves through air, his set ups transmit electricity through a wire.

My personal conclusion: very inconclusive, no proof, lots of talk, no facts.

In my tests the output at the receiver was at least 5 times less than the input at the transmitter (and there has to be a wire between transmitter and receiver). But, as I said, one can always claim that I did something wrong.

You seem to be enthusiastic: buy the two books, make your own tests. You will not be content before you have done this. If you are not really poor, no harm is done, you just lost some money and time. I had to go through this, my own fault. I am allowed to be silly and I can afford it. Are you allowed to be silly, can you afford it?

Greetings, Conrad

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Are scalar waves BS?
« Reply #19 on: January 27, 2015, 08:57:37 AM »
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Offline synchro1

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Re: Are scalar waves BS?
« Reply #20 on: January 27, 2015, 10:24:43 AM »
This video by Jerry Bayles shows Chiral disk magnets agitating satillite magnets with a "Scaler Wave" at Shumman resonant frequency.:

Magnetic standing wave around two variable speed disk magnets resonates with two small 'balance' magnets at the Schumann frequency (7.834 Hz) on the right side.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YcVg_K3U-uk

Chiral Disks are in opposition. This magnet rotation should work inside a Faraday cage like TinselKoala's Caduceus broadcasting coil. Does "Lenz's law" apply to this effect?


Offline Farmhand

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Re: Are scalar waves BS?
« Reply #21 on: January 28, 2015, 01:34:25 AM »
As we can see by the definitions a Scalar is a constant unchanging value with no direction, and a wave is a movement of
something which means there is variation, the two are totally incompatible.

A wave by definition has constantly changing values and movement, a Scalar is an unchanging value. All waves have constant
variation.

In my opinion A longitudinal wave could be considered as an AC or pulsed current wave, the current doesn't move side to side it
moves directly from point to point. But it is driven by a fluctuation in the potential applied. Nothing scalar about either the current
or the potential unless considering an unchanging value such as the value of a DC potential or the value of DC current or the
values from a single point in time. 

That's my take on it. Scalar is a catch word used to whip up hype and bamboozle people. People using the word for hype or
attention should be taken with a grain of salt.

Definition of a Scalar.

Quote
scalar
(ˈskeɪlə)
n
1. (Mathematics) a quantity, such as time or temperature, that has magnitude but not direction. Compare vector1, tensor2, pseudoscalar, pseudovector
2. (Mathematics) maths an element of a field associated with a vector space
adj
3. (Mathematics) having magnitude but not direction
[C17 (meaning: resembling a ladder): from Latin scālāris, from scāla ladder]
Collins English Dictionary – Complete and Unabridged © HarperCollins Publishers 1991, 1994, 1998, 2000, 2003

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/scalar

.....

Definition of a Wave.

Quote
1.
a. A ridge or swell moving through or along the surface of a large body of water.
b. A small ridge or swell moving across the interface of two fluids and dependent on surface tension.
2. often waves The sea: vanished beneath the waves.
3. Something that suggests the form and motion of a wave in the sea, especially:
a. A moving curve or succession of curves in or on a surface; an undulation: waves of wheat in the wind.
b. A curve or succession of curves, as in the hair.
c. A curved shape, outline, or pattern.
4. A movement up and down or back and forth: a wave of the hand.
5.
a. A surge or rush, as of sensation: a wave of nausea; a wave of indignation.
b. A sudden great rise, as in activity or intensity: a wave of panic selling on the stock market.
c. A rising trend that involves large numbers of individuals: a wave of conservatism.
d. One of a succession of mass movements: the first wave of settlers.
e. A maneuver in which fans at a sports event simulate an ocean wave by rising quickly in sequence with arms upraised and then quickly sitting down again in a continuous rolling motion.
6. A widespread, persistent meteorological condition, especially of temperature: a heat wave.
7. Physics
a. A disturbance that travels through a medium. Energy is transferred by a wave from one region of the medium to another without causing any permanent displacement of the medium.
b. A graphic representation of the variation of such a disturbance with time.
c. A single cycle of a periodic wave.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/Wave

..

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Are scalar waves BS?
« Reply #21 on: January 28, 2015, 01:34:25 AM »
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Offline dieter

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Re: Are scalar waves BS?
« Reply #22 on: January 28, 2015, 02:46:32 AM »
Probably Scalar means that it affects things immediately, like the two sides of a balance: scale.


