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Author Topic: Partnered Output Coils - Free Energy  (Read 3501692 times)

TinselKoala

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Re: Partnered Output Coils - Free Energy
« Reply #645 on: January 31, 2015, 09:18:45 AM »
I've just tried my testbed with LED load. What a truly _nonlinear_ set of responses that gives! Far too many weirdnesses to list quickly, in both bucking and aiding modes. I'll have to shoot a video, probably tomorrow.  But remember that I'm using this op-amp based bipolar driver. Sometimes I think I'm seeing that the op-amp starts oscillating and that is causing some of the weirdness. It sure makes the LEDs glow, both polarities, when that happens.

conradelektro

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Re: Partnered Output Coils - Free Energy
« Reply #646 on: January 31, 2015, 11:47:03 AM »
Sorry, duplicate post (deleted). Conrad

conradelektro

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Re: Partnered Output Coils - Free Energy
« Reply #647 on: January 31, 2015, 12:08:16 PM »
@MileHigh:

Thank you very much for your explanations and for your advice. It really helps me to do better measurements. It is kind of you to take so much time for this.

The first thing I will do is the "reality check". I will check with the primary and each of the "partnered coils" (while the other "partnered coil" is left open). That should be interesting.

Then I have to go to higher power (1 or 2 Watt input) in order to better see what is going on. As you say, at the 40 mW level (at the input) I am in a difficult area because the transformer properties are dominant.

The 4.3 MHz situation is way beyond my level of expertise, I will leave it for the moment. The core is rated for up to 25 KHz, the 4.3 MHz are clearly not right for this core.

I measured the impedance of the windings with nothing else connected besides the LCR meter, even the "partnered coils" were not connected in series yet. The core was tightly in place (both halves secured with the steel clips):

primary: 23 mH to 25 mH depending on frequency (100 Hz, 1 kHz, 10 kHz)

secondary ("partnered coil") underneath the primary: ~ 240 mH (slight variations depending on frequency)

secondary ("partnered coil") on the side: ~220 mH (slight variations depending on frequency)

There might be a slight difference in the windings of the two "partnered coils", but the difference in impedance could be due to the fact that one has the primary wound over it?

One thinks, that measuring "input" and "output" is quickly and easily done. But as we see, it gets quite involved and needs a lot of knowledge and experience. No wonder, we never see good measurements. For most people it is beyond their capabilities (as one sees in my case, I barely manage) and a good scope is the bare minimum. A function generator might help but brings in more difficulties.


@MileHigh and TinselKoala:

The "GND connection issue" is very involved. At least I know now, that I have to be careful. I was not clearly aware of the problem with the "GND of the mains", the instrument housing and the "GND of the instrument probes or output".

The situation with my Function Generator and my Scope (I just checked again):

All probe and signal GNDs are connected together and with the "mains GND"! The housing is plastic (this is propably the reason why everything is referenced to "mains GND"). In other words, there is only one GND, and it is "mains GND" (which of course is in every mains socket in my house).

So, that means, "signal GND", "TIGGER GND" and "SYNC GND" of the Function generator are connected with "probe GNDs" and "TRIGGER GND" (even test 1 kHz GND) of the Scope via the "mains GND" (since both have to be plugged into a wall socked in order to have electricity). Well, battery operated instruments would be better. The function Generator could be insulated with a separation transformer (but this creates a "frequency issue", a transformer has a limited frequency range, surely not from 10 µHz to 20 MHz). One never stops to learn important things.

There is good news from my laboratory power supply: The Minus Pole of both DC outlets is not connected to "mains GND" and the two "Minus Poles" are also not connected to each other. But there is a "mains GND" socket at the front panel if one needs a connection to "mains GND". The housing is metal and is connected to "mains GND". The front panel with all the sockets, knobs and a little display  is plastic.


Thanks again for the discussion, I definitely learned a lot (and I hope that OU-inventors and OU-replicators take more care with their measurements in the future, they could also learn a lot in this thread).

Greetings, Conrad

MileHigh

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Re: Partnered Output Coils - Free Energy
« Reply #648 on: January 31, 2015, 03:06:28 PM »
Thanks Conrad for your comments.  I can't respond right now, but I am going to leverage your positive and appreciative comments to do some unpleasant "dirty work."

