Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

News announcements and other topics => News => Topic started by: SeaMonkey on December 01, 2014, 08:12:40 PM

Title: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 01, 2014, 08:12:40 PM
Vaccinations are, unfortunately, not as effective as they've
been claimed. (http://www.healthfreedoms.org/vaccines-dont-work-malignant-mumps-in-mmr-vaccinated-children/)

It is necessary to verify the efficacy of any vaccination before
permitting ourselves and family to be victimized.  Some
vaccinations can be deadly.

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 02, 2014, 08:26:28 AM
The Vaccine Illusion (http://therefusers.com/refusers-newsroom/vaccine-illusion-new-book-by-ph-d-in-immunology/#.VHyw_Dn00vQ) by Dr. Tetyana Obukhanych,
an immunologist.

Some professionals are well aware of the dangers.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: ramset on December 02, 2014, 05:36:38 PM
Sea Monkey
its good to be informed ,lest one become DuPeD...


and as we know there is controversy and Crime surrounding recent queries into
Vaccines and Autism....


it always pays to pay attention,,
the investment can yield life changing returns.


thanks for starting this topic ,it may not be what we ultimately do here.
but it effects us all.


Chet
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 09, 2014, 10:00:13 PM
Whooping Cough vaccinations in Cape Cod,
Massachusetts. (http://www.naturalnews.com/047930_whooping_cough_vaccinations_exemptions.html)

China suspends newborn vaccinations. (http://www.naturalnews.com/047928_hepatitis_B_vaccines_infant_death.html)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 09, 2014, 10:02:19 PM
Quote from: ramset
Sea Monkey
its good to be informed ,lest one become DuPeD...

Correct.  And correct. ;)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 10, 2014, 03:14:15 AM
Vaccinations are, unfortunately, not as effective as they've been claimed. (http://www.healthfreedoms.org/vaccines-dont-work-malignant-mumps-in-mmr-vaccinated-children/)
Sadly that article was written by someone who is terribly stupid.

It's not actually a study, so much as a case report.  There were seven cases of complicated mumps in the south of France.    This is not a "epidemic" in the normal sense of the term as there are few cases occurring over a year. If you had read the study - which you didn't and neither did the writer of the article.  You would know that they actually don't know what the cause here is.  They speculate that this could be a new strain or it could simply be the result of lower coverage. 
Quote
It is necessary to verify the efficacy of any vaccination
We do this, it's part of the serology.  I always find it interesting that people who want to talk about the lack of effectiveness of vaccines don't seem to understand what they are postulating.   See unlike every stupid thing you might replace vaccines with - vaccine effectiveness is (during development) determined by measuring seroconversion.  That is, the production of antibodies based on the presence of antigens.   If you want to doubt that seroconversion is strongly correlated with disease resistance then you also have to explain why seroconversion happens.  Do you think it's some accidental side effect?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 10, 2014, 04:43:03 PM
Deep within that maze of crazy the aforementioned article actually does attempt to imply that antibodies are uncorrelated (or unnecessary) for disease resistance.  However it fails to cite a study to support this assertion and it doesn't really seem to explain what antibodies are for or why they would correlate with disease resistance in other cases...and then it flops back into the mumps case report.

How does anyone read this stuff and not think the writer is crazy?  I mean it seems to imply that antibodies are not a part (or a significant part) of the immune system and then just moves on from this Nobel Prize material without justification.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 10, 2014, 09:01:06 PM
Quote from: sarkeizen
...
How does anyone read this stuff and not think the writer is crazy?
...

Your statement above is a very persuasive clue to
your state of mind;  a well indoctrinated state of
mind.  Cognitive Dissonance rages unabated in
today's world of Mind Control and Brainwashing. :o

Ah well, in due time even that stubborn rejection
of evidence which points to serious problems with
vaccinations will give way to Truth.  Providing of
course that the mind is still functional... 8)

Why flu shots are the greatest medical fraud in history. (http://www.naturalnews.com/047942_flu_shots_medical_fraud_vaccine_quackery.html)

 
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 10, 2014, 10:22:33 PM
Your statement above is a very persuasive clue to
your state of mind;  a well indoctrinated state of
mind.  Cognitive Dissonance rages unabated in
today's world of Mind Control and Brainwashing. :o

Ah well, in due time even that stubborn rejection
of evidence which points to serious problems with
vaccinations will give way to Truth.  Providing of
course that the mind is still functional... 8)

Why flu shots are the greatest medical fraud in history. (http://www.naturalnews.com/047942_flu_shots_medical_fraud_vaccine_quackery.html)
I note that you very often use NaturalNews as your reference.  NN has a number of problems, one of which is playing very fast and loose with the facts.  The article that you linked is an example.  Adams fails to distinguish between multidose and single dose flu vaccine.  He fails to distinguish between metallic mercury and mercury compounds and between different mercury compounds.  Single dose flu vaccine does not contain mercury.  Multidose containers of flu vaccine contain small amounts of thimerosal a methyl mercury compound.  About a third of flu vaccine by dose is distributed in multi-dose form and so contains thimerosal.  So first, one can get flu vaccine with no thimerosal at all:  Get a single dose vaccination.  Second, thimerosal is not metallic mercury.  It is a compound that the body readily passes.

Why do such things matter?  Well, let's take another chemical that in its pure form has a very high toxicity:  Chlorine.  Exposure to high concentrations of chlorine gas has a very high fatality rate.  The gas burns the linings of among other things the lungs. It was used to horrible effect in WW1.  However, certain chlorine compounds such as potassium chloride and sodium chloride are quite benign and are ingested by the entire population in large amounts.  The mercury compound found in vaccines is thimerosal.  Adams does not address thimerosal toxicity.  He implies that thimerosal is nasty poison because a constituent material is mercury.  He is at best badly misinformed and at worst intentionally spreading misinformation that encourages people to make bad personal health decisions.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 10, 2014, 10:30:22 PM
Your statement above is a very persuasive clue to
your state of mind;  a well indoctrinated state of
mind.  Cognitive Dissonance rages unabated in
today's world of Mind Control and Brainwashing. :o
I wonder which of us indoctrinated.  Well, I gave an argument based on demonstrable science and you just made sweeping generalizations.  Isn't that interesting?
Quote
Ah well, in due time even that stubborn rejection
of evidence which points to serious problems with
vaccinations will give way to Truth.  Providing of
course that the mind is still functional... 8)
Well I was able to produce a pretty reasonable argument as to why the writer of the article you regurgitated a) Didn't know what they were talking about and b) had not read the study they were quoting.  That's a pretty good indication of a functional mind.  Now if you only could produce an actual argument we might know that your mind is functional.  :)
Quote
Why flu shots are the greatest medical fraud in history. (http://www.naturalnews.com/047942_flu_shots_medical_fraud_vaccine_quackery.html)
Well this article is a pretty good example of the opposite of thinking. Like a lot of things on Natural News it makes a lot of broad claims but nothing really approaching a cogent argument.  How are vaccines "the greatest medical fraud in history"?  Because some contain, as advertised thiomersal?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 11, 2014, 12:10:53 AM
sarkeizen,

Your 'demonstrable science' may be seriously
contaminated.

Not all within the Medical Community would
agree with you. (http://www.amazon.com/Thimerosal-Evidence-Supporting-Immediate-Neurotoxin/dp/1632206013)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 11, 2014, 12:28:41 AM
Quote from: MarkE
...
Adams does not address thimerosal toxicity.  He implies that thimerosal is nasty poison because a constituent material is mercury.  He is at best badly misinformed and at worst intentionally spreading misinformation that encourages people to make bad personal health decisions.

Americans are famous for their 'bad personal health
decisions.'  The American Diet chief among them.

Not content with hazarding the American People, we
export our Junk Food world wide.  All for the Love of
Money.

Some of the elements in their pure form are terribly
toxic.  Fortunately, in the cases you cited, those compounds
are when reasonably ingested beneficial to health.

Compounds of Mercury are a different animal,
however.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 11, 2014, 12:53:53 AM
While this article (http://www.theorganicprepper.ca/the-fda-gets-in-womens-panties-reusuable-menstrual-pads-to-be-subject-to-4000-a-year-in-extortion-fees-12092014) has nothing directly to do with
vaccinations it does address toxicity and the
Food and Drug Administration.

The United States bureaucracy gets crazier by
the day... ::)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 11, 2014, 03:01:18 AM
So the issue was whether Adams and his NN report was making a fair representation of the facts or not, with his provocatively titled article:  "Why flu shots are the greatest medical fraud in history" and we get:
Americans are famous for their 'bad personal health
decisions.'  The American Diet chief among them.

Not content with hazarding the American People, we
export our Junk Food world wide.  All for the Love of
Money.
I say you lost the thread there.
Quote

Some of the elements in their pure form are terribly
toxic.  Fortunately, in the cases you cited, those compounds
are when reasonably ingested beneficial to health.
So here you agree that compounds of elements can have completely different chemical and therefore biological effects than the elements alone.  Ergo Adams' failure to distinguish between elemental mercury and compounds of mercury undermines his claims.  Ergo Adams' failure to specifically address the compound of mercury used in about 1/3 of vaccine doses undermines his claims.  But then you launch off with this:
Quote

Compounds of Mercury are a different animal,
however.
Where is your evidence that all compounds of mercury in any amount cause physical harm?  This is above and beyond the fact unaddressed by Adams' that over two thirds of flu vaccination doses do not contain any mercury compounds at all.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 11, 2014, 05:11:02 AM
Quote from: MarkE
So here you agree that compounds of elements can have completely different chemical and therefore biological effects than the elements alone.  Ergo Adams' failure to distinguish between elemental mercury and compounds of mercury undermines his claims.

Where is your evidence that all compounds of mercury in any amount cause physical harm?

This is an easy research project.  Nay, it is not
my evidence;  rather it is acknowledged scientific
truth regarding the toxicity of compounds of Mercury. ::)

Even in High School Chemistry classes in the late
50s it was taught that elemental Mercury, the
metal, was relatively non-toxic and safe to deal
with at ordinary temperatures.  It becomes unsafe at
elevated temperatures where its vapor pressure becomes
substantial.  On the other hand, there are virtually no
compounds of Mercury which are non-toxic or safe to
ingest.  Mercury accumulates within the body in various
compound forms and gradually causes life hazarding
conditions to develop.  Lead Poisoning occurs in a similar
fashion. :o

Check it out.  Five minutes of research should verify the
nature of the problem with Mercury. :(

It would probably be very wise to steer clear of any government
propaganda which attempts to establish the opposite. ::)

Perhaps the World's worst case of Mercury Poisonings
occurred in Japan. (http://www1.umn.edu/ships/ethics/minamata.htm)

Wikipedia article. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minamata_disease)

 
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 11, 2014, 07:47:49 AM
This is an easy research project.  Nay, it is not
my evidence;  rather it is acknowledged scientific
truth regarding the toxicity of compounds of Mercury. ::)

Even in High School Chemistry classes in the late
50s it was taught that elemental Mercury, the
metal, was relatively non-toxic and safe to deal
with at ordinary temperatures.  It becomes unsafe at
elevated temperatures where its vapor pressure becomes
substantial.  On the other hand, there are virtually no
compounds of Mercury which are non-toxic or safe to
ingest.  Mercury accumulates within the body in various
compound forms and gradually causes life hazarding
conditions to develop.  Lead Poisoning occurs in a similar
fashion. :o
References???  Because the CDC asserts that the body eventually completely eliminates the ethylmercury in Thimerosal and therefore no mercury from Thimerosal accumulates.  http://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/Concerns/Thimerosal/thimerosal_faqs.html  Can you point to any peer reviewed studies that show long term accumulation of ethylmercury?
Quote

Check it out.  Five minutes of research should verify the
nature of the problem with Mercury. :(

It would probably be very wise to steer clear of any government
propaganda which attempts to establish the opposite. ::)

Perhaps the World's worst case of Mercury Poisonings
occurred in Japan. (http://www1.umn.edu/ships/ethics/minamata.htm)

Wikipedia article. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minamata_disease)
According to your reference above:

Quote
Quote
The Episode

Minamata is located on the Western coast of Kyushu, Japan's southernmost island (see map). Its disturbing story begins, perhaps, in the 1930s, as the town was continuing to shed its heritage as a poor fishing and farming village. In 1932 the Chisso Corporation, an integral part of the local economy since 1907, began to manufacture acetaldehyde, used to produce plastics. As we know now, mercury from the production process began to spill into the bay. Though no one knew until decades later, the heavy metal became incorporated into methyl mercury chloride: an organic form that could enter the food chain.
Those people were poisoned by exposure to methyl mercury.  Thimerasol does not contain methyl mercury.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: profitis on December 11, 2014, 10:53:40 AM
According to wikipedia thimerasol is very toxic by inhalation,ingestion @mark E.it metabolises to other shit in the liver eg ethylmerury,not a far cry from methylmercury
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: ramset on December 11, 2014, 04:10:59 PM
When it comes to Autism ,there is no room for arrogance ,intellectual or otherwise , and certainly no room for cover ups or altering data.

1 in 64 children [and rising] is a completely unacceptable statistic .


Taking a stance that "we Know" what causes or does not cause Autism Pryor to serious investigation  would be the epitome of irresponsible behavior .


reprehensible to say the least.....


Chet
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 11, 2014, 06:02:57 PM
Your 'demonstrable science' may be seriously contaminated.
You're changing your argument.  I mean if you had one - just vomiting links isn't exactly saying very much.  My argument was about the absolute MORON who wrote the original posted article which implies that antibodies don't strongly correlate with disease resistance.  I further implied that only an idiot would take this at face value - which you apparently did. :)
Quote
Not all within the Medical Community would
agree with you. (http://www.amazon.com/Thimerosal-Evidence-Supporting-Immediate-Neurotoxin/dp/1632206013)
How about you provide an ARGUMENT instead of links?  Make a clear statement about what you mean and how some evidence supports it.  Then I'll destroy it. Sound good? :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 11, 2014, 06:35:05 PM
Taking a stance that "we Know" what causes or does not cause Autism Pryor to serious investigation  would be the epitome of irresponsible behavior .
However we do know to a rather high degree of certainty what *doesn't* cause autism.  That would be Thiomersal.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Madeo on December 11, 2014, 06:35:15 PM
We know that Thimerosal is 50% mercury and we also know that mercury is a potent neurotoxin. I find it appalling that doctors used to give vaccines with thimerosal to children especially newborn babies. I would not be surprised that it is linked to Autism although it is hard to prove especially when the people that were suppose to investigate it is most likely funded by Pharm. companies and/or FDA. However, it really doesn't take a PHD or a rocket scientist to know that  Thimerosal/mercury is dangerous.


It could be one of the reasons why we don't produce people like Tesla, Einstein, Keely, etc....  I know we keep talking about Tesla, but I find it amazing that he could build stuff with the materials he had available which is primitive by our standards today.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 11, 2014, 06:41:05 PM
We know that Thimerosal is 50% mercury and we also know that mercury is a potent neurotoxin.
We also know that if you believe that the diagnosis rate of autism is due to an increase in incidence then thiomersal is very, very, very likely to be unrelated.
Quote
I find it appalling that doctors used to give vaccines with thimerosal to children especially newborn babies.
Why?  It's a completely reasonable adjuvant. 
Quote
However, it really doesn't take a PHD or a rocket scientist to know that  Thimerosal/mercury is dangerous.
Apparently it takes a mathematician to properly calculate risk.  At 0.5 mcg you are probably inhaling a similar dose when you spend an hour in a dentist's office and definitely when eating a tablespoon of tuna.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Madeo on December 11, 2014, 08:12:02 PM
As i said before,  it doesn't take a PHD or Rocket scientist to know that Thimerosal/mercury is a potent neurotoxin.  It may be "normal" or "tolerable" to adults, but babies aren't. Their brains are still developing and anything that will interrupt during this process will likely have long term effects. Do you really feel comfortable injecting your baby with a substance that contains a neurotoxin ??   Their vaccine isn't a single dose only.  Since birth to an age of 2 years old,  they get a whole bunch of them. Dose after dose after dose of vaccines that have mercury contents is simply flat out dangerous and irresponsible. 


There is no such thing as a safe level of mercury. Any doctor or scientist who tell you otherwise needs their license revoked !!










Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 11, 2014, 08:50:44 PM
According to wikipedia thimerasol is very toxic by inhalation,ingestion @mark E.it metabolises to other shit in the liver eg ethylmerury,not a far cry from methylmercury
The CDC in the link I already provided claims that the body completely eliminates ethylmercury, and that thimerosal in the quantities contained in multiple use vaccine is therefore safe.  I offer you the same opportunity as SeaMonkey:  come up with peer reviewed data that shows that ethyl mercury accumulates as methyl mercury does.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 11, 2014, 08:51:28 PM
As i said before,  it doesn't take a PHD or Rocket scientist to know that Thimerosal/mercury is a potent neurotoxin.  It may be "normal" or "tolerable" to adults, but babies aren't. Their brains are still developing and anything that will interrupt during this process will likely have long term effects. Do you really feel comfortable injecting your baby with a substance that contains a neurotoxin ??   Their vaccine isn't a single dose only.  Since birth to an age of 2 years old,  they get a whole bunch of them. Dose after dose after dose of vaccines that have mercury contents is simply flat out dangerous and irresponsible. 


There is no such thing as a safe level of mercury. Any doctor or scientist who tell you otherwise needs their license revoked !!
It takes reliable evidence.  Where is yours?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 11, 2014, 09:01:21 PM
When it comes to Autism ,there is no room for arrogance ,intellectual or otherwise , and certainly no room for cover ups or altering data.

1 in 64 children [and rising] is a completely unacceptable statistic .


Taking a stance that "we Know" what causes or does not cause Autism Pryor to serious investigation  would be the epitome of irresponsible behavior .


reprehensible to say the least.....


Chet
Chet we should take great care with our children.  As with all problems, it is important to address them in order of significance.  MMR and polio used to cause devastating damage.  Rubella in particular caused terrible birth defects. 

Let's use real, reliable data to decide how to best protect our children.  Wakefield who started this panic has been fully discredited.  And BTW according to the CDC:  MMR vaccine does not contain ANY mercury.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 11, 2014, 09:17:19 PM
it doesn't take a PHD or Rocket scientist to know that Thimerosal/mercury is a potent neurotoxin.
You have a knack for using many words and saying nothing.  What does "potent neurotoxin" mean?  Do you mean it's as bad as lead?  Nope in fact it is orders of magnitude safer than lead.  Is it as bad as organophosphates?  Nope.  Still orders safer.
Quote
Their brains are still developing and anything that will interrupt during this process will likely have long term effects.
a) How do you know anything is interrupted?
b) How do you know that the slightest interruption (whatever that means) is going to have a long term effect?
Quote
Do you really feel comfortable injecting your baby with a substance that contains a neurotoxin ??
Absolutely.  In the same way that most parents feel comfortable letting their babies ingest a hepatotoxin at over one hundred thousand times the dosage of mercury they are getting in a vaccine.
Quote
Their vaccine isn't a single dose only.  Since birth to an age of 2 years old,  they get a whole bunch of them.
...and if by 2 years they have had more than two tablespoons of tuna at any one time.  They have been given more mercury than all of them put together.
Quote
Dose after dose after dose of vaccines that have mercury contents is simply flat out dangerous and irresponsible.
Nope.
Quote
There is no such thing as a safe level of mercury. Any doctor or scientist who tell you otherwise needs their license revoked !!
a) Scientists don't have a licence.
b) There is a dosage of mercury for which there exists no meaningful body of evidence which correlates it to any known illness.
c) In fact there have been studies on blood mercury levels in children who had likely ingested mercury from fish (from 12 months to 7 years) and there was actually an slight IQ increase (probably not due to the mercury).  The average blood level was slightly higher than that of a vaccine. Hence your idea that even one molecule of Hg is dangerous is probably wrong.

Please KNOW SOMETHING before you speak.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 11, 2014, 09:33:39 PM
Mercury Poisoning (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercury_poisoning)

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 11, 2014, 09:56:07 PM
Mercury Poisoning (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercury_poisoning)
200 mcg/L  is the level considered for poisoning according to the Wiki. 6 mcg/L is considered the high side of normal.  A vaccine has 0.5 mcg - even an infant which has 0.25L of blood would only have 2mcg/L of Hg for a period of time until it is excreted.  However usually the first vaccination is at 12 months.  Which means a blood volume of approximately 0.8L which means about 0.625 mcg/L.

So according to the Wiki article there's little chance of a vaccinated child of having much more than a normal level of mercury.  Any chance you're going to make an actual argument or are you just going to keep vomiting links?  Could you at least READ them before you post? :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on December 11, 2014, 10:06:48 PM
I stopped getting my children immunized years ago after looking at the what I considered to be the facts. First there seems to be a real issue with quality control and in Canada one batch down East contained tainted virus which everyone involved admitted would have literally infected the users with the disease. This was noted by Health Canada as well as many other agencies concerned with the poor quality of vaccine coming out of the good old USA.


There are also major concerns published by the European union with the toxicity of the "fillers" used in said vaccines and as some of you know they have partially embraced ultra-low level testing or bottom up testing as some call it. This is where a substance is considered safe at the "safe" level however at very much lower levels measured in parts per billion it can and has proven to be toxic to the human body. This work was noted by an American journalist I believe and it is a big problem because it means our version of WHIMIS or safe exposure levels is completely wrong. It means we need to re-test every single substance known to man and nobody wants to go there for obvious reasons.


We also have actual data which is surprisingly rare concerning the actual number of people who are effected or die from being immunized. In many cases the data is withheld or inaccurate as noted by researchers and journalists. At other times it was noted that many countries do not even track the side effects concerning immunizations. What I can tell you is that the Canadian agencies seem to take this matter seriously as I was involved with reporting a possible side effect from an immunization concerning someone I know.


The numbers suggest in some area's which may relate to specific batches the immunizations have caused major side effects relating to death and or permanent damage. The numbers are not good and may in some cases may exceed 5%. One must also consider that the World Health Organization declared polio eradicated from the Earth over a decade ago. That is there are no cases of polio, now if it does not exist then why would anyone put themselves at risk to get immunized?. Why we may as well get immunized against fairies and unicorns if this is the case.


I researched the science journals coming out of Europe which I believe are much less bias than those from the North America. As well their idea of "health care" and the "quality" standards of what we put in our bodies is light years ahead of North America. For instance in new homes the standard for make up air (fresh air) in Europe is 100% while in Canada/USA it is only 5%. It is no wonder people are getting sick because they spend most of their time indoors breathing air polluted with household chemicals. All of my houses have systems designed by me with at minimum 100% make up air 80% of the time as a rule.


I have no problem with vaccines because they are a proven technology however we are not talking about there effectiveness we are talking about the toxic fillers used and the quality of the materials used in the vaccines. It is simply a sign of the times where psychotic people place profit margins ahead of quality and safety.


I am an Engineer and my wife a registered nurse and we decided the tangible risks are simply too great. It's actually kind of funny that I had a run in with a health nurse not long ago and found her completely ignorant to the actual facts concerning immunizations, I mean my children were more informed than she was which is again a sign of the times. I made her look stupid because she was and I have no problem with that, you see I know many people personally who actually work in the health care industry (doctors and nurses) and believe me it is nothing like what you are told. The level of complete and utter incompetency is mind boggling and a hospital is most definitely the last place on earth you want to find yourself in my opinion.


So we must decide for ourselves and make informed choices, the science journals from anywhere but North America are a good place to start because in my opinion our system is tainted and biased. You need to talk with real people in the system who know the facts concerning the levels of risk involved.


AC

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Madeo on December 11, 2014, 10:41:08 PM
It takes reliable evidence.  Where is yours?