Longitudinal on the other hand may be more descriptive. Unlike traversal waves, longitudinal ones are a plain vector from one point in one direction (like an ideal laser), or maybe only the direction / vector.


I do however agree that both terms are often used pseudoscientificly and for a wide range of things, real or made up phenomena.


It is certainly a rather  fantastic trip to try to do the experiments described in the tesla chapter of that "secrets of cold war technology" book, and Meyl is also rather "fancy", regardless of his Professor title.


Then again, there may indeed have been certain experiments by tesla in which he discovered some interesting things.


It is known that he was highly intetested in controlling the pulse width of high power, high voltage high frequency arc dis-charges, and despite the system trolls denials, it is exactly such a condition that leads to excessive electron avalanches with "stochiastic electron multiplication"  in the ratio of 1:12'000'000 per centimeter. Funny enough these electrons are pulled right out of the air, leaving a bunch of ions behind.


At least Lindemann and that guy of the mentioned book (I never remember his name) seem to think there is a relation between avalanche / breakdowns , longitudinal waves (tho tesla was quoted to have described them being of electrostatic nature, like the charge of a cap) and the ever disputed Aether.


BR




BTW. Farmhand, a question for you: When a wave needs a medium to propagate, like air or water, and since there are wavelengths in light, what is the medium for light in the cosmos?



Yet anotherone of those questions that none can answer without to question the standard model...

Offline Void

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Re: Are scalar waves BS?
« Reply #23 on: January 28, 2015, 04:02:38 AM »
Although the following definition is probably at least somewhat simplified, it gives an idea why the term 'scalar wave' may have been used:
"What is a "scalar wave" exactly? Scalar wave (hereafter SW) is just another name for a “longitudinal” wave.
The term “scalar” is sometimes used instead because the hypothetical source of these waves is thought to be a
“scalar field” of some kind similar to the Higgs Field for example."
https://jmag0904.wordpress.com/2013/05/25/what-are-scalar-waves/

Bearden:
"A scalar potential is any static (stationary) ordering in the virtual particle flux of vacuum."

So, a scalar wave may be something like a propagating ordered disturbance/structure in a scalar field or scalar fields, which may have unique properties.
The term 'scalar' may have been used to clearly differentiate it from vector potentials and transverse waves. Maybe not the best choice
for the name, but it is really only a name. Just as 'ball lightning' is not really an actual 'ball'. ;)

Wlibert Smith, who came up with the Smith coil (yes, I know he was way out there in various ways) used the terms 'tensor beam' and 'tensor energy'.
Definition of a tensor: "A mathematical object analogous to but more general than a vector, represented by an array of components that are functions of the coordinates of a space."

All the best...


Offline DROBNJAK

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Re: Are scalar waves BS?
« Reply #24 on: January 28, 2015, 10:21:36 AM »
Scalar means: having no direction.

Examples are temperature, density and even height of landscape.

Lets say temperature and a hot incandescent bulb. Air around the bulb will be as hot as bulb, but temperature will start falling off with a distance from a bulb, till it reaches ambient temperature. That is scalar field. Now, the rate with which temperature falls, as we depart away from the bulb, has a direction. That direction is vector. So rate of change is vector field, but source is scalar field.

The rate of change itself will be cause of energy flow. In case of temperature, heat will flow from higher temperature air to lower temperature air. Or if your scalar field is a height of landscape, than rate of change is a slope of a terrain. So, ball will roll down in a direction of a slope and slope is vector. So rate of change in scalar field shows the direction in which energy flows. That is the vector part. Vector part causes flow of energy: rolling of a ball, movement of the air, movement of the charges etc.

I am not sure, but electric potential works the same as the above example. We have electric potential, that is scalar, but the gradient (rate of change) in that scalar is vector electric field.

Main thing is that scalars, fields and vectors are all mathematical constructs. Just a shadows of a real things. You can stick these mathematical shadows on anything you like. You can re-arrange them to suit your fancy. They are not a real physical things. The fact that they are not a real thing is their limitation. There could be a part that is missed out and it is still in a hiding. Another issues is that sometimes things are constructed which don't have an real physical presence, just to make maths easier. I am not sure, but displacement current can be such a case.