Synchro1 - this is a call out to you:

Contrast Conrad's comments with your junk comments about me from this thread:

<<<
You're completely full of shit about practically everything!
You're betraying yourself as condescending and obnoxious to everyone on the forum and it's entire membership trivializing us as insignificant. You're that perversely sadistic to practically everyone. You act as though no one can compare to you. All your comments are over padded with conceited drivel. That's why everyone hates your guts.
You're a nut case from hell!
>>>

I am really fed up by your constant harassment and abuse.  This has been taking place off and on for more than a year.

Everyone, please look at this short YouTube clip from Synchro1:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YwMwhdJE_Vg

Listen to his voice, look at his hand, look at his body movements.  Between those three clues I make him to be a man between 45 and 55 years old.

So the question is:  Why is a 50-year-old grown man acting like a psycho on this forum?

It's time for you to stop.  I am issuing a public challenge to you:

I challenge you to post here and state that you will stop harassing and abusing me.

Just make the posting saying that you are going to stop, and that will be the end of it and we can all move on.

If you ignore this posting and continue to harass and abuse me then I will do the following:

1.  When you get abusive I will say nothing except for posting the two "Syncho1 shaming and humiliation links" in response.
2.  I am asking people of good will to email Stefan asking him to kick Synchro1 off of this forum if he continues.  If enough people do this then perhaps that will stop his unacceptable behaviour.

To everyone, I am sorry to even have to make this posting but I am fed up.  I am simply totally fed up and Synchro1's behaviour is totally unacceptable, and it's doubly totally unacceptable because he is a 50-year-old grown man.

It's time for this nonsense to stop.

MileHigh

Void

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Re: Partnered Output Coils - Free Energy
« Reply #649 on: January 31, 2015, 05:51:25 PM »
TK, I can try your suggestion when I get the chance, but the waveforms looked to be as expected
when changing to different vertical deflection settings.

John.k1, the effect is very tiny at this point. Will need to see if I can increase the effect in any way first.
So far just a little oddity, and the effect itself is not the most stable. The waveforms looked somewhat different when
I checked again early this morning, but I haven't had time to try more measurements. Don't have a lot of time
for more tests this weekend, but will continue to test when I have time.

Milehigh, the connections were all good. I have already double and triple checked all connections with an ohm meter.
The CSR's are not the best, but they are carbon film at least. Only 5% tolerance. I will see if I can order some lower tolerance ones.

All the best...

conradelektro

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Re: Partnered Output Coils - Free Energy
« Reply #650 on: January 31, 2015, 06:07:12 PM »
While doing the "reality check" suggested by MileHigh  (output only from one of the partnered coils)  I realised that I had a bad error in the measurement set up.

Please look at the attached drawing. The error is caused by the ground connection between my scope and my function generator.

The shunt R1 (on the input side in series with the primary coil) is in a bad place, because it lifts the potential of the primary off the ground. This would not be any troble unless one measures the output with a scope, which has a ground connection to the mains ground and then to the ground of the function generator. The secondary is pulled down to ground and the output looks smaller that it is.

The error is not very big, the output was about halved. But because the output is so much lower than the input, this is no great thing.

I will redo the measurements with the shunt R1 in the right place (on the signal side, not at the ground side of the primary).

I can pre announce that MileHigh was right: If only one halve of the secondary is used for output (the second bucking halve is disconnected) we get a "normal transformer" with an output slightly lower than the input.

Greetings, Conrad

TinselKoala

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Re: Partnered Output Coils - Free Energy
« Reply #651 on: January 31, 2015, 06:47:18 PM »
@Void:
Quote
TK, I can try your suggestion when I get the chance, but the waveforms looked to be as expected
when changing to different vertical deflection settings.

Yes, I'm sure they do look as expected on the screen. What I'm concerned about is the possibility of a "scaling factor" in the data file that is dumped to the spreadsheet. So if you could actually look at the data files themselves, when the vertical deflection is set to 1v/div and 5v/div on the same waveform, to verify that the voltage values in the data files are the same, and not scaled by the change in vertical deflection display values, that would be very helpful.

@Conrad:
Quote
There is good news from my laboratory power supply: The Minus Pole of both DC outlets is not connected to "mains GND" and the two "Minus Poles" are also not connected to each other. But there is a "mains GND" socket at the front panel if one needs a connection to "mains GND". The housing is metal and is connected to "mains GND". The front panel with all the sockets, knobs and a little display  is plastic.