Reliable evidence?  Ingest some mercury for me and we'll find out.  I'll record the data.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 11, 2014, 10:51:46 PM
First there seems to be a real issue with quality control and in Canada one batch down East contained tainted virus which everyone involved admitted would have literally infected the users with the disease.
Cite please.  Also how does one incident mean "a real problem"?
Quote
however at very much lower levels measured in parts per billion it can and has proven to be toxic to the human body.
Please cite a medical journal.
Quote
We also have actual data which is surprisingly rare concerning the actual number of people who are effected or die from being immunized.
Which data?  How is it compiled.  How is COD determined?
Quote
The numbers suggest in some area's which may relate to specific batches the immunizations have caused major side effects relating to death and or permanent damage. The numbers are not good and may in some cases may exceed 5%.
Way too much waffling.  Exactly what is the bound and exactly where is this data from?  Please be specific.
Quote
One must also consider that the World Health Organization declared polio eradicated from the Earth over a decade ago.
Wrong.  Polio still exists in eight countries in 2014.  We don't restrict travel and since polio has no cure and can have severe outcomes.  The rational thing to do is immunize.
It is on the list to be phased out though.

Quote
I researched the science journals coming out of Europe
Doubtful
Quote
For instance in new homes the standard for make up air (fresh air) in Europe is 100% while in Canada/USA it is only 5%.
This seems to be a made up statistic.
Quote
It is no wonder people are getting sick because they spend most of their time indoors breathing air polluted with household chemicals.
Life expectancy in Canada is higher than in most European countries.  Despite massive amounts of "fresh air" (whatever that means) people in Bulgaria, Ukraine, Kosovo, Moldova, Serbia, Macedonia, Montenegro will all die about 8 years before I will.

Quote
I am an Engineer and my wife a registered nurse and we decided the tangible risks are simply too great.
Please provide a full risk breakdown.  Give each researched factor and it's probability of harm.  Please reference a body of medical data and....
of course you didn't do this...any of this but somehow you believe that the "risk are simply too great".  Even though you didn't actually figure them out.

Quote
The level of complete and utter incompetency is mind boggling and a hospital is most definitely the last place on earth you want to find yourself in my opinion.
Please provide statistics.
Quote
So we must decide for ourselves and make informed choices
Seems like the opposite of what you did.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 11, 2014, 11:01:38 PM
Hospitals are full of sick people.  Who wants to be around that?  Even most hospitals recognize that the shorter the stay the lower the risks of infections such as from staph.

5% serious injury or death from vaccinations is preposterous.  You can do your own ad-hoc survey of your neighbors who have had their children vaccinated to test that number.

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 11, 2014, 11:02:58 PM
Ingest some mercury for me and we'll find out.
As I said, over 700 children of all ages with elevated levels of mercury in their blood - higher than what they get vaccinated with were examined.   They showed no sign of neurological problems (and a slight increase of IQ). http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23971942
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 11, 2014, 11:04:14 PM

Reliable evidence?  Ingest some mercury for me and we'll find out.  I'll record the data.
So that's a big no on reliable data.  You're repeating FUD.  In the meantime you've been ingesting mercury your entire life.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MileHigh on December 11, 2014, 11:17:34 PM
This whole argument is preposterous and ultimately ends up having the potential to hurt way way more people that it "protects."  It must be infuriating for medial professionals to deal with this.

Mercury = Bad.  Vaccines have mercury.  Therefore vaccines = Bad.

That is foolish bovine logic.  A very small trace amount of a compound of mercury will not kill you or harm you.  We sat around camp fires for hundreds of thousands of years with "smoke with toxic compounds in it" blowing in our faces and never gave it a second thought.  The metabolic function of your body produces "toxic waste products" consisting of "harmful chemicals" every second of every day and yet we live - it's 100% natural.  The body has systems for these things.

Here is a good analogy for the whackadoo anti-vaccine crowd to ponder:  Peanut butter has a certain amount of ground-up insect parts in it.  Some insects have toxic chemicals that form part of their overall make up.  For example, some insects have poison glands for their stingers.  Therefore peanut butter has trace amounts of toxic compounds in it from insect parts.  DON'T EAT PEANUT BUTTER IT CONTAINS POISON!!!
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: ramset on December 11, 2014, 11:42:58 PM
Mh
yes truly Putrid indeed ,when Google search and cut and paste are perceived as a resource worthy
of inclusion in research that is still ongoing  ,and Men void of any true personal experience in this research perceive themselves the  Urim and  Thummim.





 whacky just doesn't begin to explain this one....


Good bye fellahs



Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 12, 2014, 01:44:54 AM
Not that my opinions are needed here, you guys are handling things nicely...but I would like to raise a few indisputable points.

Chemicals do not belong in the human body.

If they did, we would have receptors for it...like we have for the healing herb cannabis.

And NOBODY but NOBODY, knows exactly what is going on inside it...because there is no money in finding out.

The money is in fuck!ing it up...and to make money constantly by peddling bogus treatment protocols.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 12, 2014, 02:01:38 AM
Quote from: allcanadian
...
So we must decide for ourselves and make informed choices, the science journals from anywhere but North America are a good place to start because in my opinion our system is tainted and biased. You need to talk with real people in the system who know the facts concerning the levels of risk involved.

That is an excellent summation AC.

The CDC and the FDA, as well as the U.S. Congress
are in the business of avoiding (evading) liability
as a consequence of their decisions which often
have very negative impacts upon the health of the
People.

Unfortunately, many who support their AGENDA simply
have no idea of the depth of deception which is routinely
employed in the performance of their 'duties.'

Those who are placed at the top levels of any organization
in today's World are very carefully vetted to assure their
devotion to the Will of the Master.  The People be damned.
 
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on December 12, 2014, 02:01:44 AM
@MH
Quote
This whole argument is preposterous and ultimately ends up having the potential to hurt way way more people that it "protects."  It must be infuriating for medial professionals to deal with this.


You mean the medial professionals who have a vested interests in the pharmaceutical industry?. The people who get perks such as seminars in exotic locations all expenses paid. Oh yes Milehigh I believe you and all of them are as pure at heart as virgin snow. Not unlike the doctor who mis-diagnosed literally hundreds of patients with cancer for no other reason that to sell very expensive chemotherapy drugs to them... shall I send you the link?.


Being a huge fan of psychology I would ask who has a vested interest and what motivates them?. Why if I had a vested interest I would hire every retired or unemployed shmuck who could hold a conversation to represent my interests for minimum wage. I would say scour the net and cast reasonable doubt on my interests but appear open minded and reasonable. Then we will create our own forums and web sites and fake reviews the subject. Like Mary from Montana--" I agree MH and my family has been vaccinated all our lives and never had an issue", or John from Timbucktu-- " It's all nonsense and we should have forced vaccinations for our children's sake". Then we could hire some psychopath like the doctor misdiagnosing his patients for profit to crease false data. Human nature can be a real bitch can't it.


The fact of the matter is that anyone with a vested interest in any way should be discounted and only credible independent third party science taken into consideration. Which pretty much discounts all of the good old USA and most of Canada because almost everyone has a vested interest in selling drugs.


Why I can now buy and receive a flu vaccination from every corner pharmacy here in Canada given by incompetent self-promoting half-wits with no real medical training which is a new development. I imagine all this talk of vaccines doing harm must have cut into someone's profit margins because apparently they are selling vaccines like cough syrup now... go figure.


I would suggest everyone here read a good book on psychology so you understand the basics of what motivates people and how to profile a persons personality... why they say what they do and what motivates them personally and how this relates to us and the facts.


Personally I love your posts MH because your like the poster boy of conformity and your psychology is just awesome , I mean that sincerely, you my friend are just simply amazing in my opinion.


AC







Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 12, 2014, 02:09:17 AM
Boy, lots of positive and negative flux in that post...well done.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 12, 2014, 02:27:49 AM
Chemicals do not belong in the human body.
Either you are the most amazing troll and I love you...or this quite clearly illustrates the deficiency in all of your educations.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 12, 2014, 02:42:37 AM
Not unlike the doctor who mis-diagnosed literally hundreds of patients with cancer for no other reason that to sell very expensive chemotherapy drugs to them... shall I send you the link?.
Please do.
Quote
Being a huge fan of psychology I would ask who has a vested interest and what motivates them?
Psychology isn't just asking qui bono.

Quote
I can now buy and receive a flu vaccination from every corner pharmacy here in Canada
You're kind of casting doubt on your being a Canadian.  Ten out of thirteen provinces support universal vaccination.  Which means it free to almost everyone.  The hold outs are BC, QC and NB and they still provide free shots to just about everyone in a risk group.  In those places it's also common for workplaces to provide the shot for free (as it was in ON before universal vaccination).

Quote
given by incompetent self-promoting half-wits with no real medical training
Given by pharmacists or Nurses.  There are various programs and requirements to allow pharms to administer a limited number of IM vaccines.

It would be nice if your posts contained some accurate information.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on December 12, 2014, 02:49:55 AM
@Cap-Z-ro
It is a time of the spirit of giving and if we cannot laugh at the absurdity of what we do then we are lost. Personally I find myself as comical if not more so than most others, what we do, the way we think, how we say one thing then do another... the human experience. Those eccentricities we hide, hidden motivations I mean we really are a sight to behold aren't we, lol.


The best thing I ever did was to really understand myself so that I might understand you, not what you appear to be or would have me believe but you.


AC
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 12, 2014, 03:13:08 AM
Either you are the most amazing troll and I love you...or this quite clearly illustrates the deficiency in all of your educations.



I find I don't need a shower afterward if I direct my comments top the readership...


Those who lie to me once, are thereafter recognized as liars.

Those who lie in order to convince me vaccinations are not toxic, are thereafter recognized as treacherous liars.

Life is much less complicated that way.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 12, 2014, 03:16:36 AM
I find I don't need a shower afterward if I direct my comments top the readership...
I find raspberries particularly filling in Spain.  Which makes about as much sense as what you just said.
Quote
Those who lie in order to convince me vaccinations are not toxic, are thereafter recognized as treacherous liars.
Ever notice how I can show you exactly where you're wrong about something...and you can only make vague statements?

If I've lied somewhere please point it out.  I'm more than happy to be corrected.  You don't seem to share that sentiment.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 12, 2014, 03:28:23 AM
Supporters of liars become liars by proxy, and shall receive all privileges and recognition accorded thereto.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on December 12, 2014, 03:36:00 AM
@Sarkeinzen


You need a new name which is easier to spell, lol.
I cannot prove anything to anyone that they are not willing to prove for themselves no more than any facts could persuade anyone to believe something they cannot.


Cite what, prove what?, you want some contrivance to disprove by some obscure logic my position to gain ground but there are no real facts on your part nor mine in regards to either of us only opinions. I cite that we do not know, I proclaim we can only use our best judgement but be wary of what motivates a person to do the things they do simply because what they do must have at it's root in some kind of motivation.


Accurate information?...really?. Based on what exactly?. The scientist whereby a recent study by actual scientists determined that 47% have or have know someone who has falsified their data in regards to their own best interests... that information?...really? .Ok let's suppose one half have not falsified their data now who exactly would you have me believe regarding the fact I do not know whom has "fibbed" and whom has not when obviously few if any outside that context would actually know the difference?.


Can you spell the word "Speculation"?, I understand you have an opinion but I have to ask have you actually researched the people who claim one thing or another and where their motivations come from?. Do they have a vested interest which may represent a conflict of interest or do they not?.


As well you may have to define the exact meaning of the word free for me, do you mean free to me despite the fact I have in fact paid for the material and service in regard to the taxes I have paid to our government or the fact at the moment I did not have to physically take money out of my wallet and give it to someone?. I would hope you understand that I have in fact paid for the service regardless of whether I received the service or not in the form of taxes... so where does this free part come into play exactly?.


You are trying to argue your point on a foundation of quicksand and I would hope you can do better in the future. I mean I have had four glasses of Merlot and I have as much issue with tearing your logic apart as I do with farting at this point, I would expect more.


AC



Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 12, 2014, 03:54:09 AM
I cannot prove anything to anyone
Nobody is asking for proof.
Quote
Cite what
Dude I've asked you to cite at least a half-dozen things you've claimed.  Go back and read.
Quote
there are no real facts on your part nor mine in regards to either of us only opinions.
Not true.  I've actually cited one study and anything I haven't cited I could easily pull up.  You have but to ask (specifically).
Quote
I cite that we do not know
Don't know what?  That vaccines are very safe?  Evidence strongly suggests that they are.
Quote
Accurate information?...really?. Based on what exactly?. The scientist whereby a recent study by actual scientists determined that 47% have or have know someone who has falsified their data in regards to their own best interests... that information?
Cite?  Whoops.  You don't actually provide evidence do you.
Quote
Do you mean free to me despite the fact I have in fact paid for the material and service in regard to the taxes
Dude you said that you could go into a drug store and BUY a flu vaccine.  However you can't - just about anywhere in Canada.  Now you seem to be backpedaling and trying to claim that when you said "walk into a store and buy" you meant "paid taxes".  So you seem like you are lying about living in Canada.
Quote
I have as much issue with tearing your logic apart
Don't worry.  You won't be doing any of that. :)
Quote
I would expect more.
Dude I expect people to be able to form cogent sentences.  You appear to be deficient in this regard.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 12, 2014, 04:01:41 AM
Supporters of liars become liars by proxy, and shall receive all privileges and recognition accorded thereto.
So wait.  Did I lie? or am I supporting someone who's lying?  If I'm allegedly supporting someone who's lying why won't you say who or where or how you know?

Why wouldn't you provide me the opportunity to correct myself?  Or yourself.  After all it's possible that you are utterly wrong.  Right? Or did you become infallible at some point?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 12, 2014, 04:25:38 AM
So wait.  Did I lie? or am I supporting someone who's lying?  If I'm allegedly supporting someone who's lying why won't you say who or where or how you know?

Why wouldn't you provide me the opportunity to correct myself?  Or yourself.  After all it's possible that you are utterly wrong.  Right? Or did you become infallible at some point?



Another great quote:

" Don't know what?  That vaccines are very safe?  Evidence strongly suggests that they are."



Lets call a Mulligan on the evidence the so called CDC "scientists" hid, which showed their "very safe" vaccines were causing autism.

I believe that hiding evidence wood qualify as a lie of commission.

And, it naturally follows that those who supports this lie...

Regards...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 12, 2014, 04:26:13 AM
.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Madeo on December 12, 2014, 04:44:18 AM
I was under the impression that the Overunity forum was a collection of open minded individuals who are interested in alternative energy and alternative health discussions. It is quite surprising that there are people here who strongly defends the use of mercury in human bodies especially babies. I simply cannot fathom why ANY levels of mercury is safe which one of the most potent neurotoxin.  On who's standards?  FDA, Pharma companies, AMA, other gov't agencies?  I think we all understand that these groups are corrupt. They are not interested in your health. They are interested in money. There is a lot of money in managing diseases, but hardly any for curing it. The sicker you are, the more money they can suck out of you and your family.   So why should I trust their statistics, rigged research, and opinions ?





Here are simple questions:


What is the safe level of mercury in the body ?
What is the safe level of lead in the body?
what is the safe level of plastic chemicals in the body?
what is the safe level of monosodium glutamate in the body?
what is the safe level of tobacco chemicals in the body?
What is the safe level of alcohol in the body?
What is the safe level of preservatives in the food that I cannot even pronounce?


One simple answer :  ZERO.  If it was safe, then the body would have produced it or has receptors specifically for them in the first place.



Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on December 12, 2014, 04:54:10 AM
@Sark
Quote
Dude you said that you could go into a drug store and BUY a flu vaccine.  However you can't - just about anywhere in Canada.  Now you seem to be backpedaling and trying to claim that when you said "walk into a store and buy" you meant "paid taxes".  So you seem like you are lying about living in Canada.


Well where I live in Southern Alberta, Canada just about every drug store has a sign that basically states-- flu shot available here...as in here... this place...the place you are now looking at. Now what do you suppose that means?. I could be idiotic or otherwise predisposed but the fact that my wife is an registered nurse and in fact she says yes you can get a flu shot for $30 plus change would have me believe you are not quite with us. Which does not surprise me because many are not quite with us in the here and now...as in right now and here, vice vera.


Maybe this may remind you--
http://www1.shoppersdrugmart.ca/en/health-and-pharmacy/health/this-year-get-your-flu-shot-at-shoppers-drug-mart/40717/2?lang=en%3FCategory%3DHealth (http://www1.shoppersdrugmart.ca/en/health-and-pharmacy/health/this-year-get-your-flu-shot-at-shoppers-drug-mart/40717/2?lang=en%3FCategory%3DHealth)


http://www.rexall.ca/services/flu-shot (http://www.rexall.ca/services/flu-shot)


http://www.walmart.ca/en/flu-shot-clinics (http://www.walmart.ca/en/flu-shot-clinics)


Uhm which part of this do you not understand?, Where exactly are you from?, I mean which planet and the precise location if you will?. Which part of anytime, any day, no appointment necessary do you you not understand?.


Which part of--
 For protection and convenience, you can get your flu shot at more than 280 Walmart Pharmacy locations across Canada. We can help you find the nearest Walmart Pharmacy flu shot clinic locations and hours of operation--

--Do you not understand?,  or do you have mental issue we should need to be concerned about?. I mean...Dude... if your going to spout BS then at least try to make it believable in some remotely credible way because this is just embarrassing. I don't really want to do this anymore than you do so let's try to keep it within the realm of this planet...earth if we could.


As i said this was not happening in the last few years to my knowledge, this is new and quite disturbing that there are literally no checks and balances in this process. Why we may as well have a cattle shute and just run the stupid bastards through that which would be much more cost effective.


AC
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 12, 2014, 05:02:36 AM
Lets call a Mulligan on the evidence the so called CDC "scientists" hid, which showed their "very safe" vaccines were causing autism.
Wrong.  There is no actual data which shows what you're talking about.   What you're indirectly referencing (indirectly - because you have never actually read this study) was Hooker's reanalysis of DeStefano et al.  Hooker is not a epidemiologist or a bio-statistician he's a biochemist.   Which is why he botched the analysis so badly.  He used Pearson's chi-squared test to determine a positive correlation between age/ethnicity groups and autism.     The problem is that doesn't account for confounders and is more likely to give false positive on small samples.  Which is exactly what he was working with.  When you use a logistic regression - which is what you should use in that case and is what DeStefano used - the correlation disappears.
Quote
I believe that hiding evidence wood qualify as a lie of commission.
So who's lying again?  It's not the numbers.  They say no correlation.   So if Thompson is disagreeing with the research doesn't that make him at least confused if not actually lying.
Quote
And, it naturally follows that those who supports this lie...
So you support Thompson and the implication is that Thompson is wrong (according to the data).  Doesn't that make you supporting someone who's at least confused if not lying?

Interesting fact if you believe that Hooker's analysis is correct.  You realize that you absolutely have to believe that the MMR is completely and totally safe for everyone else.  Otherwise you're just cherry picking your data. Which is kind of like lying - just to yourself but as you are the easiest person to fool... :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 12, 2014, 05:13:07 AM
Well where I live in Southern Alberta, Canada just about every drug store has a sign that basically states-- flu shot available here....she says yes you can get a flu shot for $30 plus change
AB has universal vaccination.  Free to everyone 6mo and older.  You sure you live there?  None of your links say $30.

Quote
Which part of anytime, any day, no appointment necessary do you you not understand?.
You said you could GO AND BUY ONE.  Which you can't.  Not really.  I suppose you could throw $30 at the person giving you the injection and hope they don't give it back or something.  *sigh* just admit you were wrong.  Sure you can walk into a drug store and get vaccinated but there's really nothing to buy.

Quote
As i stated this was not happening in the last few years to my knowledge, this is new and quite disturbing that there are literally no checks and balances in this process.
Wrong.  The standards for running a flu clinic do vary from province to province but it's a mis-characterization to say there are no standards.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on December 12, 2014, 05:21:38 AM

from our friends at Walmart Canada
FAQs
1. What types of immunizations are offered?Walmart Pharmacy offers a range of CDC recommended immunizations for seniors and adults.2. Are Walmart Pharmacists trained to give immunizations?Walmart certified pharmacists have completed an immunization training program endorsed by the CDC or the Accreditation Council for Pharmacy Education.3. Who should get a flu shot?The CDC recommends that everyone over 6 months be vaccinated, with some exceptions; individuals with certain medical conditions should not get vaccinated. Please note that Walmart does not administer flu shots to children as young as 6 months. Learn more at www.cdc.gov (http://www.cdc.gov/)
4. Do you offer school immunizations?Walmart provides immunizations to children age 8 and up, if allowed under state law and CDC recommendations.5. Do you accept insurance for immunizations?We do accept some insurance plans; please check with a Walmart Pharmacist.6. What forms of payment are accepted for immunizations?We accept some forms of insurance, cash, check, Walmart credit card, Visa, Mastercard, American Express and Discover card.




Awesome , I'm going to take a two hour immunization course then rig up an Arduino automated self-immunizing cattle shute and run 100 of those stupid bastards through per hour. I mean why not, it is for the greater good isn't it, it is the most cost effective solution isn't it?. I will rig up a debit machine at the entrance and down the fing shute you go, cattle one and all. LOL be careful what you wish for gentlemen you may just get it.AC




Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 12, 2014, 05:33:49 AM
Awesome , I'm going to take a two hour immunization course
The ACPE varies from province to province.  In AB it's about 16 CEU's but again knowing this involves thinking and checking your facts and why would you start doing that now?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 12, 2014, 05:59:29 AM
Quote from: sarkeizen
...In AB...

Where on Earth is AB?  Or, more specifically, can you
provide the precise Legal Definition of AB?

We use the same sort of Legal Fiction Abbreviations in
the U.S. and, sadly, very few understand what they
represent and where they are 'located.'

Baffle us please with more of your astounding 'knowledge.'
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 12, 2014, 06:09:54 AM
I woke up in the middle of an autism epidemic one day.

Later on so called scientists are accused of hiding evidence their vaccines were the cause...no immediate denials...except for later after the shock of exposure wore off.

Then I remembered that last week when so called scientists were accused of hiding 'global warming' evidence...no immediate denials then either...except for later after the shock of exposure wore off.

Then it occurred to me that these are the same people putting poison in my drinking water chemtrails in the sky and poison in my food products.

Then I asked myself...wood they lie to me ?

Then I thought...why should that surprise me ?

After all, these people we're talking about are murderous satan worshiping pedophiles.

Please let me know when all the lying has stopped.


Some choose to get their magnifying glass out to inspect the black spot...while i choose to stand back and observe the entire leopard.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 12, 2014, 06:34:58 AM
Where on Earth is AB?
Alberta, Canada - where Allcanadian claims to be from.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 12, 2014, 06:36:19 AM
Alberta, Canada - where Allcanadian claims to be from.
By Lake Louise I think you've got it!
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 12, 2014, 06:39:03 AM
Which is right next to Mount Gonnatakeapeek.

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 12, 2014, 06:43:51 AM
I woke up in the middle of an autism epidemic one day.
I'm not sure if you have woken up yet.  Excuse me if I don't hold my breath waiting.
Quote
Later on so called scientists are accused of hiding evidence their vaccines were the cause
Cite?  Or are you still thinking about Hooker's reanalysis.   I mean if you want to buy statistical analysis from someone who doesn't actually understand it be my guest.  Hooker is really the only one in that drama who can be called a "so called scientist".  As he is making a demonstrably incorrect claim OUTSIDE HIS FIELD.  Seriously, would you ask a plumber to do regression analysis?  Why ask a biochemist?
Quote
After all, these people we're talking about are murderous satan worshiping pedophiles.
Ok, now you are just making me love you.  Since this kind of talk couldn't come from anyone other than a troll.
Quote
Some choose to get their magnifying glass out to inspect the black spot...while i choose to stand back and observe the entire leopard.
Right now all you've done is imply that there was a CDC cover up.  Based on a study you never read and even if you did you wouldn't understand.  Where is the rest of the alleged leopard?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 12, 2014, 07:18:57 AM
I guess we can't delete the part about the people putting poison in my drinking water chemtrails in the sky and poison in my food products.


But lts move on, its a much easier task to try to dismiss this lone whistle blower...but not so easy when you hit double digits, like in the examples cited above...just ask Bill Cosby.

I mean why hide data in the first place, if everything is on the up and up ?