Now in the above examples, there is a source: a light bulb, an electric charge, or gravitational body like Earth. But there are cases where there is no source, like in density of material. Maybe Electro Magnetic Force EMF is an example of scalar field without source. Somebody can cast more light here.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Are scalar waves BS?
« Reply #24 on: January 28, 2015, 10:21:36 AM »
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Offline fritz

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Re: Are scalar waves BS?
« Reply #25 on: January 28, 2015, 12:37:34 PM »
Dear All,

I tried to compile everything I know / have heard about scalar waves into the following summary:
(Feel free to correct me)
Logitudinal/Scalar waves (sw) are somewhat near-field standing waves with resonant transmitters/receivers.
Near field means that the wavelength is in the same magnitude/order as the distance between both.
Contrary to hertz-waves which radiates in empty space depending on the characteristic of the antenna (which happens having a transmitter only) -
these waves only propagate if you have a resonant/tuned receiver. In contrary these antennas are tightly coupled - which means changing the impedance / load
of the receiver directly influences the energy drawn from the transmitter. In principle there is no transmitter or receiver - both can interact in both directions because
of the tight coupling. (tight coupled oscillation).
If there is some point that this even works with one component shielded (electrical or magnetic but not both) - than its because of the fact that in such scenario - standing wave - one component might be zero at the point of termination. The energy in this point is 100% electric or magnetic - and canceling out the other term has no effect because its zero at this point.
If you add the earth crust as third interactor (transmitter-receiver) - you end up with Teslas wireless worldwide power system. A (servo-tuned)  transmitter @schuman frequency can deliver power to another transmitter/receiver(interactor) tuned to the same frequency anywhere on earth. Once receiver is activated - a standing wave between transmitter-earth and receiver -earth is established - and dedicated power transfer is possible. So its about 3 coupled oscillators exchanging energy.
This might work pretty well in a scaled down experiment using 3 spheres - but I am not sure how healthy such system would be for the inhabitants of the big sphere/earth. It would change the earth electrical environment, weather, and whatever. This is the reason why "shutting down" Tesla on this project makes lots of sense.
Using this scheme for wireless charging is highly interesting because of efficiency...., or powering vehicles/equipment wireless at small distance....
Pls. feel free to correct me - thats just my "working copy" of what could be scalar waves.

rgds.

Offline fritz

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Re: Are scalar waves BS?
« Reply #26 on: January 28, 2015, 01:10:10 PM »
... getting curious about the trawöger pyramid - I got interested into dowsing phenomenon.
This is where I stumbled on this guy:
http://www.pimath.de/magnetfeld_der_erde/gitter.html
(sorry german)
Derived from the grid structures observed by dowsing - this guy assumes that the magnetic field of the earth has very tiny but existing ac component -
in the Mhz range. There would be pretty no way to observe such components as hertzian waves - because of the damping.
Otherwise it should be possible to get near-field interaction with this ground ac currents - using conductive rods and an electrosensitive human operating them.
So the dowser would act as resonant receiver - establishing a scalar wave between the grid current  and the rods.
There are some folks which developed/sell hartmann grid detectors:
http://www.viviss.si/download/viviss/ZBORNIK%20MGB/Jurgec_paper_79_87.pdf
Because the FM wavelength is about 3m - its not impossible to get some scalar compound with an FM transmitter - .
In the described setup - the power of the fm receiver should vary in presence of such hartmann line - This could be explained by a scalar fm component interacting with the gridline.
Based on theses studies - I expect Mr. Trawögers pyramid as such servo-tuned resonant receiver - with the pyramid just operates as shielding - and the reactor somehow manages to establish a scalar wave with the grid system.
Well - this is somehow offtopic - but putting the pieces together - it would make sense.
rgds.



Offline Farmhand

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Re: Are scalar waves BS?
« Reply #27 on: January 28, 2015, 03:31:27 PM »
Probably Scalar means that it affects things immediately, like the two sides of a balance: scale.


Longitudinal on the other hand may be more descriptive. Unlike traversal waves, longitudinal ones are a plain vector from one point in one direction (like an ideal laser), or maybe only the direction / vector.


I do however agree that both terms are often used pseudoscientificly and for a wide range of things, real or made up phenomena.


It is certainly a rather  fantastic trip to try to do the experiments described in the tesla chapter of that "secrets of cold war technology" book, and Meyl is also rather "fancy", regardless of his Professor title.


Then again, there may indeed have been certain experiments by tesla in which he discovered some interesting things.