Many dual bench supplies have the ability to be set to "Independent", "Parallel", or "Series" modes. Independent means that the two sides (May be called "Master" and "Slave") are separate as you have measured and not connected together internally at all and the two sides have their own Voltage and Current Limit controls independent. "Parallel" mode may connect the two Plus Poles together and the two Minus Poles together internally, and in this mode the Master side controls the Voltage and Current Limit. "Series" mode should connect the Plus Pole of one side to the Minus pole of the other side and the total voltage will appear between the Minus Pole of one side and the Plus Pole of the other side, with "zero" at the "middle poles". This latter connection is how you set the supply up for Bipolar op-amp type or push-pull circuits. In this case usually the Master voltage and current controls set the overall voltage and current limit.

It is usually the case that none of the actual outputs are ever internally connected to the chassis/mains linecord Ground; front panel jacks are provided for this connection if needed and sometimes a little metal strap is fitted so that a true mains ground connection can be established easily if needed, by making the connection between the jacks with the strap. Often the three banana jacks for + and - and Ground are arranged in a triangle, on 3/4 inch centers. This is so a standard "Dual Banana Plug" adapter can easily be plugged in. Most DMMs will also have their jacks on 3/4 inch centers for the same reason.

synchro1

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Re: Partnered Output Coils - Free Energy
« Reply #652 on: January 31, 2015, 08:09:04 PM »
Thanks Conrad for your comments.  I can't respond right now, but I am going to leverage your positive and appreciative comments to do some unpleasant "dirty work."

Synchro1 - this is a call out to you:

Contrast Conrad's comments with your junk comments about me from this thread:

<<<
You're completely full of shit about practically everything!
You're betraying yourself as condescending and obnoxious to everyone on the forum and it's entire membership trivializing us as insignificant. You're that perversely sadistic to practically everyone. You act as though no one can compare to you. All your comments are over padded with conceited drivel. That's why everyone hates your guts.
You're a nut case from hell!
>>>

I am really fed up by your constant harassment and abuse.  This has been taking place off and on for more than a year.

Everyone, please look at this short YouTube clip from Synchro1:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YwMwhdJE_Vg

Listen to his voice, look at his hand, look at his body movements.  Between those three clues I make him to be a man between 45 and 55 years old.

So the question is:  Why is a 50-year-old grown man acting like a psycho on this forum?

It's time for you to stop.  I am issuing a public challenge to you:

I challenge you to post here and state that you will stop harassing and abusing me.

Just make the posting saying that you are going to stop, and that will be the end of it and we can all move on.

If you ignore this posting and continue to harass and abuse me then I will do the following:

1.  When you get abusive I will say nothing except for posting the two "Syncho1 shaming and humiliation links" in response.
2.  I am asking people of good will to email Stefan asking him to kick Synchro1 off of this forum if he continues.  If enough people do this then perhaps that will stop his unacceptable behaviour.

To everyone, I am sorry to even have to make this posting but I am fed up.  I am simply totally fed up and Synchro1's behaviour is totally unacceptable, and it's doubly totally unacceptable because he is a 50-year-old grown man.

It's time for this nonsense to stop.

MileHigh

@MileHigh,

Conradelectro's just an ass kisser and you're still completely full of shit! Chris specifically asked the experimentors to examine for "Scaler Activity" in adjacency to the "Bloch Wall" of the "Bucking Coils" down in the Shumann resonant frequency range with magnet detectors. All you "Sting" racketers have done is find more ways to not get any authentic results as usual. Conrad and you both found ways to trivialize this kind magnet excitation demonstrated by Conrad last year in his "Took a Dive" Synchro coil tests.

ramset

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Re: Partnered Output Coils - Free Energy
« Reply #653 on: January 31, 2015, 08:23:50 PM »
HHMMmmmm
Not good, not good at all.


Syncro    please don't jump on the ice......


I don't follow you guys and your steelcage matches,but I tell you what,  you start messin with whats happening here in this thread......


Not good not good at all,right here we have People benefiting and we're trying to save
many experimenters much time ....time they don't have to waste.


Conrad has been a wonderful and level headed experimenter for quite some time
here.


and MH is helping with that too.
please take this to another thread [start a topic and discuss it there
maybe others will voice their opinions ..?]


I know every story has two sides .
please...
respectfully
Chet

synchro1

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Re: Partnered Output Coils - Free Energy
« Reply #654 on: January 31, 2015, 08:38:43 PM »
HHMMmmmm
Not good, not good at all.


Syncro    please don't jump on the ice......


I don't follow you guys and your steelcage matches,but I tell you what,  you start messin with whats happening here in this thread......