That reminds me, I better go hide yesterdays newspaper.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 12, 2014, 07:24:39 AM
but not so easy when you hit double digits, like in the examples cited above.
Exactly what examples?  The only example about vaccines you've produced is one that is clearly refuted.
Quote
I mean why hide data in the first place, if everything is on the up and up ?
What data do you think has been hidden?  Any reason you can't just clearly make your argument?  Is it really that easy to destroy that you need to hide it from me?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 12, 2014, 08:10:43 AM
Quote from: sarkeizen
Alberta, Canada - where Allcanadian claims to be from.

That, of course, is the kneejerk response you've obviously
been 'programmed' to believe and to deliver.

There is, however, a LEGAL DEFINITION of 'AB' which specifies
what IT is and where IT is located.  Are you familiar with
Legal Fictions?

With just a bit of research effort you should be able to discover
some clues.  The detailed and truthful LEGAL DEFINITION may
take much more effort unless you have a suitable resource at
your disposal.

It goes along with the deceptions which are so much a part of
the 'governments' of this age.
 
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 12, 2014, 03:05:08 PM
Ever notice how the cabalists consistently avoid the fact that vaccinations are just one weapon used in the war against humanity ?

Focusing on the semantics and minutia are the main ways to avoid addressing the entire picture...its along the same lines as compartmentalization.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 12, 2014, 03:41:15 PM
Ever notice how the cabalists consistently avoid the fact that vaccinations are just one weapon used in the war against humanity ?
However you have yet to provide any credible evidence that it's a weapon.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 12, 2014, 03:52:22 PM
I was under the impression that the Overunity forum was a collection of open minded individuals who are interested in alternative energy and alternative health discussions.
I think it's more a community of narrow minded counter cultural zealotry. :)  You are a prime example of this.  I mean look at what you write.  Immensely arrogant, sweeping generalizations.  Entirely devoid of useful argument or evidence. :)  So no, you fail (miserably) the open-minded test.
Quote
It is quite surprising that there are people here who strongly defends the use of mercury in human bodies especially babies.
It's just a risk assessment.  So far Thiomersal is an exceptionally low risk.
Quote
I simply cannot fathom
Yes.  This is the problem.
Quote
What is the safe level of mercury in the body ?
Yawn.  Arbitrary standard of evidence.
Quote
One simple answer :  ZERO.  If it was safe, then the body would have produced it or has receptors specifically for them in the first place.
This is wrong in so many ways it's almost impressive.  Your body regularly creates chemicals which are lethal to it at particular dosages and you regularly ingest chemicals which your body can not biosynthesize.   Is there a particular reason you are as ignorant as you are?  Did you not go to school?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 12, 2014, 03:53:31 PM
That, of course, is the kneejerk response you've obviously been 'programmed' to believe and to deliver.
I confess I am part of those programmed to both use and understand provincial codes with reasonable accuracy.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on December 12, 2014, 05:03:17 PM
@Sark
Quote
Alberta, Canada - where Allcanadian claims to be from.


Yes, the land of oil and gas however I'm in Southern Alberta with miles of rolling prairie as far as the eye can see. As well we Albertan's are known for our independence which may come as no surprise. We are known as the world leaders of oil and gas extraction technologies and I know many people who travel around the world consulting. On a side note I know hundreds of people in the industry, many millionaires and most all have told me they would leave it in a heartbeat if they could make a living any other way. So it is not as if anyone wants to be there because it is a dirty unsustainable cut throat business and if the money wasn't there everyone told me they would leave and never look back which is interesting.


I understand I went a little overboard in my posts and a few glasses of wine may have influenced me,lol. I think we should be diligent and at the very least try to do a little research to properly weigh the risks. That is we should not be doing something just because other people are doing it or because we see an advertisement telling us we should do something.


I think most would agree we are being influenced by the media in the form of advertising on a scale which is unheard of in our history. I have no vested interest here, obviously, because I'm not the one telling someone to go out and buy something...just the opposite. As well Health care here may be free but we all know we always pay in one form or another. I pay my taxes and a large portion goes to the government, which then goes to the health care system which then goes to the drug corporations. So you see there is no free in it because my money still ends up in their pockets and I am paying for others vaccinations as well through my taxes.


In my opinion and using casual observations it would seem the least informed and unfortunately the least intelligent people at the lower income levels would seem to be the one's lining up to get vaccinated. Based on my personal observations and questions to family and friends as well as other persons I know.


Which raises a question in my mind, I know why I am here and it is to offer an alternative perspective to that of the media but I have to wonder why you are here?. I mean you seem to be suggesting that we should all go out and get vaccinated which would benefit the pharmaceutical industry while I am saying we should make informed choices. Which relates to the theme of my lasts posts concerning the motivations of people, why they are here and what they are saying...again just casual observations.


By the way why are you here if you don't mind me asking?.


AC
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 12, 2014, 06:53:48 PM
@Sark
I have no vested interest here, obviously, because I'm not the one telling someone to go out and buy something...just the opposite.
If you actually HAD read books on psychology or economics you'd recognize that you likely do have a vested interest: A vested interest in your current belief.
Quote
As well Health care here may be free but we all know we always pay in one form or another.
Irrelevant to every an all points at hand. :)  You still can't walk into a pharmacy and BUY a vaccine as you said you could.
Quote
In my opinion and using casual observations it would seem the least informed and unfortunately the least intelligent people at the lower income levels would seem to be the one's lining up to get vaccinated.
For an alleged engineer, your logic is insanely poor.  Your statement is:
a) Mindless bigotry. :)  You can't determine someones IQ by looking at them for the 4 min it takes to give them an IM of Fluarix.  You certainly can't gauge their level of information on a issue in that time.
b) Probably, in essence an inverse ad populum fallacy.
Quote
Based on my personal observations and questions to family and friends as well as other persons I know.
Wow you asked people for the AVERAGE IQ of people getting vaccinated and they were able to tell it to you with high accuracy?  Considering it takes the WAIS IV at least an hour to get a good estimate based on a very carefully chosen series of questions.  It's far far far far far far far far more likely that your observations and opinions of people you know are simply not nearly accurate enough to draw your conclusions.
Quote
I know why I am here
So you say...
Quote
I mean you seem to be suggesting that we should all go out and get vaccinated
No, I'm saying that virtually every assertion you've made against vaccines tend to fall into one of three categories.  a) Unfounded - you have cited nothing supporting your views.  b) ridiculous - 1 in 20 people who take some vaccines are seriously injured or killed?  c) show a real ignorance of math, biology and/or logic - like your "casually observing someone's IQ".  Personally I don't care if you get vaccinated or not.  However I do care if you want to come in here and promote nonsense.

Quote
I am saying we should make informed choices.
Not true, or that's not very much of what your saying. Your first two posts were FILLED with claim after ludicrous claim.  Spreading nonsense isn't telling people to make informed choices.  It's limiting them.

Quote
By the way why are you here if you don't mind me asking?.
I find it interesting how people like you and Capt-Z-ro and profitis work very hard to preserve your own ignorance.  It's pretty amazing really.  You go on about informed choice but can't actually defend your position and you clearly haven't done the kind of work necessary to reach some of the conclusions you claim.  All three of you spent far more time posturing than actually trying to clarify your position and none of you show much ability to criticize your own beliefs.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 12, 2014, 07:25:18 PM
However you have yet to provide any credible evidence that it's a weapon.

And once again, oh so conveniently, side stepping the part about the inbred cabal putting poison in drinking water, spraying toxic chemtrails in the sky and poison GMO's in food products.



Quote
It's just a risk assessment.  So far Thiomersal is an exceptionally low risk.

Well, now we're getting somewhere...we have an admission of risk.  An exceptionally low risk its claimed...by whom we do not know ??



Quote
However you have yet to provide any credible evidence that it's a weapon.


Again, who in the hell needs more evidence when you have the inbred cabal putting poison in drinking water, spraying toxic chemtrails in the sky and poison GMO's in food products, is it a stretch to conclude that we are the victims of bio-warfare ???


Quote
Your body regularly creates chemicals...

Now i suppose he's going to try to tell us that the form of citric acid that powers our immune system is the same as the chemical form of it which according to bio chemist Joe Hart, has the exact opposite effect.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 12, 2014, 07:52:45 PM
And once again, oh so conveniently, side stepping the part about the inbred cabal putting poison in drinking water, spraying toxic chemtrails in the sky and poison GMO's in food products.
I think those issues are sufficiently well covered in the Weekly World News.
Quote
Well, now we're getting somewhere...we have an admission of risk.
Saying "very safe" is the same as saying "low risk".
Quote
An exceptionally low risk its claimed...by whom we do not know ??
Already cited a study.
Quote
Again, who in the hell needs more evidence
So you're saying you don't need evidence actually indicating vaccine risk in order to conclude vaccine risk.  :)  Awwww you really are a troll.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 12, 2014, 08:40:42 PM
I think those issues are sufficiently well covered in the Weekly World News.

A source BTW, which is now actually closer to truth than mainstream copy.



Quote
Saying "very safe" is the same as saying "low risk".Already cited a study.

The CDC offer excellent "study's".



Quote
So you're saying you don't need evidence actually indicating vaccine risk in order to conclude vaccine risk.

Essentially, his logic is...

You are facing a psychopathic murderer with a six shooter...he's already shot at you 5 times, and the best strategy is to assume the last bullet is a blank, it will misfire, or the chamber is empty.

Somewhat like his head.


Quote
:)  Awwww you really are a troll.

I guess its a kind of compliment to be called a troll by a shill.


Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 12, 2014, 08:51:09 PM
A source BTW, which is now actually closer to truth than mainstream copy.
So you believe that they found a bat boy in a cave? http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--trUR7vu9--/18m49k0wv4iq4jpg.jpg
Quote
The CDC offer excellent "study's".
Ever thought of actually making an actual argument instead of vague statements?  Then supporting it?
Quote
I guess its a kind of compliment to be called a troll by a shill.
How could I possibly be a shill?  Seriously. 
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 12, 2014, 09:01:58 PM
So you believe that they found a bat boy in a cave? http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--trUR7vu9--/18m49k0wv4iq4jpg.jpgE (http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--trUR7vu9--/18m49k0wv4iq4jpg.jpgEver)


Folks, I think we have a live one here who believes the official 9/11 mainstream lie.



Quote
Ever thought of actually making an actual argument instead of vague statements?  Then supporting it?

I find evidential reality much more interesting and valid.


Quote
How could I possibly be a shill?  Seriously.

Seriously

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 12, 2014, 09:02:56 PM
Quote from: sarkeizen
...
...However I do care if you want to come in here and promote nonsense.

...Spreading nonsense isn't telling people to make informed choices.  It's limiting them.

...You go on about informed choice but can't actually defend your position and you clearly haven't done the kind of work necessary to reach some of the conclusions you claim.  All three of you spent far more time posturing than actually trying to clarify your position and none of you show much ability to criticize your own beliefs.

You work diligently to promote the perception
that you come from a position of 'higher
knowledge' or 'superior understanding.'  This is
a classic technique of those who specialize in
disinformation or support of an AGENDA which
itself is deceptive.

These techniques have been advanced in a number
of publications including The Soviet Art of Psycho-Politics.

The new Soviet, which has replaced the Soviet Union
upon the World stage, has become The West.  Watch in
amazement as it trance-forms itself with increasing
rapidity into the brutal instrument of tyranny and subjugation
while working to dominate the entire planet with its power.

What George Orwell predicted has come to pass, as he was
certain that it would.

Vaccinations have gradually become a tool of the
self-imagined Elite which are being used to incrementally
accomplish their malevolent PLAN.

No, there will not be found any 'credible' evidence of this
PLAN in any of the Mainstream Media outlets as their
principal function is to nullify Truth.

We're living in a most interesting and critical time.  It is
also interesting to observe how those who have been
'recruited' to defend the 'status quo' go about their
'business.'

Does anyone remember the pre-"AB" abbreviation for the
Province of Alberta?  Does anyone wonder why it has been
'phased out' and supplanted by the new "AB" jurisdiction?

The PLAN is a very clever one and relies upon FICTION to
achieve its aims.
 
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 12, 2014, 09:19:40 PM
Folks, I think we have a live one here who believes the official 9/11 mainstream lie.
So you do believe in Bat Boy?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 12, 2014, 09:29:18 PM
You work diligently
Never even once.
Quote
that you come from a position of 'higher knowledge' or 'superior understanding.'
I do appear to know more than many of the farmers here at least about a few things.
Quote
This is a classic technique of
Actually I think calling something a "classic technique" as a classic technique of disinformation.  It implies some body of evidence without providing any.
Quote
Vaccinations have gradually become a tool of the self-imagined Elite which are being used to incrementally accomplish their malevolent PLAN.
Yes our plan to keep people from being harmed by disease.
Quote
No, there will not be found any 'credible' evidence of this PLAN in any of the Mainstream Media outlets.
...and this lack of presence will of course convince you further of a great hidden plan.  Because only great hidden plans can not be glimpsed.
Quote
interesting to observe how those who have been 'recruited' to defend the 'status quo'
Is "recruited" in quotes for some reason?  Was I actually recruited or do you mean something else.
Quote
Does anyone remember the pre-"AB" abbreviation for the Province of Alberta?
IIRC it was Alta. Ontario was Ont.
Quote
Does anyone wonder why it has been 'phased out' and supplanted by the new "AB" jurisdiction?
I hear that the bat people are behind it.
Quote
The PLAN is a very clever one and relies upon FICTION toachieve its aims.
No it depends on bats!
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 12, 2014, 10:05:08 PM
Is it then no small coincidence that the USA was attacked by Al Qaida after release of "Bat Man" movies?  Is it no small coincidence that Bat Man prowls "Gotham City" a transparent representation of New York City?  Is it no small coincidence that bats can transmit rabies a disease treated with vaccinations?  Is the master "PLAN" dependent on raising bats in secret underground lairs of the ruling elite?  Is it no small coincidence that a dying boy was paraded about San Francisco as the "Bat Boy"?  Was that some psychological operation by the ruling elite to get an unwitting public to embrace bats, rabies, and ultimately vaccines that ensure certain death after a gestation period of just 80 to 100 years?  Are anti-psychotic drugs under-prescribed?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MileHigh on December 12, 2014, 10:45:23 PM
I have a dedicated bat keeper in my underground megacomplex.  A special hidden bat-chimney was built all the way to the surface to facilitate the bat access.  It's totally bat-ass!
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 12, 2014, 11:47:50 PM
So you do believe in Bat Boy?


A fine example of the classic, and all too common troll dodge.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on December 13, 2014, 12:18:51 AM
@Sark
Quote
I find it interesting how people like you and Capt-Z-ro and profitis work very hard to preserve your own ignorance.  It's pretty amazing really.  You go on about informed choice but can't actually defend your position and you clearly haven't done the kind of work necessary to reach some of the conclusions you claim.  All three of you spent far more time posturing than actually trying to clarify your position and none of you show much ability to criticize your own beliefs.


Personally I think your a young American tech/nerd who gets off on this kind of psychotic shit but that's just my opinion.
To each his own I guess...have fun.


AC
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 13, 2014, 12:36:20 AM
Quote from: sarkeizen
...Yes our plan to keep people from being harmed by disease...

Of course.  How clever! ;)

Unfortunately, such a benevolent course would deprive the
'Health Care Industry' of virtually all of its 'profits.'  A healthy,
unsickly population would have no need to spend a fortune
on doctor visits, prescriptions, treatment regimens or
'health care maintenance.' :'(

Quote from: AllCanadian's response to sarkeizen
Personally I think your a young American tech/nerd who gets off on this kind of psychotic shit but that's just my opinion.
To each his own I guess...have fun.

Brilliant AC!  You've nailed it!
 
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 13, 2014, 12:58:22 AM
Quote from: sarkeizen
Is "recruited" in quotes for some reason?  Was I actually recruited or do you mean something else.

Whether you have been recruited and are under the
influence of a 'controller' or you are acting independently
in sympathy with your love of money and the love of
this World is not yet known.  It is relatively unimportant
at this stage.  You'll probably let slip the 'relationship'
as your work at this forum progresses.

Quote
IIRC it was Alta. Ontario was Ont.

Aye, that is correct.

Alberta (abbreviated Alta.) is legally a different
jurisdiction than AB.  Through the Magick of the
CITY OF LONDON Parish Fictions any location on
the face of the Earth can be LEGALLY brought
into the CITY OF LONDON (The One Mile Square.)
Of course, it does rely upon the 'voluntary cooperation'
of the ENTITY and its INHABITANTS (SUBJECTS.)

The deceptions of today have very old roots.
Babylon has been resurrected as Babylon the Great.
Great Britain and The Crown.  Naturally, in keeping with
the PLAN of deception, neither of those are in reality what
the People have been led to believe they are.

Vaccinations are deception;  honest early medical works
which have been corrupted to implement the PLAN.

By their Fruits you will know them.   Unless, of course, one
has been blinded by persuasive propaganda.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 13, 2014, 02:30:57 AM
Personally I think your a young American tech/nerd who gets off on this kind of psychotic shit but that's just my opinion.
Dude.  It's simple - if you can actually argue your point that vaccine risks significantly outweigh the benefits.  Then make it.  I'm happy to have my mind changed.  However you (and just about everyone else) does EVERYTHING BUT that.  You dance about, cast aspersions on peoples character and motivations but that's all you have.  Intellectually you are an empty box.  Go pretend you know something about something else.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 13, 2014, 02:35:57 AM
A fine example of the classic, and all too common troll dodge.
I'm the one talking about vaccines.  You're the one who can't.  If you have an argument I'd love to hear it.  If you have something that is STRONG evidence.  Kudos.  If you're just going to stroke your ego because you're butthurt.  Perhaps that's better done in the privacy of your own home.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 13, 2014, 02:49:35 AM
Whether you have been recruited and are under the influence of a 'controller' or you are acting independently
in sympathy with your love of money and the love of this World is not yet known.  It is relatively unimportant
at this stage.  You'll probably let slip the 'relationship' as your work at this forum progresses.
I think my controller works at Burger King.  Is that normal?  I was there once ordering some chicken fries and the guy at the register asked if he could eat with me.  I found this odd but since I had nothing else to do I decided to go with it.  I found a seat, he got someone to take over his station and joined me.  He started talking to me about the New World Order and how Amway was the true church of MLM productization but I couldn't get over the fact that during his whole sermon he was eating my fries.  He went on to connect the dots all the way from this one true church to the ancient scrolls found in Qumran in 1990. I left that night with much to think about...hungry for knowledge of this new age to come but also because the asshole had eaten my fries.

Quote
Vaccinations are deception;  honest early medical work which have been corrupted to implement the PLAN.
Sorry you're wrong as an inductee of the New World Order I know far more about the PLAN than you do.  The fact is that vaccinations are the path to truth, righteousness and mind-blowing intercourse .   
Quote
By their Fruits you will know them.
...and we've seen the fruits of the unvaccinated and the anti-vaccinated and they are filled with disease.  We know from Revelation 15 the the last angel releases plagues on the earth and the righteous are saved.  Of course this is a direct comparison to vaccination.

(It is incredibly easy to write Overunity style nonsense - is OU just trolling the saner parts of the internet?)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 13, 2014, 03:01:42 AM
A cuppla forum dingos have been observed circling and sniffing scat around the perimeter.

Having watched this show over the years, the readers know why they haven't moved in for the kill.

They can also use google and are just waiting for this to occur to the shill.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 13, 2014, 03:19:58 AM
<nonsense deleted>
Anytime you want to bring an actual argument.  I'd love to hear it.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 13, 2014, 03:49:35 AM
Its minutes away from the doobie hour...anything could happen then.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 13, 2014, 03:54:43 AM
I guess we can't delete the part about the people putting poison in my drinking water chemtrails in the sky and poison in my food products.


But lts move on, its a much easier task to try to dismiss this lone whistle blower...but not so easy when you hit double digits, like in the examples cited above...just ask Bill Cosby.

I mean why hide data in the first place, if everything is on the up and up ?

That reminds me, I better go hide yesterdays newspaper.

Regards...

My suggestion to you is...purify you own water, grow your own food, don't take vaccinations, and quit breathing.

See?  Very simple.  Problems solved.

Next?

Bill

PS  I have not had any vaccinations since 1976. (swine flu)  This is my choice.  We can all make our own choices.  Of course, if you can't afford them, then the choice is already made for you.  I have not missed a day of work due to illness in over 30 years.  (crossing fingers)  Just let folks decide for themselves is all I am saying.  What is wrong with that?  Now, if our brilliant government "Orders" us to be vaccinated then, we can talk.  Oh, I am also not paying my fine for not having health insurance under Obamacare (what a joke)  I told the IRS this and they can try to hunt me down if they wish.  I had health insurance until this stupid law was rammed upon us.  Now I can't afford it nor the fines.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 13, 2014, 04:04:54 AM
Ah...but there is always one brainless bum sniffing dingo that thinks the king lion moving in for the kill, and moves in to howl like an adolescent coyote.

So, king has a new bum sniffer...as it were.

Back in merry ol' england his official title wood be 'Groom of the Stool'.

There may be some king sh!t to wipe from the kingly back rim before the nights out.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 13, 2014, 04:07:37 AM
Ah...but there is always one brainless bum sniffing dingo that thinks the king lion moving in for the kill, and moves in to howl like an adolescent coyote.

So, king has a new bum sniffer...as it were.

Back in merry ol' england his official title wood be 'Groom of the Stool'.

There may be some king sh!t to wipe from the kingly back rim before the nights out.

Regards...

Damn Cap, what is with your fixation on men's asses?  I mean really.  Did you not read my post?

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 13, 2014, 04:13:36 AM
*watching Corner Gas...will attempt to extract stool 'Groom' from kings rim when its over*

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 13, 2014, 04:34:53 AM
I do hope the readership will pardon the interruption from the the brainless fudge scrubber.

Whenever he sees the word 'ass' he thinks that sh!t will shurley follow...so, he's right there to wipe the slot clean.

This may require a modification to the 'tar baby'.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 13, 2014, 05:28:21 AM
Quote from: sarkeizen
...
I'm happy to have my mind changed.  However you (and just about everyone else) does EVERYTHING BUT that.
...

Most who come into the various discussions here
simply wish to provide food for thought in order to
encourage research with an open mind in pursuit
of Truth.

If any 'mind changing' is to take place it should only
occur as a result of extensive research which considers
all sides of the various controversies.

We do in our conversational exchanges indicate
how our own personal experiences have helped
to shape our individual mindsets to illustrate that
such experiences can be very powerful motivators.

In the final analysis a well grounded, well informed
person would take a position in any controversy only
after they'd found certain facts to be True according
to their own ability to objectively arrive at conclusions.

Unfortunately, in today's World the People are functioning
at less than ideal capability and are too easily swayed by
emotional appeals and too easily influenced by propaganda
which originates from sources they've been 'programmed'
to accept as authoritative.

Hence, our need to constantly evaluate food for thought in
an effort to acquire wisdom and understanding.

Then there are those 'others' who join in the conversations
just to push buttons and stir the pot.  They do enjoy some
success in acquiring sympathizers who eagerly adopt their
point of view thinking it is the prevailing popular belief.
Many are very fearful of being labeled a 'conspiracy theorist'
and remain firmly imprisoned within their box of conformity.

Mind Control techniques are very effective with certain 'individuals'
which explains why governments and their controlled media
outlets make such extensive use of them.  Much capital is invested
annually in programs designed to sway public opinion favorably
towards government folly.  Deception is a very large part of those
programs.

So the question is:  Will anyone change their mind about anything
as a result of objective research or will their minds be changed for
them by means of manipulative techniques?

Any who come across as being deeply entrenched in establishment
thinking or who defend the 'official story' with seemingly blind
obedience are always viewed with suspicion.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 13, 2014, 05:46:23 AM
My suggestion to you is...purify you own water, grow your own food, don't take vaccinations, and quit breathing.

See?  Very simple.  Problems solved.

Except for the 'quit breathing part' not a bad plan.

Quote
PS  I have not had any vaccinations since 1976. (swine flu)  This is my choice.  We can all make our own choices.  Of course, if you can't afford them, then the choice is already made for you.  I have not missed a day of work due to illness in over 30 years.  (crossing fingers)  Just let folks decide for themselves is all I am saying.  What is wrong with that?  Now, if our brilliant government "Orders" us to be vaccinated then, we can talk.  Oh, I am also not paying my fine for not having health insurance under Obamacare (what a joke)  I told the IRS this and they can try to hunt me down if they wish.  I had health insurance until this stupid law was rammed upon us.  Now I can't afford it nor the fines.