It is known that he was highly intetested in controlling the pulse width of high power, high voltage high frequency arc dis-charges, and despite the system trolls denials, it is exactly such a condition that leads to excessive electron avalanches with "stochiastic electron multiplication"  in the ratio of 1:12'000'000 per centimeter. Funny enough these electrons are pulled right out of the air, leaving a bunch of ions behind.


At least Lindemann and that guy of the mentioned book (I never remember his name) seem to think there is a relation between avalanche / breakdowns , longitudinal waves (tho tesla was quoted to have described them being of electrostatic nature, like the charge of a cap) and the ever disputed Aether.


BR




BTW. Farmhand, a question for you: When a wave needs a medium to propagate, like air or water, and since there are wavelengths in light, what is the medium for light in the cosmos?



Yet anotherone of those questions that none can answer without to question the standard model...

I say is the Aether, but that's too easy to repeat. A question foryou dieter. Do you consider space outside of atmosphere to
contain nothing ? Or is there something everywhere ?

I can only say for myself that light waves do propagate through space which is a medium or they don't because it isn't. Either
way light is present here on earth as a result of the suns radiations. I never stated that light waves travel through a vacuum or
that space is a vacuum.

We can have a light wave, an electromagnetic wave a human wave ect. all have movement, what causes the wave is not what
we call the wave we call the wave what is moving eg, a water wave or a sound wave or a light wave ect.

We can't have a wave of scalar or a scalar wave, we could have a wave cause by a scalar value of something maybe.

We can have a water wave or a wave of water. See my point.

It's kinda like the "generator statement errors" a diesel generator does not generate diesel. haha. It should be called a diesel
powered electricity/electrical generator. A wind turbine can be a wind powered electricity generator ect. .

A scalar field is not a scalar wave the entire scalar field is static. A scalar field makes sense a scalar wave does not.

I have seen no credible claims by Tesla of any OU energy or extra energy except those setups where he collects environmental energy.

I see no claims of OU performance from his Magnifying transmitter by him, in fact he clearly stated in court that his Magnifying
transmitter system was under unity. And explained it with figures.

..

..

Offline dieter

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Re: Are scalar waves BS?
« Reply #28 on: January 28, 2015, 05:04:05 PM »
Yes, Aether. Nothing does not exist.


What it exactly is, that's an other question, but it is everywhere and also there where they say is "empty space".


BR


Offline Void

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Re: Are scalar waves BS?
« Reply #29 on: January 28, 2015, 05:19:08 PM »
Farmhand, see my comment above. It appears the term 'scalar wave' was coined because
a scalar wave is supposed to be some sort of phenomenon associated with 'scalar fields' It may be something like
an ordered disturbance or ordered structure/formation in a scalar field or scalar fields which either
can move through a scalar field in some way (for example longitudinally), or maybe which can act at a distance in a scalar field
without actually propagating like a transverse wave propagates. I am not sure who coined the term 'scalar wave'.
It would be good if we could find a definition from the person who actually coined that term. :)
As I mentioned above, Wilbert Smith used the terms 'tensor beam' and 'tensor energy'. Other terms
may have been used by others as well...  Wilbert Smith said his Smith coil produced 'doughnut shaped waves' which
could remain stationary or which could move as well. I don't know how Wilbert Smith determined the wave shape,
but he was into some very controversial stuff overall, so most people probably won't take his stuff too seriously, but he did have
a strong technical background.

It is also possible that there are quite different effects which people may be mixing up and including under the single term 'scalar wave'.
It seems it is all just hypothetical at this point anyway.

Does anyone know who actually coined the term 'scalar wave'? Did this person create a formal definition?
Was it Bearden who coined the term?


P.S. I believe that magnetic fields and electric fields are considered vector fields, and since a scalar wave
is a hypothetical phenomenon that is supposed to be associated with scalar fields, it is apparently not related
to electric and magnetic fields. The Higgs field is an example of a scalar field.
Scalar Field:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scalar_field
Higgs Field:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Higgs_boson

Many people may be mixing up the concept of a longitudinal wave in an electric field, for example, if such is possible, with a
scalar wave. A scalar wave is not an accepted mainstream scientific concept at any rate, as has already been pointed out.
What Telsa and Wilbert Smith experimented with may be quite different than 'scalar waves'. It could be that many people
are mixing apples and oranges. Without a formal definition of scalar waves, it is pretty hard to discuss it, at any rate. ;)

All the best..


Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Are scalar waves BS?
« Reply #29 on: January 28, 2015, 05:19:08 PM »

 

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