Not good not good at all,right here we have People benefiting and we're trying to save
many experimenters much time ....time they don't have to waste.


Conrad has been a wonderful and level headed experimenter for quite some time
here.


and MH is helping with that too.
please take this to another thread [start a topic and discuss it there
maybe others will voice their opinions ..?]


I know every story has two sides .
please...
respectfully
Chet

Well here's part of the other side: Chris started this thread, then got bullied off by that pack of condescending Trolls, and is no longer here with his advice. Now we're stuck with all the wrong ways to test the coils again as usual.

ramset

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Re: Partnered Output Coils - Free Energy
« Reply #655 on: January 31, 2015, 09:06:42 PM »
Well
to be honest ,I do not like that one bit...
but to be honest ,Honest...Not really
crazy about Hide and seek either.
and to be absolutely clear Over unity research
is no place to make a claim and not back it up
with good measurements , actually a very bad idea
 in most places that you would ask people to replicate.


    Even a black box Demmo showing your equipment and
 all the connections as well as provisions you made to insure
no extra energy could enter the system leading to
false readings and claims [Happens ALL THE TIME ]


so the next few days will show just what has
 gone on with this.
and in the mean Time Cyril [Smudge]has brought
 some ideas forth to experiment with which fall in
line with experiments HE has performed in the past
 as well as Work HE has been involved with .


that will be very interesting to see and there will most
 likely be a thread here too.


Chet










synchro1

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Re: Partnered Output Coils - Free Energy
« Reply #656 on: January 31, 2015, 09:23:43 PM »
Here's where the tests should be directed:

"Proof that free energy is obtained through wobbulation around the axis of a spinning magnet where the wobbulation is 90 degrees to the magnetic field. The result is a changing energy field axial within a hollow pickup coil that is 90 degrees to the magnetic field but inline axially to the wobbulation offset. A coaxial capacitor in the coil is used to pick up the radial electric field and the presence of that field proves the concept of a three dimensional 90 degree field change which is accomplished via the action of the spinning magnet wobbulation towards the pickup coil"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TnSAfL7z7go&feature=youtu.be
.

ramset

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Re: Partnered Output Coils - Free Energy
« Reply #657 on: January 31, 2015, 09:27:12 PM »
Fix that mess please ..chop every half dozen words so it stays in one frame!
I'm getting dizzy running back and forth.


as a matter of fact I'm leaving this thread alone
you want to discuss YOUR experiment start
another thread and share YOUR results.
you want to fight with MH Start a steelcage thread.


I will not post another word here,fellows are spending
Their time and money Here...I respect that.


Chet

conradelektro

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Re: Partnered Output Coils - Free Energy
« Reply #658 on: January 31, 2015, 09:34:56 PM »
I think the best is to just not answer the postings of Mr. synchro1. An attention seeker will be disappointed once he gets no reply. That works with children and should therefore be the right treatment of a never-grown-up.

Greetings, Conrad

conradelektro

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Re: Partnered Output Coils - Free Energy
« Reply #659 on: January 31, 2015, 09:37:17 PM »
I did a test with the coil as a "normal transformer". Please see the attached drawing.

Only secondary H2 (of the pair H2 + H3) is connected in parallel to the resistor R2, primary H1 is wound over H2:

10 Vpp sine wave from function generator, 2 khZ

Vh = 0.28 V
Vt = 2.44 V
Vr = 2.44 - 0.28 = 2.16 V
I = 2.44 / 100 = 0.024
Ɵ = 5°
Watt through the primary H1 (input) = 0.024 * 0.28 * cos(5°) = 6.7 mW
V0 = 0.68
Io = 0.68 / 100 = 0.0068
Watt through R2 (output) = 0.68 * 0.0068 = 4.6 mW

Result: input of 6.7 mW through primary H1 results in an output from H2 through R2 of 4.6 mW

One can do the same measurement and calculation with R2 in parallel with H3:

10 Vpp sine wave from function generator, 2 khZ

Vh = 0.33 V
Vt = 2.44 V
Vr = 2.44 - 0.33 = 2.11 V
I = 2.11 / 100 = 0.021
Ɵ = 25°
Watt through the primary H1 (input) = 0.021 * 0.33 * cos(25°) = 6.3 mW
V0 = 0.72
Io = 0.72 / 100 = 0.0072
Watt through R2 (output) = 0.72 * 0.0072 = 5.1 mW

Result: input of 6.3 mW through primary H1 results in an output from H3 through R2 of 5.1 mW

Greetings, Conrad