Aye, declining most vaccinations is a good
way to go.  If one is knowledgeable in the ways
of strengthening the immune system and living
a low stress life good health will follow.

Yup, Obongo-Care has had a very significant
impact on health insurance costs.  But, being
without may be a blessing in disguise - thus
enabling full control over your health care decisions
and curbing excessive reliance on doctor visits.

In the old days out on the farm we only consulted
a doctor when the pain and discomfort couldn't be
otherwise managed.  Something like maybe four or
five doctor visits each ten years.  And, in those days,
the doc came to the house!  The Vet did too and we
saw him (or her) a lot more often than the Doc.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 13, 2014, 06:35:42 AM
Ok, where are they...where'd they go ?

Where is king shill and his witt/Groom of the Stool ?

First, I will eliminate the Groom from the issue...I will do that by breaking into words of 3 or more  syllables.


Constantinople copacetic cunnilinguistic...


There while he's working on those words we can get down to it.

Here's how it looked from my vantage point atop the roof of Commissioner Gordon's building.

The king enters the thread demanding evidence to counter all his various purported study's supporting vaccinations from vested interests.

He goes on to offhandedly dismiss THE whistleblower as a a lab janitor or something who's unable to distinguish a graph from a crossword puzzle...when according to what I've heard, there were apparently many whistleblowers who came forward.

I guess he thought that little detail to be insignificant to bring up...maybe inconvenient wood be a more suitable term ?

Regards...



and follows up with more demands for evidence that vaccines are not toxic.


Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 13, 2014, 08:33:59 AM
Cap - 1:

If you can distract your fascination with men's butts for a moment,  oh wait, you can't?

Oh,OK.

Never mind.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 13, 2014, 05:21:30 PM
He goes on to offhandedly dismiss THE whistleblower as a a lab janitor or something who's unable to distinguish a graph from a crossword puzzle...
This would all be easier if a) You actually make a clear argument - with names and cites and b) you just READ the actual study and associated information.  You are conflating a lot of stuff this is probably because of statement like this:
Quote
when according to what I've heard,
See I don't base my understanding one what the cousin to the dishwasher said they heard in passing from the garbageman.

The person who is getting the label "CDC whistleblower" is Thompson a co-author of the study in question.  He claims that statistically significant data was omitted.  This was after talking with one Brian Hooker.  Hooker is not a statistician which is why he muffed his analysis and got a false positive.  A mistake I wouldn't expect from a grad student let alone a professional.

Also if you really want to believe Thompson - then you also have to believe Hooker which means you believe that MMR is unrelated to autism for everyone except afro-americans.  If you disagree and believe that MMR is a significant risk factor for all people.  Then you have to believe that Hooker's reanalysis is wrong and that Thompson is confused.

Let me know when you, or anyone can make an actual argument.  I won't hold my breath.

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 13, 2014, 05:37:35 PM
Most who come into the various discussions here simply wish to provide food for thought
Probably not, at least not in this thread.  "food for thought" describes something that can be "intellectually chewed over".  There is almost no examples of that here.  Case in point "allcanadian" says that he and his friends OBSERVED PEOPLE WITH LOW IQs getting vaccinated.  I argue that only complete morons would think this is something that actually promotes thinking.  It's a) Not something that can be validated unless we know allcanadian and his/her friends.  b) it's not something that can be validated through some other group because there's probably nobody who would have that data. c) it's bigoted nonsense as you in all likelihood can't OBSERVE IQ.

All you can do with allcanadian's statement is accept it or not.  This is pretty much what most people in this thread provide.  This isn't making people think deeply at all.  If anything it's teaching people to accept facile arguments the exact opposite of "food for thought".
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 13, 2014, 06:38:15 PM
This would all be easier if a) You actually make a clear argument - with names and cites and b) you just READ the actual study and associated information.
 

Its always good for a laugh when morons tell everybody how unedgumacated they are and then use the word "cites" as if its a noun.


You are conflating a lot of stuff this is probably because of statement like this:See I don't base my understanding one what the cousin to the dishwasher said they heard in passing from the garbageman.

Except in this case, here is where the shill has taken the bait, and has both feet buried in the tar baby.

Anyone with google knows there were many whistleblowers who came forward...and not just the one guy he keeps referencing.

Now, I suppose he will expect you to believe ALL of them are either stupid or lying.


Quote
The person who is getting the label "CDC whistleblower" is Thompson a co-author of the study in question.  He claims that statistically significant data was omitted.  This was after talking with one Brian Hooker.  Hooker is not a statistician which is why he muffed his analysis and got a false positive.  A mistake I wouldn't expect from a grad student let alone a professional.

Lets all look at this bozo's logic a little closer shall we...his words - "...statistically significant data was omitted." and - " Hooker is not a statistician which is why he muffed his analysis..."

Maybe he can explain how someone can ' muffed his analysis ' when " statistically significant data was omitted " ???

The Marines have a term for this...its called this being hung on your own petard.

Shill Shoots Self in Foot...nooz @ eleben.


Quote
Also if you really want to believe Thompson - then you also have to believe Hooker which means you believe that MMR is unrelated to autism for everyone except afro-americans.  If you disagree and believe that MMR is a significant risk factor for all people.  Then you have to believe that Hooker's reanalysis is wrong and that Thompson is confused.

Blah blah blah...also addressed above


Quote
Let me know when you, or anyone can make an actual argument.  I won't hold my breath.

If I were him I wood be holding my breath...at least while in the presence of his 'Groom of the Stool'.
i can only imaging the smell of stale stool...and thats just his breath.

And speaking of stupid, the 'Groom' is not eligible for further acknowledgement in this thread, as he has yet to discern the meaning of the multi-syllable three word code provided for him recently above.

Besides, he can only find relevance whenever a male body part is referenced in context...if not, he will interject his gay references whenever he feels the urge.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 13, 2014, 09:27:33 PM
Its always good for a laugh when morons tell everybody how unedgumacated they are and then use the word "cites" as if its a noun.
Just a short form for "citation".  It's pretty well known.  If you don't understand something. Please feel free to ask.
Quote
Anyone with google knows there were many whistleblowers who came forward...and not just the one guy he keeps referencing.
Please cite.  You said "CDC whistleblower" - this term usually refers to Thompson.  If you are thinking about someone else you only have to provide a reference.  You are probably conflating other nonsense with the current nonsense you are entertaining.
Quote
Lets all look at this bozo's logic a little closer shall we...his words - "...statistically significant data was omitted." and - " Hooker is not a statistician which is why he muffed his analysis..."

Maybe he can explain how someone can ' muffed his analysis ' when " statistically significant data was omitted " ???
*sigh* really.  You should just read the papers instead on relying on your inbred cousin's bag boy for information. The words "statistically significant data was omitted" weren't my words they were Thompson's taken from his press release (Reading! - Try it sometime!).  So it's Thompson's claim that information that would alter the outcome was omitted.  However his judgement on this is based - again from his statement (Reading!) - on Hookers analysis.   Hooker claims that his reanalysis includes data that alters the outcome.  Hooker muffed his analysis, as I stated earlier by using the wrong metric for determining correlation.

So there's no contradiction.  If you don't understand you can always ask.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 13, 2014, 09:37:52 PM
A ten minute video on Mercury and Fluoride. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e3ARhMPVu-A)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 14, 2014, 12:40:00 AM
Just a short form for "citation".  It's pretty well known.  If you don't understand something. Please feel free to ask.Please cite.

Shhhuuuure...he also has a bridge or 3 that he wood also like you to buy.


Quote
You said "CDC whistleblower" - this term usually refers to Thompson.  If you are thinking about someone else you only have to provide a reference.  You are probably conflating other nonsense with the current nonsense you are entertaining.*sigh* really.  You should just read the papers instead on relying on your inbred cousin's bag boy for information. The words "statistically significant data was omitted" weren't my words they were Thompson's taken from his press release (Reading! - Try it sometime!).


Yeah, but then I mentioned there were others...after he took the 1 whistleblower bait.

He still hasn't tried to discredit them as yet...we need not wonder why.


Quote
So it's Thompson's claim that information that would alter the outcome was omitted.  However his judgement on this is based - again from his statement (Reading!) - on Hookers analysis.   Hooker claims that his reanalysis includes data that alters the outcome.  Hooker muffed his analysis, as I stated earlier by using the wrong metric for determining correlation.

And I suppose all the other whistleblowers muffed things up also.

Quote
So there's no contradiction.  If you don't understand you can always ask.

Ask and ye also shall be ignored.


Some of you may be unaware that since i believe the mid 1950's those psychopaths have been taking blood from every new born baby.

Now, why do you suppose they started doing that ?

It certainly couldn't be that their plan was to use DNA genome research to better target certain ethnic groups or individuals with their toxic injections, could it ?

This POS shill has also fail to address the various methods of distributing toxic chemicals to the masses.

He will also side step their depopulation agenda...and this is brazenly written in stone...just google Georgia Guidestones...because he certainly won't address it or provide a reasonable explanation for the ghoulish plot.

Life on this planet doesn't swing any lower than these creepos.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 14, 2014, 02:23:36 AM
A ten minute video on Mercury and Fluoride. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e3ARhMPVu-A)

So out of curiosity.  How many hours did you spend attempting to refute this?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 14, 2014, 02:41:24 AM
Shhhuuuure...
Sorry it's simply a fact. 
Quote from: http://www.grammarphobia.com/blog/2011/10/cite.html
"Yes, the word “cite” is a bit jargony, but it’s common among linguists, etymologists, and other language types."
Quote
Yeah, but then I mentioned there were others...after he took the 1 whistleblower bait.
It's not "bait".  You talked about the CDC whistleblower singular.   I assume you mean Thompson because that is what most people appear to mean.  If you have some other person in mind you should mention them.
Quote
He still hasn't tried to discredit them as yet...we need not wonder why.
Because you haven't told me who you're talking about?
Quote
And I suppose all the other whistleblowers muffed things up also.
How many times do you want to misread something?  Hooker is not a whistleblower.  He doesn't work for the CDC.  However Thompson believed Hooker's poor analysis.  So while Thompson (the CDC whistleblower) didn't "muff" anything (other than believing Hooker) he is still wrong.  As for other people that you claim are CDC whistleblowers.   You're going to have to tell me who they are before I tell you  whats wrong (or right) with your position.
Quote
This POS shill has also fail to address the various methods of distributing toxic chemicals to the masses.
Right now I'm talking about vaccines.  After I cure you of your crazy I'd be more than happy to talk about your other problems.  This isn't sidestepping it's focusing on the issue being discussed.  What you are doing is often referred to as "moving the goalposts".  Either vaccines are, in and of themselves demonstrably and significantly harmful or they are not.  I say "not" you seem to say they "are".  We don't need to talk about chemtrails or bat boy or ruined temples on the face of mars to make that point.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 14, 2014, 02:56:08 AM
So out of curiosity.  How many hours did you spend attempting to refute this?
"Mandrake do you realize that in addition to fluoridating water why there is studies under way to fluoridate: salt, flour, fruit juices, soup, sugar, milk ice cream, ice cream, Mandrake, children's ice cream!"
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 14, 2014, 03:19:09 AM
So out of curiosity.  How many hours did you spend attempting to refute this?

Did you find something in the video which is in
need of refutation?  Refute What?

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 14, 2014, 03:23:34 AM
Did you find something in the video which is in
need of refutation?  Refute What?
So you didn't spend any time at all attempting to refute any of the information presented.  Right?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 14, 2014, 03:27:24 AM
"Mandrake do you realize that in addition to fluoridating water why there is studies under way to fluoridate: salt, flour, fruit juices, soup, sugar, milk ice cream, ice cream, Mandrake, children's ice cream!"
Yet another awesome reference!
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 14, 2014, 03:53:07 AM
Yet another awesome reference!
"That's how your hard core commie works."
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 14, 2014, 04:11:41 AM
Sorry it's simply a fact.  It's not "bait".  You talked about the CDC whistleblower singular.   I assume you mean Thompson because that is what most people appear to mean.  If you have some other person in mind you should mention them. Because you haven't told me who you're talking about?

According to the thread transcript, I didn't name Thompson or Hooker either...but he seemed to be well aware of their existence.

The readership will remember that I also mentioned other whistleblowers a number of times before he acknowledged them just now...he postures now, that he wasn't aware they existed, and doesn't know who they are either.

So, if that is the case, then apparently it is actually he, who in fact does not read...and not me, as he implied.

I guess he thought it good strategy to accuse me of it first.

I submit, that he knows who the other whistleblowers are, but had nothing bad to say about them.

As his feet sink deeper into the tar baby the more he struggles.



Quote
How many times do you want to misread something?  Hooker is not a whistleblower.  He doesn't work for the CDC.
 

I don't work in government, but i blew the whistle on a number of them...and they did put me on their naughty list of people to do.

And its worth mentioning that the CDC wasn't the only accused party.


Quote
However Thompson believed Hooker's poor analysis.  As for other people that you claim are CDC whistleblowers.   You're going to have to tell me who they are before I tell you  whats wrong (or right) with your position.

I guess he really doesn't read...now suddenly he's conceding that they may have some relevant testimony to give, damaging to the CDC.

According to the thread transcript, I didn't name Thompson or Hooker either...but he seemed to be well aware of who THEY were.

The readership will remember that I also mentioned other whistleblowers a number of times before he acknowledged them just now...he postures now, that he wasn't aware they existed, and doesn't know who they are either. "


According to the thread transcript, I didn't name Thompson or Hooker either...but he seemed to be well aware of their existence.


Quote
Right now I'm talking about vaccines.

Yes, lets do ignore the fact that essentially he's advising people to buy their medicine from they guy who tried to poison them last week.


Quote
After I cure you of your crazy I'd be more than happy to talk about your other problems.  This isn't sidestepping it's focusing on the issue being discussed.


Well endowed...witty...helpful...Patent holder.

I can use words that describe also...i just don't project those descriptors on to others.


Quote
What you are doing is often referred to as "moving the goalposts".

Or pointing out the obvious.


Either vaccines are, in and of themselves demonstrably and significantly harmful or they are not.  I say "not" you seem to say they "are".  We don't need to talk about chemtrails or bat boy or ruined temples on the face of mars to make that point.

I'm reminded how the "Reverend" Ted Haggart usta hurl all his condemnations on gay people, proclaiming eternal damnation...and then how he got caught with a gay escort and buying meth to enhance his guilty trystful pleasure.

Regards...



Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 14, 2014, 04:32:48 AM
I didn't name Thompson or Hooker either
Or anything else.  So I used most common usage of "CDC whistleblower".  If that's not who you mean then there's no reason to play games.  Just say: "I actually meant".
Quote
he postures now, that he wasn't aware they existed, and doesn't know who they are either.
No.  I'm just letting you describe your argument.  If you have one.
Quote
I submit, that he knows who the other whistleblowers are, but had nothing bad to say about them.
You could prove this by naming them and then watch as I have nothing bad to say.  Why do you need to keep your argument a secret?
Quote
And its worth mentioning that the CDC wasn't the only accused party.
Not in this part of the argument as your statement was 'the evidence the so called CDC "scientists" hid, which showed their "very safe" vaccines were causing autism.'
Quote
I guess he really doesn't read...now suddenly he's conceding that they may have some relevant testimony to give, damaging to the CDC.
What could I say about an argument that you refuse to disclose?

Quote
Yes, lets do ignore the fact that essentially he's advising people to buy their medicine from they guy who tried to poison them last week.
Look if you have an argument to make about vaccines.  You should make it. Otherwise perhaps you should go pretend you know something about something else. :)

Quote
Or pointing out the obvious.
Nope it's moving the goalposts.  At first you seem to say that the CDC hid evidence which demonstrated clearly and unambiguously that vaccines cause autism.  If that's true I'd love to hear the argument.  If you can't make this point without talking about chemtrails then you've pretty much lost the argument. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 14, 2014, 05:05:45 AM




I'm reminded how the "Reverend" Ted Haggart usta hurl all his condemnations on gay people, proclaiming eternal damnation...and then how he got caught with a gay escort and buying meth to enhance his guilty trystful pleasure.

Regards...

You really just can not help yourself.  In a topic on vaccines, you are talking about gay escorts.  That makes a lot of sense to no one except yourself.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 14, 2014, 06:09:35 AM
"My quote:<blockquote>I guess he really doesn't read...now suddenly he's conceding that they may have some relevant testimony to give, damaging to the CDC.</blockquote>
Quote
What could I say about an argument that you refuse to disclose?"



After seeing that tired reply, I feel like the guy who has to keep punching because the referee isn't stepping in,

I think the readership has had just about all the trolling it wants.


Time for a reset.

I stated my position on my first post in this thread...

'...Chemicals do not belong in the human body.

If they did, we would have receptors for it...like we have for the healing herb cannabis.

And NOBODY but NOBODY, knows exactly what is going on inside it...because there is no money in finding out.

The money is in fuck!ing it up...and to make money constantly by peddling bogus treatment protocols. '


I simply outlined that position by adding some other pieces of that picture.

My position has never been confined to vaccines alone, which are just another puzzle piece.

There exist an inbred murderous psychopathic bloodline dating back to ancient Babylon are behind the vaccines chemtrails GMO's fluoride and mercury poisoning, the cancer epidemic conspiracy, and on down the line.

To pretend there is no connection between them is stupidity, cognisant dissonance, or complicity - by proxy or otherwise.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 14, 2014, 06:13:27 AM
Quote
You really just can not help yourself.  In a topic on vaccines, you are talking about gay escorts.  That makes a lot of sense to no one except yourself.

Bill


*shows Groom of the Stool the lavatory*

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: orbut 3000 on December 14, 2014, 08:38:22 AM

Nice work, capzro!
 :D



Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 14, 2014, 03:24:11 PM
Quote from: sarkeizen
What can I say about an argument you refuse to disclose?
After seeing that tired reply, I feel like the guy who has to keep punching because the referee isn't stepping in,
Yawn.  You claim to have some argument about CDC whistleblowers and covering up the idea that vaccines cause autism.  However you won't say who they are for some entirely undisclosed reason.  The only well known one (Thompson) doesn't make your point.

This is more like you not being willing to step into the ring.

Quote
'...Chemicals do not belong in the human body.
I just assumed you were trolling or stupid here.  If you were to remove all the chemicals from your body you would be dead.  So since you're running away from your "there are some whistleblowers who clearly indict the CDC but I am mentally impaired from identifying them" argument.  You're going to have be more specific here.

Quote
To pretend there is no connection between them is stupidity, cognisant dissonance, or complicity - by proxy or otherwise.
To say that vaccines are clearly harmful but being unable to produce useful evidence is probably more indicative of stupidity or dissonance than anything you describe.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 14, 2014, 03:25:29 PM
Nice work, capzro!
Seriously.  The chemtrail conspiracy to you represents a pinnacle of rational thought?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 14, 2014, 04:04:10 PM
Yawn.  You claim to have some argument about CDC whistleblowers and covering up the idea that vaccines cause autism.  However you won't say who they are for some entirely undisclosed reason.  The only well known one (Thompson) doesn't make your point.

This is more like you not being willing to step into the ring.
I just assumed you were trolling or stupid here.  If you were to remove all the chemicals from your body you would be dead.  So since you're running away from your "there are some whistleblowers who clearly indict the CDC but I am mentally impaired from identifying them" argument.  You're going to have be more specific here.
To say that vaccines are clearly harmful but being unable to produce useful evidence is probably more indicative of stupidity or dissonance than anything you describe.
Maybe it is not chemicals per se, but chemicals that are mass produced in a factory environment that make him leary.  Naturally occurring substances such as arsenic, selenium, or the sweet juices from oleander, and fox glove plants may all be fine in his book.  It may be that he wishes to avoid industrially processed substances such as dihydrogen oxide produced in a giant plant in Olancha California.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 14, 2014, 04:26:03 PM
The information relating to the whistleblowers is freely available to everyone on the net.

This troll is dodging all reports and making sh!t up when he talks himself into a corner.

You can't corner a troll...they will simply digress into word splicing, no matter how many times they contradict themselves.

This is how a pedophile pope still gets to play the role of the "holy father"...they control mainstream media.

But...they don't control the net (yet)...which is where the trolls come in, paid to muddy the waters.

This is compounded by unwitting and uneducated dupes (not paid) who, in order to feel relevant on various forums will actually back the trolls up.

Notice how the troll of the day continually side steps the presence of the Georgia Guidestones monument that his pedo pals have constructed as a testament of their depopulation agenda...of which their vaccination GMO and chemtrail programs are all components.

There just aren't any trolls who can dismiss this...which is why they avoid the issue, and are left to resort to moonbat tin foil hat comments.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 14, 2014, 06:09:49 PM
The information relating to the whistleblowers is freely available to everyone on the net.
However last time I looked on the internet I used Thompsons name and that wasn't the name you are imagining.  Sadly there are no websites that say "This is the list of people that Cap-Z-ro is thinking of" I checked.  So why not stop hiding?
Quote
This troll is dodging all reports
All reports of what?  Cap-Z-ro's list of whistleblowers?  Again there's no website for that.
Quote
and making sh!t up when he talks himself into a corner.
What have I made up?
Quote
You can't corner a troll...they will simply digress into word splicing, no matter how many times they contradict themselves.
Sadly for your argument.  Nothing like that happened here. You did want to go on about my use of the word "cite" - does that make you a troll?
Quote
paid to muddy the waters.
So you really honestly and truly believe that I get some monetary compensation for making you look stupid?  How much do you think it is?  $50/hr?  $20/hr?
Quote
Notice how the troll of the day continually side steps
I'm just not interested in getting into a discussion about something that is unnecessary to your point that "vaccines are not very safe".  If you're saying that it is impossible to make your point without talking about chemtrails.  Then all you have to do is say so.  If you can make your point without referencing chemtrails then please do so.

You can dance around the ring as much as you like.  You can even namecall as much as you want. As long as you stay outside of the ring you're safe.  Let me know when you want to step inside. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 14, 2014, 06:12:01 PM
It may be that he wishes to avoid industrially processed substances such as dihydrogen oxide produced in a giant plant in Olancha California.
The dihydrogen conspiracy is the worst.  Thankfully there are guys on the internet who sell dihydrogen oxide filters.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 14, 2014, 06:35:09 PM
The dihydrogen conspiracy is the worst.  Thankfully there are guys on the internet who sell dihydrogen oxide filters.

Believe it or not, several schools actually banned its use and sent a letter to parents telling them about this ban.
Later, when someone explained what it was, they decided to remove the ban.  (I'll bet they felt stupid)

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 14, 2014, 06:41:35 PM
Hey gang !

I got a novel idea...lets just ignore the satan worshiping murderous pedophiles trying to poison us.

Oh wait...some "people" here are doing that already.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 14, 2014, 07:10:28 PM
the satan worshiping murderous pedophiles trying to poison us.
So do they have to be murderous and Satan worshiping and pedophiles?  Can they just be one? or two out of three?

My offer still stands, any time you want to step in the ring about this whole CDC whistleblower thing I'll be happy to punch your lights out (metaphorically). :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 14, 2014, 08:45:26 PM
As I have stated in the past...do not take my word on anything - do your own due diligence and research things yourself.

Put the pieces together and then look at all the players and their connections with one another.

Look at how the tainted former executives of drug companies and other toxic industries are now employed by the CDC and other govt agencies.

Its all there in front of you...all you have to do is take the time to look.

And certainly don't take the word of this paid troll.

The reports of govt paying disinfo trolls to enter public forums is available on the net is there too...but not on their propaganda TV machine.

Check out the 'Franklin cover up' and read what these murderous pedophiles masquerading as govt leaders are doing to all those missing children.

Yep, the same ones behind the 'Georgia Guidestones'.

Lets focus on the entire picture, instead of the zit on the ass of the gorilla in the room...as this troll wants you to do.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 14, 2014, 09:11:38 PM


And certainly don't take the word of this paid troll.



Lets focus on the entire picture, instead of the zit on the ass of the gorilla in the room...as this troll wants you to do.

Regards...

Now Cap has some fixation on gorilla's asses.  Incredible.  Instead of answering a simple question, he always falls back on pedophiles, gay references and now, the ass of a gorilla.  There is a real pattern here.  His response, because he can't help himself, will no doubt contain some sexual ref. of one kind or another.  Just watch.

Bill

PS  I made $.00035 by making this post.  The drug companies offered me free drugs, but, I went with the money.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 14, 2014, 10:19:28 PM
My guess is, if in the unlikely event he could get paid for anything other that stalking people he wood be working for all the booze he can drink.

But, after being forced into retirement due to in gross competence, at least being the official Groom of the Stool for the king lieon will at least provide him with all the fudge he can eat.

And by 'gross competence', I mean that he's both gross and competent.

*apologizes to Groom of Stool for using big words*

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 14, 2014, 10:23:14 PM
My guess is, if in the unlikely event he could get paid for anything other that stalking people he wood be working for all the booze he can drink.

But, after being forced into retirement due to in gross competence, at least being the official Groom of the Stool for the king lieon will at least provide him with all the fudge he can eat.

And by 'gross competence', I mean that he's both gross and competent.

*apologizes to Groom of Stool for using big words*

Regards...

And there you have it folks.  So predictable.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 14, 2014, 10:30:23 PM
When alluding to an asshole, the term sh!t wood be bound to come up more often than knot-hole.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 14, 2014, 10:47:32 PM
The Trolls who have joined the discussion are
well versed/schooled in the tactics of deflection
and disruption. ::)

While it is obvious that they are enjoying themselves
immensely as they go about their 'business' it is
unlikely that they've deterred anyone from examining
the question of vaccine safety.

It is more likely that they've turned people away from
their AGENDA by means of their excessive cleverness,
arrogance and hubris.  Playing the 'role' as a 'bad boy'
most often turns people off and encourages them to
redouble their efforts to find Truth. :o

Some Trolls just don't know when to give up on the
provocations. 8)

 
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 14, 2014, 10:55:33 PM
When alluding to an asshole, the term sh!t wood be bound to come up more often than knot-hole.

Regards...

Now it would ( note the correct use of the word would and not wood as Cap often confuses ) seem that he is into self-flagellation.  Perhaps this is because he can not answer a simple question relating to the topic at hand.  Who are these mystery whistle blowers?  What did they say?  Can their names not be revealed because...

A: They do not exist.
B: Revealing their names might place them in grave danger.

I vote for A.

Unless Cap-z-ro answers a few simple, direct questions relating to this topic, I will continue to believe it is A.  Trying to find his imaginary whistle blowers on the net is fruitless.  (See choice A above)

I say again Cap, if you think vaccinations are killing you then, do not take them.  As I said, I don't, but for different reasons.  As of now,we still have this choice.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 15, 2014, 12:01:35 AM
I'd say he's one more vaccination short of a chemical lobotomy.

Lets just hope the chemical vasectomy vaccinations had the desired effect.

The last thing we need are more progeny from defective units.

I realize that the Darwin effect usually eliminates them, but sometimes it just that takes too long...as in his case.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 15, 2014, 12:33:32 AM
I'd say he's one more vaccination short of a chemical lobotomy.

Lets just hope the chemical vasectomy vaccinations had the desired effect.

The last thing we need are more progeny from defective units.

I realize that the Darwin effect usually eliminates them, but sometimes it just that takes too long...as in his case.

Regards...

It would have been shorter for you to just type: "I can't answer any questions on the phantom whistle blowers because they only exist in my mind."

So, you are not refusing to answer these simple questions...the plain truth is that you can't.

OK,got it.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 15, 2014, 01:20:03 AM
Quote
OK,got it.

Bill



Well, we can all be sure of one thing at least..."it" doesn't mean sound judgment or common sense.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 15, 2014, 02:10:34 AM
As I have stated in the past...do not take my word on anything
It's interesting that you don't want people to take your word but you don't offer ANYTHING else.  Doesn't that mean the sum total of what you offer here is...nothing?  You sure don't cite studies, provide evidence or support your points.

Quote
Its all there in front of you...all you have to do is take the time to look.
Dude.  If it's so easy to find evidence which is very, very, very clear and compelling.  Why can't you just post it here?
The fact that you can't tends to increase the likelihood that you're just blowing smoke.
Quote
And certainly don't take the word of this paid troll.
So again, you absolutely and truly think someone sends me a cheque for posting here.

Quote
Lets focus on the entire picture, instead of the zit on the ass of the gorilla in the room...as this troll wants you to do.
Dude.  You brought up a point about vaccines and now you whine and complain when I want to address that point.

Again, any time you want to step into that ring...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 15, 2014, 02:22:07 AM
The Trolls who have joined the discussion are
well versed/schooled in the tactics of deflection
and disruption. ::)
So are you going to tell me how much time you spent attempting to refute the information presented in your ten minute video?

Am I correct in assuming that your answer is: Zero?

Quote
unlikely that they've deterred anyone from examining the question of vaccine safety.
Good.  Because that's exactly the question I am attempting to promote.   If it wasn't for people like you, Cap-Z-ro and allcanadian providing virtually no information that would actually help people to make a rational decision.

Quote
arrogance and hubris
Don't you think someone like you who spends no time in refuting the information you present to other people is the most careless and arrogant person of all?

Quote
encourages them to redouble their efforts to find Truth. :o
I hope people do.  However I also hope they notice that people like you, capt-z-ro and allcanadian are the most categorically useless people when one is concerned in finding the truth.

Seriously you claim to provide "food for thought" but you simply spew back things that you googled which happen to agree with your existing bigotry.  You spend no time trying to refute the information you present and then have nothing but dismissals and conspiracy theories when someone disagrees with your nonsense.   Even though the only reason you agree with the article, video, etc...is because you never spent any time trying to see that it's wrong. :)

Given that you are unwilling or incapable of attempting to refute your own ideas.  How could anyone ever believe that you have any interest in truth (capital T or lower-case)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 15, 2014, 02:35:39 AM
Rule #1 a and 1 b, when dealing with trolls.

Don't feed...or appease them.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 15, 2014, 02:42:02 AM
Rule #1 a and 1 b, when dealing with trolls.
So you've pretty much run out of things to say.  Are you off to pretend you know something about physics or chemistry now?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 15, 2014, 03:20:08 AM
For those who may not have viewed it yet,
The Fluoride Deception (https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Ly_QP4rGczo) falls into the category
of 'must see.'  The extent to which corruption
and deceptions have become intrinsic to
American Science is disturbing, to say the least.

The role of the internet in making possible the
awakening of the people by enabling them to
'see' the deceptions of government was actually
foretold in prophecy.  We are living in that time.
The Awakening (also referred to as the Apocalypse)
is well underway.

How readers may choose to respond to the food for
thought offered is entirely up to them;  they are
free to pursue additional research if they desire
or they may dismiss it if they desire.

Spoon-Feeding isn't necessary at all for those who
have a serious hunger for Truth.  It is essential
that their powers of discernment develop over
time as they digest information while verifying
its Truth.  We must learn to make decisions
independently in accordance with our beliefs.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 15, 2014, 03:29:04 AM
For those who may not have viewed it yet,
The Fluoride Deception (https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Ly_QP4rGczo) falls into the category
of 'must see.'
...and how much time did you spend attempting to refute that. :) Again, my guess is zero. 
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 15, 2014, 03:36:29 AM
So you've pretty much run out of things to say.  Are you off to pretend you know something about physics or chemistry now?


Another dimwitt who has never had an original thought.

'MISSION ACCOMPLISHED'...to quote an infamous dimwitt.

Regards...


Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 15, 2014, 03:38:28 AM
For those who may not have viewed it yet,
The Fluoride Deception (https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Ly_QP4rGczo) falls into the category
of 'must see.'  The extent to which corruption
and deceptions have become intrinsic to
American Science is disturbing, to say the least.

The role of the internet in making possible the
awakening of the people by enabling them to
'see' the deceptions of government was actually
foretold in prophecy.  We are living in that time.
The Awakening (also referred to as the Apocalypse)
is well underway.

How readers may choose to respond to the food for
thought offered is entirely up to them;  they are
free to pursue additional research if they desire
or they may dismiss it if they desire.

Spoon-Feeding isn't necessary at all for those who
have a serious hunger for Truth.  It is essential
that their powers of discernment develop over
time as they digest information while verifying
its Truth.  We must learn to make decisions
independently in accordance with our beliefs.


Never mind its a nown kneurotoxin...drink up.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 15, 2014, 03:41:08 AM
Quote from: sarkeizen
...and how much time did you spend attempting to refute that. :) Again, my guess is zero.

Truth cannot be refuted although the Deceiver will
certainly try.

The Lie can be refuted by examination.  Each must do
that as they consider food for thought.  The refutation
will occur as beliefs are patterned after Truth.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 15, 2014, 03:41:41 AM
Another dimwitt who has never had an original thought.
Guess I'm right.  You really have run out of steam on the whole CDC whistleblower issue.  Your backing out of an argument you started doesn't win you any originality awards either.  Just sayin...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 15, 2014, 03:52:48 AM
Truth cannot be refuted although the Deceiver will certainly try.
So, in other words you didn't even try to refute any of the information you post here.  Right?  You didn't put even the most casual amount of effort into that.  Right?  Because otherwise that would, in your eyes make you the Deceiver.  Am I with you so far?

Of course that means you couldn't have thought critically about anything you've posted at all.  I think you can see that based on how much you are avoiding the issue.   So when you call something a "must see".  Does that phrase actually mean anything?  If it does it implies that you have evaluated the evidence - if you had evaluated the evidence then there would have been a chance for it to be found wanting.   However since only the Deceiver evaluates evidence the words "must see" can't convey any sense of value.

Making you something of a deceiver...thanks for admitting that. :) :) :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 15, 2014, 04:02:33 AM
Quote
Guess I'm right.  You really have run out of steam on the whole CDC whistleblower issue.  Your backing out of an argument you started doesn't win you any originality awards either.  Just sayin...


"A lie, if repeated will be accepted as truth,"


Quote from a psychopathic dimwitt

But the people eventually did catch on...and they tried to eliminate them.

And to this day the carnage continues...trolls are employed to facilitate an increase in the death rate.

But, alas they are losing the battle for minds, as more and more people have stopped listening and started looking at events from both sides, instead of the one sided mainstream propaganda packaged version.

Regards...


Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 15, 2014, 04:07:21 AM
Just to show that I do provide proof to support my assertions, here is where I find a lot of good insider intelligence...

govttrollswholiketosmelltheirownfarts.com

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 15, 2014, 04:19:03 AM
And to this day the carnage continues...trolls are employed to facilitate an increase in the death rate.
So again, I'd just like some clarification here.  You really think.  Completely and without reservation.  That I am actually getting real money for posting with you.  Someone who seems to believe in three conspiracy theories before breakfast.  Who thinks if you removed every chemical from your body you would be better off.   Someone who doesn't know the definition of the word "chemical".

Do you really think you have a high level of credibility.  I mean to the average person.  Do you think that if you just polled a few folk in the checkout line and asked them if they thought people who talked about "chemtrails" were a little crazy.  Do you think they would all say "no way, that's one of the most pressing issues today". 

Which of course leads to a problem with your whole "sarkeizen gets paid to make Capt-z-ro look more stupid than he usually does" idea.  Even to someone who's business is propaganda there's very little value in (further) discrediting you. 

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 15, 2014, 04:31:14 AM
Quote
Someone who doesn't know the definition of the word "chemical".

...your whole "sarkeizen gets paid to make Capt-z-ro look more stupid than he usually does" idea. 


*Cap schools frustrated troll below*

The word 'chemical' has at least 2 catagories...

1. Chemicals naturally produced in the body.
2. Chemicals which are man made.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 15, 2014, 04:52:01 AM
1. Chemicals naturally produced in the body.
2. Chemicals which are man made.
So for convenience, amusement and your love of bodily functions I'll call these types of substances #1 and #2.
So it seems like you're saying that any #1 is ok but any #2 is harmful.

But your body is, right now creating carbon dioxide a LETHAL poison.  If you were in a room with improper ventilation this chemical naturally created in your body (#1) would kill you and everyone in the room.   So what appears to be your argument about #1's is incorrect.

Not to mention that, according to you synthetic insulin is poison even to diabetics.  Since synthetic insulin is a #2 but diabetics would die (some rather quickly) without it.  This contradicts what appears to be your argument about #2's.

So you might want to work on your definition a bit...

Now of course your next step would be to do the same thing you did about the CDC whistleblower.  Pretend there is some other explanation and never provide it.   Let me know when you're done.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 15, 2014, 05:09:12 AM
Quote
...your body is, right now creating carbon dioxide a LETHAL poison.
 

A reader writes in to get in on the troll schooling gig.

"Toxicity is in the dosage".


Quote
Now of course your next step would be to do the same thing you did about the CDC whistleblower.  Pretend there is some other explanation and never provide it.   Let me know when you're done.

Another reader wrote in to get in on the troll schooling gig also.

" When a guy comes forward and confesses to his role in a conspiracy that destroyed the lives of thousands of children" carries a lot of weight with me.  He even set himself up for potential lawsuits which could easily wipe him out.

I mean, who does that anyway???

A man with a guilty conscience telling the truth, THAT is who!!!

Pardon me for not ignoring my common sense. "


Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 15, 2014, 05:17:34 AM
"Toxicity is in the dosage".
If that's true generally then your original distinctions don't matter.  If it's not then you need to refine your definitions.
Your move.
Quote
When a guy
Which guy?  You never can seem to say.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 15, 2014, 05:24:30 AM
Cap's Report:

If that's true generally then your original distinctions don't matter.  If it's not then you need to refine your definitions.

1st reader refuses invitation to feed or appease troll.


Quote
Your move.Which guy?  You never can seem to say.

Predictably, 2nd reader also refuses invitation to feed or appease troll.


Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 15, 2014, 05:27:41 AM
...
Yeah.  I know, you got nothing.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 15, 2014, 05:31:15 AM
This just in...

Readers prefer to address trolls through a 3rd party...which is understandable, I'm starting to get skin rashes from all the showers.

Readers also seem to enjoy when Cap refers to himself in 3rd person...like I just did.

Thank you, thank you folks...I'm here all week - try the veal.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 15, 2014, 05:40:01 AM
Cap getting real with the readership:

My grand pappy usta say, never roll around in the mud with pigs...because after a while you'll find out that the pigs are having more fun than you.

I do my best to keep that in mind...altho I confess to have fallen short of the glory from time to time.

Regards...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 15, 2014, 05:40:42 AM
Readers prefer to address trolls through a 3rd party...
Profitis does this whole "I like to pretend that I'm speaking for someone other than myself" thing too.

Does anyone buy that Capt-mo-ron is speaking for anyone but himself?   Didn't think so.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 15, 2014, 05:44:37 AM
Cap whispers to readers...psst, do you think he really doesn't know that he's a character in a comedy routine yet ?

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 15, 2014, 05:48:32 AM
...
Still nothing.  :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 15, 2014, 06:07:21 AM
*points troll in direction of nobodytakesyouseriously.com*

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 15, 2014, 06:19:40 AM

Your move.Which guy?  You never can seem to say.


A 3rd reader commented:

"Does it really matter what his name was???"


This reader also would like to keep their distance...and also likes it when ol' Cap does the 3rd person thing...like he just did.

Hmmm, wood that qualify as a 4th person reference ?

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 15, 2014, 02:55:13 PM
A 3rd entirely made up reader commented:

"Does it really matter what his name was???"
Sure.  For all I know this is Thompson or someone else who's impression of the data was formed by Hooker's analysis...or perhaps it's you just making things up.
On one side of your mouth you say "don't take my word for it" but on the other you say "as far as MY argument goes I won't give you any details to make a decision or investigate".

This is a good example of the kind of misleading behavior which stems from pretending you have an argument but being unwilling to present it.  On one hand you want to act like you want to discuss the issues but you bring nothing to discuss.  It's similar to those people who excuse spreading misinformation with words like "food for thought" or "raising awareness"
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 15, 2014, 03:06:07 PM
As we all know "discussion" is food for trolls.

*feels troll hunger pains*

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 15, 2014, 03:11:41 PM
As we all know "discussion" is food for trolls.
I've been nothing but honest in my willingness to discuss a few issues around vaccines.  As I said I'm even happy to change my position if I can see some strong evidence for the idea that vaccines are as harmful as some people say (allcanadian said some seriously injure or kill 1 in 20).

Are you admitting now that you have no intent to discuss anything?  Doesn't that make you the troll?
Quote
*feels troll hunger pains*
That sounds like you're admitting you're the troll here. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 15, 2014, 04:26:38 PM
*plays 'Melancholy Baby' for troll on the swinlola*

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 15, 2014, 05:27:18 PM
*plays 'Melancholy Baby' for troll on the swinlola*
So out of curiosity what do you think you are accomplishing by avoiding discussion on a topic you brought up?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 15, 2014, 07:03:35 PM
References???  Because the CDC asserts that the body eventually completely eliminates the ethylmercury in Thimerosal and therefore no mercury from Thimerosal accumulates...


*blames other troll for Bringing up CDC*


Caps accepts responsibility for talking bringing up another CDC...the Cognitive Dissonance Club.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 15, 2014, 10:46:29 PM
*blames other troll for Bringing up CDC*
Well *this* was you...
Lets call a Mulligan on the evidence the so called CDC "scientists" hid, which showed their "very safe" vaccines were causing autism.
So again, you brought this up and then didn't want to talk about it. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 15, 2014, 11:15:52 PM
Well *this* was you...So again, you brought this up and then didn't want to talk about it. :)


*Beitknown to one and all that Cap denies any affiliation between hisgoodself and the Cap-mor-on character*

Regards...


Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 15, 2014, 11:28:02 PM
*Beitknown to one and all that Cap denies any affiliation between hisgoodself and the Cap-mor-on character*
Seems like you're one in the same.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 16, 2014, 12:04:29 AM
I believe forum owner Stefan still has the video from the last ou.com xmas party showing both myself and the other Cap tossing trolls outside into a snow bank.

The Cap-mor-on member may knot be the sharpest peak on the scope, so to speak, but he knows a troll when he sees one.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 16, 2014, 12:15:53 AM
The Cap-Z-ro member may knot be the sharpest peak on the scope,
That's an exaggeration.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 16, 2014, 12:59:58 AM
That's an exaggeration.


Notice that the troll has now taken to altering my the text of my statements.

Niiice.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 16, 2014, 01:15:11 AM
altering my the text of my statements.
Text is being altered but the meaning is exactly the same. :) :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 16, 2014, 01:24:35 AM
Text is being altered but the meaning is exactly the same. :) :)

I wood submit that anyone comfortable with forgery...which is what altering someone's text is, wood also be comfortable with the CDC doing the same.

Are we dealing with a CDC scumbag here ?

Well, the zero integrity level is certainly identical.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 16, 2014, 01:35:20 AM
I wood submit that anyone comfortable with forgery...which is what altering someone's text is
Nope.  Wrong again.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 16, 2014, 01:43:51 AM
Nope.  Wrong again.


Forgery and fraud are twins...also criminal in nature.

What other criminal acts has this miscreant committed to further the agenda ?

Regards...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 16, 2014, 01:51:05 AM
So again I ask.  What do you gain by bringing something up like the CDC whistleblower then refusing to talk about it?

Seems like you are the troll.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 16, 2014, 01:57:06 AM
So again I ask.  What do you gain by bringing something up like the CDC whistleblower then refusing to talk about it?

Seems like you are the troll.

A number of readers wrote in on falsifying documents and wood like to me to keep foot on the troll's throat.

If you play ring around the rosy with a troll long enough they reveal themselves sooner or later.

*troll officially outed*


Regards...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 16, 2014, 02:01:32 AM
So are you saying that you refuse to participate in a discussion surrounding your ideas about CDC whistleblowers?  I'll take anything that doesn't directly address this specific point as you bowing out.  That will make it easy for you to save face.  ok? :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 16, 2014, 02:08:46 AM
An inquiring mind wood like to know if the troll has personally injected any baby's...and if so, how many became autistic shortly thereafter ?

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 16, 2014, 02:17:34 AM
Well you're welcome to step into the ring anytime...thanks for making yourself look bad. :) :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 16, 2014, 02:27:42 AM
A thought in a paraphrase...

Ask not for whom the troll toils.
The troll toils for the CDC.

Regards...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 16, 2014, 03:00:24 AM


I wood submit that anyone comfortable with forgery...which is what altering someone's text is, wood also be comfortable with the CDC doing the same.



Two in one post...wow.

Quote

A number of readers wrote in on falsifying documents and wood like to me to keep foot on the troll's throat.


Another one.

Quote

An inquiring mind wood like to know if the troll has personally injected any baby's...and if so, how many became autistic shortly thereafter ?





Ummmm...Mr I Have Many Patents And Am Smarter Than Everyone, it is would, not wood...OK? Look it up.  Once is a typo, but 4 times in the last 3 posts shows your ignorance for all to see.  It makes me wonder who filled out the patent apps for you, IF you actually have any, which I doubt.  Unless you got a patent for wood working, ha ha.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 16, 2014, 03:53:14 AM
Well it looks like we're down a troll.

But...we still have the ass kisser...likely oblivious to whats happened, due to limited intelligence or lacking the foresight to catch up with the latest developments before posting.

I'm too stupid to present anything on the forum like him and another member who's ass he also kisses, have done...because they's "BUILDERS"...they left out the 'hylk hylk' at the end.

They were just begging for it, so I trumped them with the fact that I did all the work on my Canadian and US Patents...adding that they never had an original thought to call their own in their lives.

He didn't catch on that the battle had been lost...because he's too drunk on his on stupidity...or maybe its from huffing his own beer farts, who knows.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 16, 2014, 03:54:05 AM

*puts another knotch in troll belt*
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 16, 2014, 03:59:17 AM
*attempts to draw troll back into thread*


Is there anyone out there who is able to compile and compare the stats of vaccinated baby's and IV drug users ?

I'd be inclined to prognosticate that the IV drug users wood have more home runs...but the baby's wood have a much higher on base average.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 16, 2014, 04:18:26 AM
Well it looks like we're down a troll.

But...we still have the ass kisser...likely oblivious to whats happened, due to limited intelligence or lacking the foresight to catch up with the latest developments before posting.

I'm too stupid to present anything on the forum like him and another member who's ass he also kisses, have done...because they's "BUILDERS"...they left out the 'hylk hylk' at the end.

They were just begging for it, so I trumped them with the fact that I did all the work on my Canadian and US Patents...adding that they never had an original thought to call their own in their lives.

He didn't catch on that the battle had been lost...because he's too drunk on his on stupidity...or maybe its from huffing his own beer farts, who knows.

Regards...

Have you helped design and build parts that have flown on the Space Shuttle?  (STS 60, look it up)  Have you helped to design and build parts for the original Mars Lander?  Were you on the engineering team that designed the first fully functional ceramic springs? Did you machine the sapphire parts for the very first implantable hearing aid?   Did you machine ceramic parts for the F-16?  No?  Didn't think so.  Well, I have done these things and a lot more, and, I know the difference between "wood" and "would".

I have 72 videos on Youtube of my projects and experiments. 

All you seem to have is your mouth, and some weird fixation with asses and farting and being a troll while calling everyone else a troll.  If you think that is a good way to show your "intelligence", then you may want to rethink this a little bit.  All you have done thus far is to show how much you do NOT know.
My guess is that you will continue to show everyone just how much you do not know.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 16, 2014, 05:26:57 AM
Somehow, I rather doubt that anybody too dense to know when someone is intentionally using a homonym form of a word was anything more relevant than a janitor on any of those jobs.

Especially when I regularly bastardize words and phrases to suit the occasion...in my many COMEDY dissertations.

I can train a chimp to play a simple tune on a piano but that doesn't make him a pianist.

Getting in a pissing match with an ass kisser is an endless undertaking...I showed the ass kisser ol Cap wasn't as stupid as he hoped.

And he still doesn't realize his troll's ass has bailed.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 16, 2014, 06:16:43 AM


Getting in a pissing match with an ass kisser is an endless undertaking...I showed the ass kisser ol Cap wasn't as stupid as he hoped.

And he still doesn't realize his troll's ass has bailed.

Regards...

Still showing your ass fixation I see.  No one here is surprised.

Oh, I was the Design Engineer on those and many other projects, not the janitor.  I can see if that is what you do for a living you would make that assumption.  No shame in being a janitor, you should be proud of it.

Bill

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 16, 2014, 06:54:13 AM

Whats he still doing here the troll who's ass he was kissing has vamoosed ?

Hope he doesn't think mine is kissable at some point.

Regards...

*Cap ponders ways to avoid using word ass when confronted with ass kisser*

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 16, 2014, 03:51:31 PM
Another new 'vaccine scam' whistleblower has now come forward.

This time its the lead developer.


" Dr. Harper also authored many of the published, scholarly papers about the vaccines.  She is now the latest in a long string of experts who are pressing the red alert button on the devastating consequences and irrelevancy of these vaccines.  Dr. Harper made her surprising confession at the 4th International Converence on Vaccination which took place in Reston, Virginia.  "

http://universalmindradio.com/2014/12/13/lead-developer-of-hpv-vaccines-comes-clean-warns-parents-young-girls-its-all-a-giant-deadly-scam/


Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on December 16, 2014, 05:01:15 PM
@Cap
Quote

At the time of writing, 44 girls are officially known to have died from
these vaccines.  The reported side effects include Guillian Barré Syndrome
(paralysis lasting for years, or permanently — sometimes eventually causing
suffocation), lupus, seizures, blood clots, and brain inflammation.  Parents are
usually not made aware of these risks.  Dr. Harper, the vaccine developer,
claimed that she was speaking out, so that she might finally be able to sleep at
night.
Quote
“The benefit to public health is nothing, there is no reduction in cervical cancers, they are just postponed, unless the
protection lasts for at least 15 years, and over 70% of all sexually active
females of all ages are vaccinated.” 
That was a great link even though I found the article in itself very disturbing. Personally I cannot reconcile how a parent could act so irresponsibly while claiming to care for their child. I think we are going to see more and more professionals coming forward as they see their peers being open and honest about what is really happening behind the well orchestrated PR campaigns by the corporations. Greed is the primary motivator here and that is one thing I'm sure everyone can understand, I think these corporation leaders need to put in jail to set an example for the rest.

AC
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 16, 2014, 05:22:46 PM
Your post is at least close to what you were talking about so I'll respond until you won't answer questions.
Another new 'vaccine scam' whistleblower has now come forward.
Nope.  This article is primarily copypasta from material as early as 2009.  Sheep like you don't care and don't investigate.
Quote
This time its the lead developer.
Nope.  Diane Harper was not the "lead developer" there is probably no such person in a research team.  Nor is she a leading expert.  She was a site investigator one of many.  Strike #2.
Quote
"Dr. Harper made her surprising confession at the 4th International Converence on Vaccination which took place in Reston, Virginia."
...in 2009.

However if you think so much of her opinion you might consider this quote she made shortly after one of the earlier articles:
Quote from: Diane Harper
I did not say that Cervarix was as deadly as cervical cancer. I did not say that Cervarix could be riskier or more deadly than cervical cancer. I did not say that Cervarix was controversial, I stated that Cervarix is not a ‘controversial drug’. I did not ‘hit out’ – I was contacted by the press for facts. And this was not an exclusive interview.”
This was even quoted in a linked article (although it was framed as if she was being attacked but there is no evidence of this alleged attack). Also 
Quote from: Ben Goldacer who talked to Diane after that article was published
Professor Harper has complained to the PCC. “I fully support the HPV vaccines,” she says. “I believe that in general they are safe in most women. I told the Express all of this.

I don't know Dr. Harper but I've now listened to excerpts from the conference and from other anti-vaccine propaganda.  Her concern appears to be twofold one being that cervical carcinomas are slow developing and that only 5% of infected women have invasive carcinomas.  The problem with her reasoning is by the time you reach that detection level your 5 year survival is at best around 1 in 2.   So 2% of HPV infected women will die needlessly.   According to the article she has a concern about the length of time the vaccine remains active but I haven't been able to find a place where her quote isn't broken up into tiny pieces.    The idea that a vaccine would last for 15 years is far from impossible in a similar way that aquired immunity does.  If the data starts to show a drop in seroposivity you can easily add a booster to the cycle.

I think this is about the time you pick some other nugget from the article and pretend that your argument was all about that. :)  Perhaps you want to start with the VAERS bit - which as far as I can see she didn't actually say.  Since now that we're straight on efficacy you probably want to pretend you know something about harm.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 16, 2014, 05:23:25 PM
@CapThat was a great link
Estimated time allcanadian spent researching this: 0m 0s
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on December 16, 2014, 06:13:15 PM
How do we block other members posts again?, I can't find it in settings... does anyone know where to find it?

AC
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 16, 2014, 06:27:34 PM
How do we block other members posts again?, I can't find it in settings... does anyone know where to find it?
I truly mean no offense but seriously why didn't you spend any time attempting to refute the ideas presented?  Any reason other than you already agreed with them?   Why is that not anywhere close to a priority for SeaMonkey, Capt-Mo-Ron and yourself?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 16, 2014, 08:09:02 PM
In true CDC style, this CDC troll has already been caught altering my text for his own purposes.

What other text from others is he altering is now the question ?

If...the whistleblower really has recanted, I can think of 2 good reasons for the about face.

1. money
2. threats

I can only think of 1 good reason for her initial words...guilty remorse.

Allcanadian, you correctly identified greed as a prime motive for the CDC altering their test results to further their sick agenda.

Greed will get them in the door, the ghoulish goal in this processes is depopulation

There are no shortage of psychopaths like the nazi Mengala in the cabal...and there are endless ghoulish methods used along the way.

Greed is a great motivating factor to attract participants no doubt though.

Regards...


Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 16, 2014, 08:22:35 PM
If...the whistleblower really has recanted, I can think of 2 good reasons for the about face.
Actually if you read the quote you'll see that it does not appear to be a recant.   She complained to the PCC.  That's the Press Complaints Commission about the Express's handing of the story containing what appeared to be her coming out against HPV vaccines.  So you're wrong again.
Quote
I can only think
Doubtful.
Quote
1 good reason for her initial words...guilty remorse.
Again if you spent even a few minutes researching rather than uncritically accepting you would also find that it's more likely she was misrepresented at least partially.  In fact she denies that she gave the talk at IPCV so she "could sleep at night" you can find this information in several locations including an interview on an anti-vaccine propaganda show.

See instead of turning your poorly researched idea into yet another conspiracy theory.  You could actually listen to the things she has said and her criticisms of HPV vaccines and then have a position actually based on information.

Ah well... As I've said you put no effort into investigating this before posting it.  So as SeaMonkey talks about things like the "search for Truth".  You can rest assured that you're not part of it. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on December 16, 2014, 09:51:35 PM
I think this about sums it up....
http://time.com/3634443/cards-against-humanity-poop-black-friday/#3634443/cards-against-humanity-poop-black-friday/ (http://time.com/3634443/cards-against-humanity-poop-black-friday/#3634443/cards-against-humanity-poop-black-friday/)
Quote
And so Cards Against Humanity decided to create a media spectacle of its own
by pulling all of its products off its site and only selling “Bullshit” — which
Temkin says sold out in less than two hours
Now one has to ask why 30,000 people would buy a box of BS at $6 a pop which was labelled as BS and disclosed as BS?. I think this pretty much explains everything doesn't it?, I mean we really don't have to debate this any futher. Why we could tell people something was killing them, we could offer proof it was and I bet there would still be a line up of people willing to pay for it, lol, priceless.

AC
 
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 16, 2014, 10:18:35 PM
I think
If you had I'm sure it would be front page news.
Quote
Now one has to ask why 30,000 people would buy a box of BS at $6 a pop which was labelled as BS and disclosed as BS?
Well while it was clearly labeled CAH has a history of pranking customers and having a sense of humor about their product.  Clearly that and the culture surrounding black friday was enough to cause some people to think that CAH was selling something they wanted.   Perhaps some just thought it was a novelty item.  People have sold poop on the internet before.
Quote
I think this pretty much explains everything doesn't it?, I mean we really don't have to debate this any futher.
Please, please don't characterize what you do as "debate".  You devalue the word.
Quote
Why we could tell people something was killing them, we could offer proof it was and I bet there would still be a line up of people willing to pay for it
In specific cases this is not much of an exaggeration.  For example tobacco is exactly what you describe - in fact it's far deadlier than your made-up 5% figure for "some vaccines".  However it's helped considerably by being rather addictive and legal.  However this does not hold for vaccines.  In fact since Wakefield and various other people shilling anti-vaccine nonsense there is a detectable decrease in vaccinations.   Not to mention that you have let your mask slip a bit there.  A few posts back you were "let people make their own decisions" now you seem to be saying that there is proof that vaccines kill people (presumably in some way that the diseases they protect against don't)

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 16, 2014, 11:19:16 PM
Please, please don't characterize what you do as "debate".  You devalue the word.


Yeah AC...if you want to score points in a debate you must alter your opponents text like the CDC troll does.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 16, 2014, 11:33:04 PM
Yeah AC...if you want to score points in a debate you
...have to debate.  i.e. have a point, support it and be able to respond rationally to criticism. 

Fixed that for you. :) :) :)

Did you notice that when you stepped into the ring you had to leave pretty quickly. :) :) but hey if you can make an actual point about guardsil or cdc whistleblowers.  I'm listening...or are you backing down (aka talking about anything other than the point you brought up) if the later.  I think that was a one punch KO. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on December 16, 2014, 11:55:51 PM
@Cap
Quote
Yeah AC...if you want to score points in a debate you must alter your opponents
text like the CDC troll does.
Regards...
You know I use to enjoy the banter with spam posters but after a while it's just seems lame because it is pointless. There is no debate in it nor is it informitive in any way its just ridiculous so I generally opt out of the conversation. I liked your last link by the way and facebooked it, thanks again.

AC
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 17, 2014, 12:08:16 AM
@CapYou know I use to enjoy the banter with spam posters but after a while it's just seems lame because it is pointless.
You must be the straight man on this comedy team.
Quote
There is no debate in it
Dude.  There's no debate because you don't know how!  Make a point, support it and be ready to respond to rational critique.
Quote
nor is it informitive in any way
Seriously?  Cap-Z-ro posts a link to an article that he has barely read.  I point out that he didn't even read the parts it linked to which had quotes from the subject of the article saying exactly the opposite of what Cap-Z-ro's article said about her.  Pointing that out adding no information?

I also provided quotes from Ben Goldacre who actually TALKED to the person in question quoted her complaining about the way the article was presented.  Also the article was from a source which gets sued for libel a lot (this information is in a link from the very article that Cap-Z-ro posted).  Was that no information there?

I also provided Dr. Harpers concerns about Gardasil which I got from an anti-vaccine radio interview.  I provided my counter point.  Again you are actually saying there is no information in any of my response(s) at all?  No potential possible alternative viewpoint you could somehow divine from all that?   This is why it's hard to take you seriously.
Quote
I liked your last link by the way and facebooked it, thanks again.
See I have to think that you're either just part of this Abbott and Costello trolling team or you're hoping that making yourself look silly somehow bothers me. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 17, 2014, 12:14:37 AM

Fixed that for you. :) :) :)


Well...wasn't that nice of him ? 

Forgot one crucial detail tho...an apology...offered with faux sincerity of course.

Actually going back and UN-altering my text.

In other words, he got caught and is trying to cover it up.

Who does that remind you of...the CDC perhaps ?


A thief who, when caught returns the money is just a thief who gets caught and puts back what he stole.

Another Mulligan was it now ?

Maybe Dr Phil can rehabilitate him..he can hire a PR Firm to make it look as though he is remorseful and is now a changed man.

I'm afraid another moniker is in order...that troll name is used up.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 17, 2014, 12:19:40 AM
Well...wasn't that nice of him ? 
I'm a nice guy.  So is this your way of saying you're "out of ammo" with regard to the CDC whistleblower and now the Diane Harper alleged whistleblower points?  I'll take any response that doesn't directly further those arguments as you bowing out.  Ok?  Thanks. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 17, 2014, 01:36:18 AM
I'm a nice guy.  So is this your way of saying you're "out of ammo" with regard to the CDC whistleblower and now the Diane Harper alleged whistleblower points?  I'll take any response that doesn't directly further those arguments as you bowing out.  Ok?  Thanks. :)

Don't hold your breath.  CapZron has already made it quite clear that he did not even read the link he posted prior to posting, or he never would have posted it.

It is one thing to be a paid troll, but Cap does it for free...probably because his own life is boring I suppose.  Sad really.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 17, 2014, 02:00:17 AM
Vaccine Pandemic Targets the Innocent. (http://henrymakow.com/2014/12/Vaccine-Pandemic-Maims-the-Innocent.html)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 17, 2014, 02:18:06 AM
The Depopulation Agenda. (http://henrymakow.com/200202.html)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 17, 2014, 02:58:16 AM
A Letter to the New World Order (https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=PQFy2p3cJDc)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 17, 2014, 03:16:33 AM
The Depopulation Agenda. (http://henrymakow.com/200202.html)


I didn't get a chance (yet) to read the link you probably didn't read either SM, but maybe the fraudster troll will let us know if it concerns him and his bumboy...who won't be reading it either, but will nevertheless agree with ever he says...not that it really matters.

Is is that ass clowns advocating that launching a chemical and biological witches brew into the blood stream is a good idea.

Isn't it a paradox that governments have billions to spend on but pennies if any on organic based medicine...but instead force us to have a 'chemical and biological witches brew' injected into our bloodstream.

This is of course to stop an epidemic...but who get vaccinated shouldn't care about all us dummies who refuse the injection...but thy do, don't they...a WHOLE lot...to the point of forcibly injecting children...i wonder why that is ?

After all, the parents are obviously of low intellect, and so must be the children...so, why not let them cull themselves...I mean, how else are they going to meet their Georgia Guidestones objective of nine billion humans eliminated ?

Oh, I forgot, they really love bombing women and children, so that may take a while.

But in the end, I must confess to all, that also am an advocate of vaccines...for all willing to have them...this wood go a long way toward eliminating the need for literacy programs.

Regards...


Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 17, 2014, 03:18:25 AM
The Depopulation Agenda. (http://henrymakow.com/200202.html)
While I think it's fascinating that the person who designed the game "scruples" is suffering under some kind of delusion.  It only takes four sentences before we read this: "We have been conditioned to scoff at the mention of conspiracy The idea that people might plan something without telling the intended victims is much too farfetched!"

We could break this down into a formal argument as such:

i) People scoff at the mention of conspiracy
ii) Conspiracy is only someone doing something without telling you
iii) People act against people without telling them every day.
iv) Therefore it is wrong to scoff at Conspiracy.

This is a logical fallacy.  The problem is that while the definition of "conspiracy" is a secret agreement to do something illegal.  That's not what people are probably scoffing at.  Popular conspiracy theories often require immense collusion and near perfect secrecy.  People tend to scoff at things like this simply because they can imagine how hard it is to pull of both of those things.

You could call this fallacious reasoning a number of things but I'd call it "implied equivocation". The kind of conspiracy we are about to talk about (and people scoff at) is not of the same order as planning a surprise party.

While this doesn't discredit Makaow's entire post and I apologize for not having read much further (Perhaps to the logically deficient Cap-Z-ro this says that I can't find a problem) but IMHO if you're REALLY interested in convincing people (and maybe he's not) and you're any good at arguing.  It wouldn't be hard to come up with a better opening.

But perhaps he has some awesome arguments later on...if I get bored I may check it out or if someone can pull out one of his stellar arguments I'd be willing to take a look.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 17, 2014, 03:29:15 AM

Quoted in part:

troll ...bumboy... ass clowns...forgot, they really love bombing women and children...wood...literacy programs.

Regards...

Wow, this boy really needs some help.  I really love how he, once again, incorrectly uses the word "wood" when he clearly means "would".  Then he mentions literacy programs.  This troll keeps slam dunking himself so, probably no need for me to comment further. He is showing his true colors so, I guess he should be complimented for that...but...damn.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 17, 2014, 03:38:31 AM
John Pilger on the sorry state of Western Journalism (https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=HAGyXF80u2g).

Why 'The Lie' is pushed with vigor and Truth is air-
brushed out of existence.

The 'Secret Power' is very busy with its AGENDA of
deception.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 17, 2014, 03:41:29 AM
@CapYou know I use to enjoy the banter with spam posters but after a while it's just seems lame because it is pointless. There is no debate in it nor is it informitive in any way its just ridiculous so I generally opt out of the conversation. I liked your last link by the way and facebooked it, thanks again.

AC

Your point is well taken AC...because people on forums such as this one are awakening and seeking answers, and I am aware trolls are hired to short circuit the learning curve in order to buy time until the inbred elite have total control of us, I feel duty bound to discredit them as they poop up...allowing people more room to grow.

I do have to admit to somewhat enjoying the chaos and flux routine I put them through before they slip up, revealing their true nature.

My life's experiences has suited me well for the task...enjoying a good laugh helps considerably.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 17, 2014, 03:52:21 AM


My life's experiences has suited me well for the task...enjoying a good laugh helps considerably.

Regards...

Should read: "have", due to the plural of experiences.

Please take a remedial course in English.  Not having command of the English language makes you an easy target in any debate, and casts doubt on any "facts" that you might put forward, should you choose to do so.

Bill

PS  I do agree with the good laugh part of your post as you have provided me with many...and I thank you.  More than once, I have spit moonshine all over my keyboard.  Hate to waste good shine but, the laughs were worth it.
Note:  There is no mercury in my moonshine.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 17, 2014, 03:58:51 AM
*the gramatical Groom of the Stool hath drool'd*

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 17, 2014, 04:12:33 AM
Pay no mind folkses...he's likely had won to many - vaccinations, that iss.

We's got us a IV zombie hear.

Its is probably not his fault tho...the first few were on his parents dime.

Regards...


Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 17, 2014, 04:14:39 AM
Vaccine Pandemic Targets the Innocent. (http://henrymakow.com/2014/12/Vaccine-Pandemic-Maims-the-Innocent.html)
Since SeaMonkey lacks any kind of faculties to actually make an argument but loves to post link after link that he/she has barely read and certainly not taken even the slightest amount of time to try an refute.  I'll read what I can until I read something stupid.   Then I'll explain how stupid it is and why.  Then I'll ignore it unless some individual wants to draw my attention to a specific part.  In which case I'll try to respond.

So again a few sentences in we read this: "After years of mandating the cowpox vaccine in England and Japan, the death rates skyrocketed and the vaccines were eventually stopped."

Like a number of people here there's no reference at all.  It sounds a bit like Gary Null.  Anyway the mention of Japan was interesting...and wrong.  A 1910 public health record shows these numbers for smallpox deaths.

1898 40000
1899 4000
1900 721
1904 237
1905 3388
1906 109
1907 437

Vaccination history in Japan is complicated but before 1857 is was done in secret - Western medicine was still frowned upon (except for specific surgeries).  After it was done through private centers and from what I've read sometime during the Meiji restoration vaccination started to gain ground as a public service - perhaps around the 1890s and as you can see the death rate dropped even as vaccinations probably increased.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 17, 2014, 04:22:58 AM
Well...somebody prone to fraud sure seems to have a lot of time on his hands.

Or maybe a pipeline to the inbred elite's office staff.

Just sayin'

Regards...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 17, 2014, 04:44:53 AM
Well...somebody prone to fraud sure seems to have a lot of time on his hands.

Or maybe a pipeline to the inbred elite's office staff.

Just sayin'

Regards...

Wow!  Finally a post with real facts and verifiable citations and links.  What a retort.

Oh wait...

Never mind.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 17, 2014, 05:10:44 AM
Well...somebody prone to fraud sure seems to have a lot of time on his hands
Well I'll take that as you admitting you have nothing to say with regard to your prior two points.   Thanks again for embarrassing yourself. :)

Anytime you want to jump in that ring.  I'll be here to knock you out in one (metaphorical) punch. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on December 17, 2014, 05:14:15 AM
@Sark
Quote
Seriously?  Cap-Z-ro posts a link to an article that he has barely read.  I point out that he didn't even read the parts it linked to which had quotes from the subject of the article saying exactly the opposite of what Cap-Z-ro's article said about her.  Pointing that out adding no information?

I also provided quotes from Ben Goldacre who actually TALKED to the person in question quoted her complaining about the way the article was presented.  Also the article was from a source which gets sued for libel a lot (this information is in a link from the very article that Cap-Z-ro posted).  Was that no information there?

I also provided Dr. Harpers concerns about Gardasil which I got from an anti-vaccine radio interview.  I provided my counter point.  Again you are actually saying there is no information in any of my response(s) at all?  No potential possible alternative viewpoint you could somehow divine from all that?   This is why it's hard to take you seriously.

I read the article and found it interesting and informative as I said then you spam posted it with equally unsubstantiated claims and I ignored them... exactly which part of this do you not understand?. You seem to get all hot and bothered trying to prove yourself to the point of being obsessed by it.. No offence but instead of spam posting why not try to interact on a more personal level like a real person. I understand what your saying however I'm not convinced, no big deal, stay calm.

I also liked the logical fallacy bit, lol, I always get a kick out of that because the context is almost never logic or reason but more so narcissism. I see people trying to use this all the time however it is a bit of an art and to be honest I think you could have done better... something to consider in the future.


You seem to be a logical person so I would like to hear your thoughts on statistics which apply here. We all know about statistics don't we and it seems logical however I always had a problem with it. Now let's say the odds of winning the lottery are ten million to one however we know almost every week someone wins the lottery. So the odds for them on winning are obviously 100% and everyone else zero. Which is a way of saying the odds of statistics do apply up until the point you are actually effected by them directly.


By the same token we could say the odds of a severe reaction to immunizations is extremely low however when your child is in emergency because of a severe reaction then the statistics really don't mean jack shit do they?. As well in those rare cases resulting in death which are about the same as winning the lottery one has to wonder was it really worth it?. You see people love to talk about statistics only because they truly believe they will never be personally effected by them however when they are they are only left with unanswered questions and guilt.


You see statistics are completely impersonal however we are not, we are real people with real feelings who care deeply about the ones we love which is why I research everything and debate these issues with people like you. So tell me something I don't know... convince me otherwise.



AC
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 17, 2014, 06:14:32 AM
@Sark
You seem to get all hot and bothered trying to prove yourself to the point of being obsessed by it.

In this particular case he's trying to deflect attention away from the fact that he fraudulently altered the content of my text...sound like a familiar CDC M.O. ?


Quote
No offence but instead of spam posting why not try to interact on a more personal level like a real person.

Because he isn't, thats why.

Regards...



Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 17, 2014, 06:14:57 AM
I read the article and found it interesting and informative
Out of curiosity can you give me say two or three things that the article said which were new information to you and were exceptionally well supported?  I mean, that's part of what I'd call "interesting and informative".  Wouldn't you?
Quote
as I said then you spam posted it with equally unsubstantiated claims
If there's a particular part of my post that you believe is unsubstantiated then please.  Simply point it out.  Most of the substantiation for what I said is actually in the article or linked from it.  So if you read it, you didn't read it very well and you certainly didn't follow up on it. As I say though I will happily provide what you think is missing.
Quote
You seem to get all hot and bothered trying to prove yourself to the point of being obsessed by it
LOL. Then you really are not understanding my posts.  I mean if you're saying that out of everything I posted in response to that you couldn't find one thing that presented a reasonable alternative viewpoint to what the article presented.  That's cool.  I'd love to hear you say so plainly though.
Quote
No offence but instead of spam posting
No offence but it's simply not spam not under any useful definition.  It's a clear response to what was stated in the article:  The article says X.  The reality is probably more like Y.
Quote
I understand what your saying however I'm not convinced
Dude.  Don't take this the wrong way but you just blather. Seriously I've probably asked you for a half-dozen cites for things you expressed or implied as externally verifiable and you have provided almost nothing (other than urls from drugstores and wall mart which were actually beside the point).  So ask yourself if that's really worth any energy to convince.

Quote
I also liked the logical fallacy bit, lol, I always get a kick out of that because the context is almost never logic or reason but more so narcissism
If you have an actual argument.  Feel free to present it.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 17, 2014, 06:22:30 AM
Mass Sterilization effort in Kenya (http://wakeupfromyourslumber.com/mass-sterilization-kenyan-doctors-find-anti-fertility-agent-in-un-tetanus-vaccine/).
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on December 17, 2014, 06:27:08 AM
ok I was editing my post when everyone decided to respond, we might need a re-do, lol.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 17, 2014, 06:30:08 AM
Mass Sterilization effort in Kenya (http://wakeupfromyourslumber.com/mass-sterilization-kenyan-doctors-find-anti-fertility-agent-in-un-tetanus-vaccine/).
OK so you've got the alarming claim.  Now, if you dig a little deeper you will find out the claims are nonsense because the vaccine does not contain HCG.  When the vaccine samples were tested at a high quality lab, they registered lower HCG than the tap water.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 17, 2014, 06:30:45 AM
Its going on everywhere...plastics leeching estrogen into the landfills and then into the water aquifers has lowered male sperm count significantly=infertility=sterilization=checkmate.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on December 17, 2014, 06:42:12 AM
@Sark


Think of it this way, how about you apply the rules you apply to me to yourself and I think that should just about answer all your questions concerning your last post. You ask for proof and references and citations none of which you have actually provided. Now why would you think I should do such a thing when neither of us have?. You may want to rethink this because in my opinion you are being unreasonable in thinking I need to prove anything hence the reason I use the phase-- in my opinion.


AC
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on December 17, 2014, 06:46:31 AM
@mark E
Quote
OK so you've got the alarming claim.  Now, if you dig a little deeper you will find out the claims are nonsense because the vaccine does not contain HCG.  When the vaccine samples were tested at a high quality lab, they registered lower HCG than the tap water.


Google Ultra-low level testing relating to toxins and long term exposure and it should explain everything. The scientific studies suggest there are levels well below that considered safe which do more harm over time that the levels actually considered safe.


AC
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 17, 2014, 06:47:35 AM
Mass Sterilization effort in Kenya (http://wakeupfromyourslumber.com/mass-sterilization-kenyan-doctors-find-anti-fertility-agent-in-un-tetanus-vaccine/).
Well it's kind of half-ish-right.  Fertility vaccines have been researched (mostly for animals) for decades.  hCG is used in one I know of.  The thing missing from this article that would make it useful is the amount of hCG detected in their lab reports.  Why would you do that?  Thankfully it was in the WHO report 1.12 mIU/ml in what I assume was the "churches" samples.  Assuming the  higher level results are correct there is simply no possibility that any sane person would think this is an attempt to sterilize someone.   As these are well within the observed values in non-pregnant women.

Again...a few seconds would have made you look smarter. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 17, 2014, 07:02:47 AM
You ask for proof and references and citations none of which you have actually provided.
Actually I've provided a few and I've made a completely open offer to respond to any specific request you ask for.
Quote
Now why would you think I should do such a thing when neither of us have?
The difference is the willingness to do so.  If you say: "Right here you say X and I'd like to see a reference for that".  I will be more than happy to comply.  See I don't fault you for having a stupid opinion, or not sourcing it but you should be willing and able to do so when asked, even if you don't like the way you've been asked.  There are dozens of comments I could make about your conduct but I simply don't think it's relevant to the discussion.
Quote
You may want to rethink this because in my opinion you are being unreasonable in thinking I need to prove anything
Well that's good because I haven't asked you to prove anything.  I've asked you to provide external support for assertions you've made - which appear to be based on external data.
Quote
hence the reason I use the phase-- in my opinion.
I'm not calling into question that these...ideas...are your opinions.  I'm just giving you the opportunity to differentiate them from poor, uninformed and unsubstantiated....opinions. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on December 17, 2014, 07:04:42 AM
@Cap
Quote
Its going on everywhere...plastics leeching estrogen into the landfills and then into the water aquifers has lowered male sperm count significantly=infertility=sterilization=checkmate.Regards...


I would agree we now know ultra low level contamination may play a major role however we should work the problem backwards. It is not a contamination problem but a habitual issue concerning people doing stupid things. Trying to bury our problems never has worked because at some point someone is going to have to deal with them. We simply pretend the problem does not exist not unlike those billion tons of plastic particles floating around in our oceans. Denial is not a solution but i think you know this all too well.


AC
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 17, 2014, 07:14:38 AM
And all the while a very high yield organic source for bio degradable plastic is readily available and right under our noses...hemp based plastic.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 17, 2014, 08:30:16 AM
@Sark
I read the article and found it interesting and informative as I said then you spam posted it with equally unsubstantiated claims and I ignored them... exactly which part of this do you not understand?. You seem to get all hot and bothered trying to prove yourself to the point of being obsessed by it.. No offence but instead of spam posting why not try to interact on a more personal level like a real person. I understand what your saying however I'm not convinced, no big deal, stay calm.

I also liked the logical fallacy bit, lol, I always get a kick out of that because the context is almost never logic or reason but more so narcissism. I see people trying to use this all the time however it is a bit of an art and to be honest I think you could have done better... something to consider in the future.


You seem to be a logical person so I would like to hear your thoughts on statistics which apply here. We all know about statistics don't we and it seems logical however I always had a problem with it. Now let's say the odds of winning the lottery are ten million to one however we know almost every week someone wins the lottery. So the odds for them on winning are obviously 100% and everyone else zero. Which is a way of saying the odds of statistics do apply up until the point you are actually effected by them directly.


By the same token we could say the odds of a severe reaction to immunizations is extremely low however when your child is in emergency because of a severe reaction then the statistics really don't mean jack shit do they?. As well in those rare cases resulting in death which are about the same as winning the lottery one has to wonder was it really worth it?. You see people love to talk about statistics only because they truly believe they will never be personally effected by them however when they are they are only left with unanswered questions and guilt.


You see statistics are completely impersonal however we are not, we are real people with real feelings who care deeply about the ones we love which is why I research everything and debate these issues with people like you. So tell me something I don't know... convince me otherwise.



AC
Lightning does strike.  Sometimes it strikes an unlucky person.  The decision to act in one way or another is rational if based on knowable facts the action reduces the chances of an unfavorable outcome / increases the chances of a favorable outcome.  For instance in your decision not to vaccinate your kids what did you do to determine that the odds of them being stricken with: smallpox, polio, mumps etc versus being stricken by something equal or worse as a result of the vaccinations that you avoided?  Have you also refused them tetanus vaccinations?  If so again:  What data did you rely on to make that choice?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on December 17, 2014, 08:42:11 AM
Many people here have made some very good arguments concerning their opinions however I think it is different when it becomes personal. I know very few relatives who have died from old age and most all have died of cancer. The statistics suggest cancer, diabetes, ms etc.. will reach epidemic proportions in the near future. Why today just this afternoon I was informed that a relative passed away due to brain cancer and she will me sorely missed. To you she was just another statistic, yet another number another topic for debate but to me she was a person, a loved one.


So all this debate is wonderful until that statistic, that opinion or than logic you need to get through the day hits home where you live. At which point it's relevancy seems diminished, it's importance somehow forgotten. We can presume to understand, we may justify it by any means but that cannot change what it is, the reality of this world in which we live.


Why today I came on shift to find a weeks worth of problems I solved in a matter of hours, possibly 20 trained and qualified people came and they left scratching theirs heads and I waltzed in and did what I do. It is a peculiar thing that it is presumed we are equal and yet we are people, why I know a few people of supposedly equal expertise I would not let change the tire on my truck. So we are left with the notion that expertise must be relevant, it must be applicable and up to date. I'm just another redneck farmboy but what I do I expect to do well.


So yes believe whatever you need to get you through the day but know we are not equal, we were born equal but from that day forward what we do and think determines who we are. So yes, it was kind of a stipulation the good book(s) forgot to mention because we are not equal.


So the question remains, with whom are you willing to place your trust?. With some dip-shit who sounds intelligent, a person who believes in a bearded man in a white dress who created the universe in six days or a scientist who was proven then dis-proven by his peers but only after the fact. We live, we learn then we die... those are the facts but it is what we do in between the living and dying that matters most. So this proof and belief everyone speaks about is constrained by time because everything we know must change with time... it is a constant we we all know and believe on some level.


That's my rant
AC

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 17, 2014, 08:54:47 AM
@mark E

Google Ultra-low level testing relating to toxins and long term exposure and it should explain everything. The scientific studies suggest there are levels well below that considered safe which do more harm over time that the levels actually considered safe.


AC
The erroneous claim was that HCG was in the vaccines, and put there in order to sterilize those who received the vaccine.  The facts show that when tested by a properly equipped and capable laboratory, HCG was not found in the vaccines.  Ergo both claims are false.

Now, you've jumped horses and want to argue that the HCG is really there in minute quantities? That's not what competent labs found.  They did not find any.  Or are you arguing that there was something else in the vaccine? If so, what, and what is the evidence for its alleged harmful effects?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 17, 2014, 09:01:17 AM
Many people here have made some very good arguments concerning their opinions however I think it is different when it becomes personal. I know very few relatives who have died from old age and most all have died of cancer. The statistics suggest cancer, diabetes, ms etc.. will reach epidemic proportions in the near future. Why today just this afternoon I was informed that a relative passed away due to brain cancer and she will me sorely missed. To you she was just another statistic, yet another number another topic for debate but to me she was a person, a loved one.


So all this debate is wonderful until that statistic, that opinion or than logic you need to get through the day hits home where you live. At which point it's relevancy seems diminished, it's importance somehow forgotten. We can presume to understand, we may justify it by any means but that cannot change what it is, the reality of this world in which we live.


Why today I came on shift to find a weeks worth of problems I solved in a matter of hours, possibly 20 trained and qualified people came and they left scratching theirs heads and I waltzed in and did what I do. It is a peculiar thing that it is presumed we are equal and yet we are people, why I know a few people of supposedly equal expertise I would not let change the tire on my truck. So we are left with the notion that expertise must be relevant, it must be applicable and up to date. I'm just another redneck farmboy but what I do I expect to do well.


So yes believe whatever you need to get you through the day but know we are not equal, we were born equal but from that day forward what we do and think determines who we are. So yes, it was kind of a stipulation the good book(s) forgot to mention because we are not equal.


So the question remains, with whom are you willing to place your trust?. With some dip-shit who sounds intelligent, a person who believes in a bearded man in a white dress who created the universe in six days or a scientist who was proven then dis-proven by his peers but only after the fact. We live, we learn then we die... those are the facts but it is what we do in between the living and dying that matters most. So this proof and belief everyone speaks about is constrained by time because everything we know must change with time... it is a constant we we all know and believe on some level.


That's my rant
AC
Well yes it is a rant, that doesn't bother me.  Now, would you be good enough to answer my questions?  I am trying to determine whether the actions that you said you took: specifically keeping your kids from being vaccinated were based on a reasoned interpretation of facts or superstition.  If one of them has or does suffer a major cut: something that requires stitches, did you or would you refuse them a tetanus vaccination?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 17, 2014, 02:39:56 PM
however I think it is different when it becomes personal. I know very few relatives who have died from old age and most all have died of cancer. The statistics suggest cancer, diabetes, ms etc.. will reach epidemic proportions in the near future.

 Why today just this afternoon I was informed that a relative passed away due to brain cancer and she will me sorely missed. To you she was just another statistic, yet another number another topic for debate but to me she was a person, a loved one.
You are all over the place here.  I'm going to try to paraphrase and find something inside that mess of barely cogent sentences.

I get that we feel bad when someone we care about dies (often people one doesn't care about affect us).  However if we are talking about anything we are talking about what is causing some alleged deaths.  You say "vaccines have killed or seriously harmed people - up to 1 in 20 in some cases".  I say you have to be deliberately trying to think poorly to believe that.
Quote
Why today I came on shift to find a weeks worth of problems I solved in a matter of hours, possibly 20 trained and qualified people came and they left scratching theirs heads and I waltzed in and did what I do. It is a peculiar thing that it is presumed we are equal and yet we are people, why I know a few people of supposedly equal expertise I would not let change the tire on my truck. So we are left with the notion that expertise must be relevant, it must be applicable and up to date. I'm just another redneck farmboy but what I do I expect to do well.
Nobody is saying that all people are equal in every respect.  Given that you accept this, why can't you accept that you are absolutely completely and utterly terrible at looking at vaccine safety objectively?  Why can't you admit that you never really did the kind of diligence that you would require of yourself in your job to reach the conclusions you did?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 17, 2014, 02:56:02 PM
Google Ultra-low level testing relating to toxins and long term exposure and it should explain everything. The scientific studies suggest there are levels well below that considered safe which do more harm over time that the levels actually considered safe.
I get that SeaMonkey's particular brain damage doesn't let him/her actually state what point s/he is trying to make with those link-only posts.  However it at least appears the point was:

i) Certain vaccines contain hCG
ii) hCG is a sterilizing agent (this is oversimplifying the biochemistry a bit)
iii) Therefore vaccines are being used to sterilize parts of Kenya.

However as the WHO reported these are the levels which are common in women humans.  Meaning if this level was sufficient to sterilize anyone then the expectation would be that most people are sterile.  Which seems at least prima facie untrue.  It's also worth mentioning that hCG isn't a sterility agent per se.  It's actually a chemical produced in the human body.  During pregnancy it's produced in large enough quantities that most pregnancy tests are actually hCG hormone tests.

So you can't really use your "trace amounts" gambit on something we bio-synthesize.  Of course if you had spent even a few seconds researching your view before launching into your "trace amounts" defense.  You would have known this.

This is what I mean about spending time to REFUTE things you already agree with.  If MarkE or myself hadn't stepped in this would have become yet another post on your facebook wall.  You would make the same arguments with people who responded like we did and some of them you would dupe.  IMHO you are responsible for the people you deceive when you are so negligent that you won't even make a 15s check.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on December 17, 2014, 04:52:54 PM
@Mark E
Quote
Well yes it is a rant, that doesn't bother me.  Now, would you be good enough
to answer my questions?  I am trying to determine whether the actions that you
said you took: specifically keeping your kids from being vaccinated were based
on a reasoned interpretation of facts or superstition.  If one of them has or
does suffer a major cut: something that requires stitches, did you or would you
refuse them a tetanus vaccination?
Oh dear here we go, lol,  the "same logic" argument never actually did work for me. Let me guess, if I say yes I'm a hypocrite and if I say no I'm irresponsible however I'm going to choose option C which is that every vaccine has it's own risk assessment... they are not all the same. It's like flying on a jet and trying to justify the risks by thinking it is know technology and perfectly safe and it is however the actual risk is based on the competency of that technician who replaced those rivets in the wing section last week, the fight he had with his wife the night prior and how much he drank after that which effected his performance. In which case the "same logic" same airplane, same physics, same statistics model simply does not apply because it did not include that drunk technician who just inadvertently killed everyone. You see the risks are conditional and change the moment you enter the cause and effect loop unless you opt out or change the conditions.
All of my family has had a tetanus shot however I would think you would agree the risk of stepping on a rusty nail is just a little bit different than contracting polio which WHO has stated no longer exists on this planet. The risks concerning every vaccine, every drug should be weighed carefully because obviously they are not all the same.
AC
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on December 17, 2014, 05:46:18 PM
@Sark
Quote
This is what I mean about spending time to REFUTE things you already agree
with.  If MarkE or myself hadn't stepped in this would have become yet another
post on your facebook wall.  You would make the same arguments with people who
responded like we did and some of them you would dupe.  IMHO you are responsible
for the people you deceive when you are so negligent that you won't even make a
15s check.
Oh I would agree, you guys are like the white supremicists of logic who live in a world of black and white with no shades of gray. I mean you should get some of those white dresses with the pointy hats and big red letters spelling "logicle" on the front.
However life is chaotic and has a way of coming full circle and biting us in the ass when we least expect it, when it does then we will talk. Maybe you could track down those who's children have been crippled or died due to complications, I'm sure they would love to hear your opinions and you could straighten them out and tell them how it is.

AC
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 17, 2014, 06:09:12 PM
simply does not apply because it did not include that drunk technician who just inadvertently killed everyone. You see the risks are conditional and change the moment you enter the cause and effect loop unless you opt out or change the conditions.
You are effectively saying it is impossible to generalize risk. By that logic every bite you eat, every step you take (every move you make).  Would require separate risk assessments.  Clearly you don't believe this. 
Quote
contracting polio which WHO has stated no longer exists on this planet.
Again this is incorrect.  From the WHO Q&A on polio. 
Quote from: WHO
Polio does still exist, although polio cases have decreased by over 99% since 1988, from an estimated more than 350 000 cases to 416 reported cases in 2013. This reduction is the result of the global effort to eradicate the disease. Today, only 3 countries in the world have never stopped transmission of polio (Nigeria, Pakistan and Afghanistan).
Now the question is, you've mentioned this several times in this thread.  I'm willing to bet you've mentioned it to other people.  Are you going to go back and give them the correct information that you were so very incompetent at collecting?  Didn't think so.  It would be hard even if you wanted to.  Just another reason why you should put the effort into refuting your own ideas before you speak.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 17, 2014, 06:42:57 PM
who live in a world of black and white with no shades of gray.
Quite the opposite. I think there are shades of grey.  You, interestingly are unwilling to believe that shades exist in a few of your beliefs.

So the idea that hCG is being used to sterilize girls in Kenya was refuted because it is too low.  You came back with the statement that ultra-low doses can hurt you but you didn't bother to even have a microscopic amount of skepticism concerning SM's post.

Where were your shades of grey?  You had no doubt whatsoever when it came to talking about "ultra low doses".

You also called parents irresponsible for allowing their children to be vaccinated with guardasil stemming from an article which appears to be a mistreatment of the words of the person the article is about.  Again this was because you didn't bother to have the slightest amount of doubt about the article.

Where were the shades of grey there?

Quote
Maybe you could track down those who's children have been crippled or died due to complications
Complications with what?  Vaccines?  Wait...how do you know they were crippled or died due to vaccine complications?  That's a pretty black or white thing to say.

See the point here is sure I think vaccines are very, very safe.  Not perfectly safe, but neither is being unvaccinated and yes I think you have be deliberately obtuse to believe a number of the things you SM and Cap-Z-ro have said.  I think the best way to understand the shades of grey that exist in this world is to be self-critical.  Something, if you are honest all three of you suck donkey balls at.

SM posts an article and you say "yesssir".  I went and found the actual WHO report.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 17, 2014, 07:08:38 PM
"Considered safe"...likely by vested interests.

And relying on the WHO as a reliable source is par for the course.

Weren't they the ones pushing the H1N1 vaccine to stem the epidemic which fizzled...despite the fact that hardleyanybody fell for the scam.

You know, the disease where they patented the vaccine 3 0r 4 years before the disease appeared.

Hey...is anybody going to get the new vaccine that makes us immune to Global Warming..er..I mean Climate Change ?

Ever Mike Adams the Health Ranger Dr Oz AND Dr Phil have endorsed this one !

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 17, 2014, 07:18:20 PM
"Considered safe"...likely by vested interests.
No as testified by human females everywhere.  It is within the nominal values for women.  Again, hCG is BIOSYNTHESIZED so it's entirely reasonable to find some in a woman.  Also for the second time, pregnancy tests are usually hCG tests.  So clearly hCG is safe in some dosage for women.
Quote
And relying on the WHO as a reliable source is par for the course.
Nope.  The WHO report publishes both the lab values the Church supplied and the ones they used both are over 5 MILLION times lower that the amount given in a sterilization vaccine.

Again...all you had to do was think that perhaps you might be wrong and you wouldn't have looked stupid here.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 17, 2014, 07:29:16 PM
Solid Raindrops 50 to 60 feet Long Fall From Sky After Military Jets Fly By

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7lkAZTNwq40 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7lkAZTNwq40)


Must be more 'Global Warming'..er, I mean 'Climate Change' signs huh ?

Regards...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on December 17, 2014, 08:24:43 PM
@Sark
Quote
You are effectively saying it is impossible to generalize risk. By that logic
every bite you eat, every step you take (every move you make).  Would require
separate risk assessments.  Clearly you don't believe this. 
Now your getting it and yes obviously I do believe it because I said it. It is peculiar that most believe in a chaotic random universe and yet they still believe logic and statistics always apply. Clearly one cannot believe in both because they are in direct contradiction to one another and if something can go wrong it will as defined by Murphy's Law. Have you ever done everything right and still had it blow up in your face?, thats the universe teaching you a lesson in humility.
I imagine your one of those who believe it (random shit) will never happen to you, I mean the plane would be in a death spiral yards from the ground and you would be the one saying--- you know statistically speaking this cannot happen, in fact I can cite hundreds of references as why why this should not happen, in fact I don't believe it can happen, I think ...Splat !.
Insert unsubstantiated claim:
Quote
Polio does still exist, although polio cases have decreased by over 99% since
1988, from an estimated more than 350 000 cases to 416 reported cases in 2013.
This reduction is the result of the global effort to eradicate the disease.
Today, only 3 countries in the world have never stopped transmission of polio
(Nigeria, Pakistan and Afghanistan).
Quote
Now the question is, you've mentioned this several times in this thread.  I'm
willing to bet you've mentioned it to other people.  Are you going to go back
and give them the correct information that you were so very incompetent at
collecting?  Didn't think so.  It would be hard even if you wanted to.  Just
another reason why you should put the effort into refuting your own ideas before
you speak.
Your funny,  you have fabricated an imaginary scenario and probably even convinced yourself it may be true, in fact you may even believe it may have already happened...very strange. As I said I'm not fully convinced however if you could cite credible links of multiple independent third party studies which are actually relevant to this discussion then I would be happy to consider them. No unsubstantiated quotes please, I will need credible verifiable links if you could.
AC
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 17, 2014, 08:52:20 PM
Now your getting it and yes obviously I do believe it
It's kind of amusing that you want to go down this path.  I'm not sure if this is just your trollishness showing or if you've been cornered.
Anyway if there's absolutely no possibility of generalizing any risk. Then you can't consider any action safer than any other action because that is making a general statement about risk.  Clearly you don't believe this because...

i) You have already said that vaccines were riskier than the diseases they prevent.  That's generalizing risk.

ii) You also said you believe that people need to evaluate each type of vaccine individually.  I notice that you didn't say "every dose of the same vaccine".  Clearly you believe you can generalize risk across doses.  You also didn't include doctors, horoscopes and weather conditions because you really don't want to get that tetanus shot when Venus is in the house of Mars.

Everybody who takes an action likely believes you can bound (generalize) risk. All you appear to be doing is making up a set of special exceptions so you can preserve your silly beliefs.
Quote
Insert unsubstantiated claim:
What unsubstantiated claim?  Are you saying you don't believe that is from the WHO Q&A on Polio?
Quote
you have fabricated an imaginary scenario
What scenario?  That you think the WHO says polio doesn't exist?  You said that right here:
is just a little bit different than contracting polio which WHO has stated no longer exists on this planet.
Quote
however if you could cite credible links of multiple independent third party studies which are actually relevant to this discussion then I would be happy to consider them. No unsubstantiated quotes please, I will need credible verifiable links if you could.
As I said, I'm happy to provide references and support for any specific thing you can name as unsubstantiated.  However you notice that you haven't really mentioned a specific thing.  :) Either the WHO says currently that polio doesn't exist or it does.  It's website says it does.  Would you like a link to the specific page?  http://lmgtfy.com/?q=who+polio+q%26a
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 18, 2014, 09:23:02 AM
@Mark EOh dear here we go, lol,  the "same logic" argument never actually did work for me. Let me guess, if I say yes I'm a hypocrite and if I say no I'm irresponsible however I'm going to choose option C which is that every vaccine has it's own risk assessment... they are not all the same. It's like flying on a jet and trying to justify the risks by thinking it is know technology and perfectly safe and it is however the actual risk is based on the competency of that technician who replaced those rivets in the wing section last week, the fight he had with his wife the night prior and how much he drank after that which effected his performance. In which case the "same logic" same airplane, same physics, same statistics model simply does not apply because it did not include that drunk technician who just inadvertently killed everyone. You see the risks are conditional and change the moment you enter the cause and effect loop unless you opt out or change the conditions.
All of my family has had a tetanus shot however I would think you would agree the risk of stepping on a rusty nail is just a little bit different than contracting polio which WHO has stated no longer exists on this planet. The risks concerning every vaccine, every drug should be weighed carefully because obviously they are not all the same.
AC
AC there is no trick to my questions.  You say that out of concern for the welfare for your children you have not had them vaccinated.  If that decision was a well informed one or not depends entirely on what diligence you exercised in the course of reaching it.  I am asking you to identify the basis of your diligence. 

Certainly if you feel justified in your stated actions and would like to influence other caring families to enjoy the same benefits you claim you have bestowed upon your children, showing that you based those decisions on sound data would be a public service.  If as you say each vaccine has its own risk assessment, implying that you would allow your children to receive certain vaccines and not others, then identifying which vaccines you have or would allow and which you would not would also be important. 

Polio is still very much on this planet and the WHO is in a state of alarm about it.  The WHO had hoped to see worldwide eradication of polio infections by 2018.  Problems in certain countries now have the WHO very alarmed that polio will spread.  See:  http://www.who.int/mediacentre/news/statements/2014/polio-20140505/en/. The ways to prevent polio from spreading is two fold:  Better sanitation and as close to 100% vaccination of the population as possible. 






Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MileHigh on December 18, 2014, 03:11:50 PM
The bottom line in this debate is that vaccinations are a net plus for society and they serve the common good.  Anybody with ordinary common sense should realize this.  Just like if you have ordinary common sense you should know that your body is resilient enough to handle trace amounts of all sorts of toxic substances, and any toxic substance below a certain dosage threshold is essentially harmless.  The nonsensical panic and doom-saying about the mercury compounds to keep vaccinations bacteria-free come to mind.

Another thing for people with common sense:  I glanced at many of the links put up by the anti-vaccination crowd and the web pages are almost always "alternative tabloid trash" web sites.  The kinds of web sites that sell magnetic belts and "structured water" and other junk like that.

There is also something "nasty" (for lack of a better term) that the anti-vaccination crowd may have not addressed:  You have a responsibility to your fellow man to try to not catch dangerous communicable diseases and put others around you, or the whole population,  at risk.  They don't want to deal with the fact that their selfish actions could be harmful to others.

Here is a hypothetical scenario:  The anti-vaccination crowd wins out and 20 years from now, 3/4 of children are not vaccinated.  Then a really nasty measles or mumps virus spreads like wildfire among adolescents because nobody has immunity.   Thousands and thousands of adolescents die, schools are shut down, the medical system is overstressed, etc, etc.

If that happened where would the anti-vaccination crowd be?   I can bet you that they will be demonstrating against the government and demanding compensation.  They will claim that "the government must have known" they were stupid and misguided, and therefore it's the government's fault for not "correcting" the problem in the first place.  "Yes I was a stupid idiot and my children got really sick.  I demand that the government compensate me for my stupidity because they should have known better!"

Meanwhile, real people are unethical and also make grave mistakes in the pharmaceutical inductry.   Look, a shocker, your tax dollars at work to fix a very serious problem where the responsible people should go to prison:

http://www.cnn.com/2014/12/17/us/meningitis-outbreak-arrests/index.html?hpt=hp_t2 (http://www.cnn.com/2014/12/17/us/meningitis-outbreak-arrests/index.html?hpt=hp_t2)

Use your own common sense to weed out and ignore the people that clearly have no common sense.

MileHigh
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 18, 2014, 03:46:06 PM
If anybody wants to be "protected" that is their decision to make...if I want to die of a vaccine driven epidemic that is my decision to make as a sovereign being.

And never the twain shall meet...so to speak.

If you are vaccinated then what us sane people do shouldn't be of concern...shood it ?

In the end, natural selection will win out.

I'm comfortable with my position.

Regards...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 18, 2014, 03:58:20 PM
The bottom line in this debate is that vaccinations are a net plus for society and they serve the common good.  Anybody with ordinary common sense should realize this.  Just like if you have ordinary common sense you should know that your body is resilient enough to handle trace amounts of all sorts of toxic substances, and any toxic substance below a certain dosage threshold is essentially harmless.  The nonsensical panic and doom-saying about the mercury compounds to keep vaccinations bacteria-free come to mind.

Another thing for people with common sense:  I glanced at many of the links put up by the anti-vaccination crowd and the web pages are almost always "alternative tabloid trash" web sites.  The kinds of web sites that sell magnetic belts and "structured water" and other junk like that.

There is also something "nasty" (for lack of a better term) that the anti-vaccination crowd may have not addressed:  You have a responsibility to your fellow man to try to not catch dangerous communicable diseases and put others around you, or the whole population,  at risk.  They don't want to deal with the fact that their selfish actions could be harmful to others.

Here is a hypothetical scenario:  The anti-vaccination crowd wins out and 20 years from now, 3/4 of children are not vaccinated.  Then a really nasty measles or mumps virus spreads like wildfire among adolescents because nobody has immunity.   Thousands and thousands of adolescents die, schools are shut down, the medical system is overstressed, etc, etc.

If that happened where would the anti-vaccination crowd be?   I can bet you that they will be demonstrating against the government and demanding compensation.  They will claim that "the government must have known" they were stupid and misguided, and therefore it's the government's fault for not "correcting" the problem in the first place.  "Yes I was a stupid idiot and my children got really sick.  I demand that the government compensate me for my stupidity because they should have known better!"

Meanwhile, real people are unethical and also make grave mistakes in the pharmaceutical inductry.   Look, a shocker, your tax dollars at work to fix a very serious problem where the responsible people should go to prison:

http://www.cnn.com/2014/12/17/us/meningitis-outbreak-arrests/index.html?hpt=hp_t2 (http://www.cnn.com/2014/12/17/us/meningitis-outbreak-arrests/index.html?hpt=hp_t2)

Use your own common sense to weed out and ignore the people that clearly have no common sense.

MileHigh
What happened at NECC is an example of the kinds of results "Don't regulate" brings about.  NECC created straw patients so that they could compound "for them", when what they were really doing was selling wholesale.  They used the exemptions for small compounding pharmacies to avoid the expense and hassle of running a proper laboratory.  Now that they've been busted, maybe they'll go into compounding herbal remedies, like Mother's Nourishing Morning Glory Milk.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 18, 2014, 04:13:32 PM
If you are vaccinated then what us sane people do shouldn't be of concern...shood it ?
Depends.  Vaccines are not 100% effective and while they are very, very, very safe.  There is a tiny risk.  If a disease is eradicated (like polio will hopefully be).  It makes sense to stop vaccination.  As long as people like you are in the tiny minority and well distributed throughout society.  I don't have a problem with you being unvaccinated.   Immunocompromised people might want to push you in front of a bus though.
Quote
In the end, natural selection will win out.
Actually natural selection only affects heritable traits.  While there might be some knowledge transfer from parent to child about getting vaccinated there's still plenty of room for disinformation from people like you to influence folk.  Even if we assume an advantage to being vaccinated as I mention above.  In a minority position the unvaccinated are, protected by those who are.  Given both those things it's not that likely that selection will occur and even if it does it will take an enormously long time and of course many entirely needless deaths to accomplish this.
Quote
I'm comfortable with my position.
Because you are an idiot. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 18, 2014, 04:59:20 PM
What happened at NECC is an example of the kinds of results "Don't regulate" brings about.  NECC created straw patients so that they could compound "for them", when what they were really doing was selling wholesale.  They used the exemptions for small compounding pharmacies to avoid the expense and hassle of running a proper laboratory.  Now that they've been busted, maybe they'll go into compounding herbal remedies, like Mother's Nourishing Morning Glory Milk.
That's terribly sad.  Compounding pharms do have risks and probably need better regulation.  That said they are pretty useful.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 18, 2014, 05:28:54 PM
Because you are an idiot. :)

T'is better to be called an idiot by a fraudster and a troll than a vaccination statistic.

Regards...

*waits for fraudster to alter more text*

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 18, 2014, 06:48:45 PM
*waits for fraudster to alter more text*
What text have I altered that you're so very concerned about?  Please provide exact quotes. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: starcruiser on December 18, 2014, 07:02:12 PM
   Sarkeizen a Feminazi, at least what the name implies. Go back to your gamergate and whatever, you are not wanted here.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 18, 2014, 07:07:36 PM

How trollish and in keeping with the CDC's standard of deceit that he wood demand proof...after he already edited out the text he altered.

I didn't bother to keep a screenshot of what the CDC troll altered...his admission is still there though...unless he edited that out also.

Maybe he shood consult the forum's official ass kisser/bag licker/bumboy has a kept copy, along with my egregious grammatical faux pas's.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 18, 2014, 07:11:28 PM
   Sarkeizen a Feminazi, at least what the name implies. Go back to your gamergate and whatever, you are not wanted here.

Now, if I were a betting man..I wood bet that the odds are slim that I can make this post before the troll responds again.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 18, 2014, 07:12:50 PM
I did it !!!

I beat the troll spread.

*rushes out to buy lotto ticket*

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 18, 2014, 07:26:31 PM
after he already edited out the text he altered.
Ok...so your claim is that I altered some of your text and then changed it back.  Are you sure you didn't just imagine this?
Quote
I didn't bother to keep a screenshot of what the CDC troll altered...his admission is still there though...unless he edited that out also.
Please point me to the "admission" post?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 18, 2014, 07:27:11 PM
   Sarkeizen a Feminazi, at least what the name implies.
Why would that word imply that to you?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 18, 2014, 07:34:48 PM
Ok...so your claim is that I altered some of your text and then changed it back.  Are you sure you didn't just imagine this?Please point me to the "admission" post?

I won't bother to check, but apparently the troll deleted his admission too.

But, boy, didn't it take an awful long time to start denying what he did ?

I mean, I accused him immediately after he did it.

Now, who in their right mind, or with an ounce of self respect would let someone call them a fraud and a criminal for 3 weeks before getting around to defending themselves ?

The answer...nobody, thats who.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 18, 2014, 07:53:18 PM
I won't bother to check, but apparently the troll deleted his admission too.
Yawn.  Something can not both be unobserved and apparent.
Quote
But, boy, didn't it take an awful long time to start denying what he did ?
I haven't denied anything (but I doubt very much that I've changed anything of yours and then changed it back).  I've simply asked you to point out what you're whining about.  You won't for some reason.  Perhaps you just like whining?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 18, 2014, 08:05:40 PM
I guess the lying troll thinks nobody else noticed when i pointed it out.

Amazingly stupid.

But when you're desperate...

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MileHigh on December 18, 2014, 08:10:08 PM
I read this thread in bursts from time to time, but I don't read all of it.

I can see that Sarkeizen is making mincemeat of you, Captain Zero.  You are clearly the one that is desperate and you are clearly the one that would not make the high school debating team.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 18, 2014, 08:21:47 PM
I read this thread in bursts from time to time, but I don't read all of it.

I can see that Sarkeizen is making mincemeat of you, Captain Zero.  You are clearly the one that is desperate and you are clearly the one that would not make the high school debating team.

So...the forums empty word champion...and Luc's personal troll, makes an appearance here...after his harassment of Luc has irritated yet ANOTHER long standing member.

I know one thing, the only people I've upset here, are trolls, shills nitpickers naysayers and one ass kisser of the aforementioned.

When the troll you are "debating" resorts to fraudulently altering text in frustration, the troll is clearly the loser...literally and figuratively.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 18, 2014, 08:24:15 PM
I guess the lying troll thinks nobody else noticed when i pointed it out.
I'm simply asking you to help resolve something that appears to be an issue for you.  Why do you have a problem with that?
If you don't, then please point out where you *think* something was changed/changed back and where the changing was admitted to.

I'm sure we can talk about it. :)  That is, if resolving things is actually something you care about. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MileHigh on December 18, 2014, 08:24:54 PM
Your brain is hurting Captain Zero.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 18, 2014, 08:29:18 PM
The patronizing arrogance of these 2 trolls will be schlightly tempered (for about 5 minutes) when someone who noticed his text fixing shows up.

Regards...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 18, 2014, 08:30:36 PM
The patronizing arrogance of these 2 trolls will be schlightly tempered (for about 5 minutes) when someone who noticed his text fixing shows up.
So that's a "no" then?  You don't want to resolve this issue.  You just want to complain about it? :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 18, 2014, 08:35:05 PM
*farts to re-energise sputtering troll*

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 19, 2014, 01:03:32 AM
Time for another anti-troll reset.

Rather than take the words of CDC trolls citing vested interest stats and altered text, I choose to listen to all the whistleblowers.

Notwithstanding that one or more may have recanted.

Many of you may also recall all the US spy's paraded before cameras in the middle east, and renouncing US policies...under the threat of a gun from stage left, of course.

I can state from experience that the life of a whistleblower is never the same again...and not in a good way.

So, where's the reward for them if they are lying, is the question to be asked ?

The answer, there is none...it just doesn't add up.

And if it doesn't make sense its not true...thats why I take them seriously.

There's nothing like good old common sense as your guide.



People will say ANYTHING under duress.

Regards...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 19, 2014, 01:42:58 AM




People will say ANYTHING under duress.

Regards...

People will also say anything just to gain attention.  You are a perfect example of this.

Case in point: 

No one, except a Moderator, or Stefan (Our gracious host) can change another members postings.  Since I do not believe there are any moderators assigned to this topic area, that must mean one of two things.

1.  For some reason, you think Stefan is altering your posts.
2.  After you see how mistaken you were with a post, you simply claim that it has been "altered" in some desperate attempt to save face.

I am going with #2 on this one as no one needs to alter your posts to make you look stupid, you are doing a great job of that by yourself.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 19, 2014, 01:45:17 AM
Rather than take the words of CDC trolls citing vested interest stats
As explained, no stats showing a vested interest were cited.  wrt the alleged Kenya sterilization vaccine.  The stats that were cited included the ones that the catholic church presented.  Based on their figures which are higher than the one's the WHO lab reported.  These fall into the range that can be found in the human body.
Quote
and altered text
I suspect that all your crying about "altered text" probably amounts to nothing important.  If you had some very damning evidence you likely would have pointed it out. :)  You're probably talking about some place where I replaced your name with the other name that I call you "Cap-Mo-Ron".    I consider that word and Cap-Z-ro to be interchangeable.
Quote
I choose to listen to all the whistleblowers.
Not very closely.  The only one you seem to have listened to was Thompson who - in his own press statement - says he got his ideas after long talks with Hooker.  Who is only slightly less of a statistician than my left ass cheek. :)  The other person you "listened" to was Dr. Harper.  However the only thing you were willing to listen to of hers was a shock piece that she herself complained about being misrepresented.
Quote
Notwithstanding that one or more may have recanted.
"recant" means to change what you have said.  This really isn't what happened.

Quote
I can state from experience that the life of a whistleblower is never the same again...and not in a good way.
If your life is hard.  I'm sure you deserve it. :)
Quote
So, where's the reward for them if they are lying, is the question to be asked ?
Wrong question.  Nobody is lying.  Thompson is confused because he listened to a moron.  Much the way you are when you listened to him.  Dr. Harper isn't lying, she was misrepresented.  She complained to the press and got the article removed.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 19, 2014, 01:48:59 AM
People will also say anything just to gain attention.  You are a perfect example of this.

Case in point: 

No one, except a Moderator, or Stefan (Our gracious host) can change another members postings.
If I were to guess.  He's talking about being quoted.  I think there's one case where in a quote of his he uses his own name and I replace it with Cap-Mo-ron - the name I've been referring to him as for a while.

Your larger point is of course correct.  This is about getting attention.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 19, 2014, 02:08:17 AM
An incredibly informative interview by Ritchie
Allen of Gordon Duff  (https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=eRQ__MWhf6s)discussing 9/11 and the
slaughter of schoolchildren in Pakistan as well
as other "intelligence" matters.

Our World is in the hands of some exceedingly
demented and malicious ELITES.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 19, 2014, 02:25:48 AM
If I were to guess.  He's talking about being quoted.  I think there's one case where in a quote of his he uses his own name and I replace it with Cap-Mo-ron - the name I've been referring to him as for a while.

Your larger point is of course correct.  This is about getting attention.

Well, he posted on another topic... an electronics topic on the QEG which he obviously knows nothing about, that over here, people were changing his posts illegally.  He, of course, called these people trolls and said that he took care of them, or something like that. 

Since I am active over there, and here, I was treated to him complaining about this on 2 different topics.  He never once mentioned that he was misquoted.

So, you still might be right, but, he sure appeared to imply it was something much more sinister and illegal.

Also, now he claims that He is a whistle blower, so, I suppose he can now quote himself in these debates.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 19, 2014, 03:12:54 AM
If I were to guess.  He's talking about being quoted.  I think there's one case where in a quote of his he uses his own name and I replace it with Cap-Mo-ron - the name I've been referring to him as for a while.

Your larger point is of course correct.  This is about getting attention.
And after a number of hours unless one is an admin, they cannot change their own posts either.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 19, 2014, 03:14:48 AM
And after a number of hours unless one is an admin, they cannot change their own posts either.

Exactly right.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 19, 2014, 04:00:40 AM
Wow...is this troll is all over the map or what...where's joel ?  This troll is broken for real.

Apparently after reviewing the exchange in question it became apparent he he lied when denying altering my text in a quote, in a lame effort to ridicule me...and now, by trivializing his rights violation, he's trying to clean up his mess.

As demonstrated here in the latest CDC liar fraud troll nut-bar quote pertaining to me:

" If I were to guess.  He's talking about being quoted.  I think there's one case where in a quote of his he uses his own name and I replace it with Cap-Mo-ron - the name I've been referring to him as for a while."


And with that admission, his personal ass kisser/wiper is left with egg  on his face...along with the brown stuff that goes along ass kissing/wiping.

He is likely oblivious to the what just happened...that this troll's admission makes him look kinda stoopid, given the not so astute analysis(emphasis on the 'anal' part) that he just provided a cuppla posts back.

I really don't believe he'll ever figure out that before posting its a good idea to review the subject material...and possibly wait until an issue is fully developed before shooting off.

Likely a 30 second man in other areas of life also.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 19, 2014, 04:09:00 AM
Apparently after reviewing the exchange in question
Well you fell into that one.  So you're admitting that the only thing I changed was one instance of your name in a quote.  In which I replaced it with an alias which I had been using for you for a while.
Quote
became apparent he he lied when denying altering my text in a quote
At no point is there any quote where I denied altering your text.
Quote
by trivializing his rights violation
I hate to break it to you but none of your rights have been violated by me. :)

So here's a question for you Cap?  Do you think you're being reasonable and rational?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 19, 2014, 04:10:27 AM
So, you still might be right, but, he sure appeared to imply it was something much more sinister and illegal.
Oh of course.  That's why he wouldn't point out exactly where his text was altered.  Because he knows that would make him look like he's complaining over nothing.  Which, of course he is. :)  There are times where I think I'm talking to someone with a mental illness but when I see this kind of tactical rationality the pendulum swings back toward "jerk". :)

Another interesting bit is his use of "shill".  See if anyone called me a shill and really seriously believed that every post here means a check from someone.  I'd find that person incredibly interesting to talk to.  I'd absolutely love some insight into that kind of delusion.  However every time I try and broach that with Cap it just gets ignored.  This isn't someone who really believes I'm getting paid.  He's just using words like that (and I believe he also used 'satanic' and 'murderous') to be mean.  Which is fine...but almost entirely boring.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 19, 2014, 04:27:55 AM
Oh of course.  That's why he wouldn't point out exactly where his text was altered.  Because he knows that would make him look like he's complaining over nothing.  Which, of course he is. :)  There are times where I think I'm talking to someone with a mental illness but when I see this kind of tactical rationality the pendulum swings back toward "jerk". :)

I agree.

Here is his post on the other thread:  (Unaltered, no matter what he might claim.) Bold emphasis is mine.

 Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl) (http://overunity.com/14443/quantum-energy-generator-qeg-open-sourced-by-hopegirl/msg428081/#msg428081)  « Reply #3437 on: December 17, 2014, 10:04:04 PM » Quote (http://overunity.com/14443/quantum-energy-generator-qeg-open-sourced-by-hopegirl/3435/post/quote/428081/last_msg/428092/)
 "Hi joel,

I have a broken troll on the loose on another thread...he has been rendered unable to focus and has now begun to commit criminal offenses.

he is very hard to catch...from my experience you have to say something that gets his attention = then begin to ignore him and he will see that as a weakness becoming increasing careless and bold.

Keep pretending you don't notice and will start taking liberties...like altering text and attributing it to you.

At that point you turn around fast and loudly say, AHAA!!!

And while he's still in a state of stunned surprise, all you have to do is drop a net over him.

If its any help, the troll is made up mostly of Radio Shack bargain bin items.

Also, his clothes may be tattered by now...thrift shop clothing wood be an upgrade.

Thanks.

Regards..."

So here you can see he clearly implies that "someone" a troll perhaps, is altering his text and attributing the altered text to him.  He also implies that this is a criminal matter.

But, the truth, as we all know, is that his name was changed to the name you have been calling him for a while now, and that did NOT alter the meaningless dribble of his post one iota.

As I said earlier, he does not need any help in appearing to be stupid in his posts as he is doing just fine on his own.

So, he has been busted making false accusations in order to further his agenda.  Isn't this exactly what he accuses the CDC of doing?

Hmmmm.........

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 19, 2014, 04:32:45 AM
Well, he posted on another topic... an electronics topic on the QEG which he obviously knows nothing about, that over here, people were changing his posts illegally.  He, of course, called these people trolls and said that he took care of them, or something like that. 

Since I am active over there, and here, I was treated to him complaining about this on 2 different topics.  He never once mentioned that he was misquoted.

So, you still might be right, but, he sure appeared to imply it was something much more sinister and illegal.

Also, now he claims that He is a whistle blower, so, I suppose he can now quote himself in these debates.

Bill

Sloppy drunk...zanex, or both.

Funny as hell tho.

I know I know I know, is not right to laugh at people in that state...but c'mon, I only human, there's only so many insults from a doofus a guy can take.

I how long wood you last before busting up if you had somebody that stupid saying the stupidest things and either believing them to be true, or thing that the readers are stupid enough to take him seriously.

And yes, exposing a highly connected pedophile ring makes me a whistleblower...just as holding a Patent made me an inventor.

Come to think of it, a few years back, all by my little self mind you, I came up with this circuit producing a weird anomaly...and even posted right here on this very forum...whaddya think of that huh ?

And the nerve of the likes of me posting on "an electronics thread"...indignantly stated by the forums resident ass kisser.

I guess that explains my presence there...however, the ass kisser forgot to mention why he was there...and replicating a paint by number jewel thief doesn't count.

I'm fairly certain the lamebrain never invented anything... and I'm unable to comment on whether he's a blower of anything.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 19, 2014, 04:48:19 AM
Tried and true Troll code:

Repeat the lie early and often, and people will think its the truth after a while.

That doesn't work well on the net tho...there's always the troll reset button.

Tuffsky Sh!tsky comrade.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 19, 2014, 04:55:55 AM


Sloppy drunk...zanex, or both.


Well then, please come back when your drugs wear off.  So, you don't like vaccinations but you take Zanex?  Oh well, but you probably should not drink while taking them.  It makes you look dumb.

Quote

..just as holding a Patent made me an inventor.


In your mind.


Quote

Come to think of it, a few years back, all by my little self mind you, I came up with this circuit producing a weird anomaly...and even posted right here on this very forum...whaddya think of that huh ?


You didn't read the instructions and had it hooked up wrong, ha ha.  Better luck next time.

Quote

jewel thief doesn't count.


Umm...it's Joule Thief.  Evidently, you can't even replicate the name of this circuit, ha ha.

Quote

a blower of anything.

Regards...


I suppose that is your choice.  But, not being vaccinated, you should probably be a little careful.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 19, 2014, 05:02:21 AM
Tried and true Troll code:
So I again ask you.  Do you think you are being reasonable and rational?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 19, 2014, 05:15:07 AM
So I again ask you.  Do you think you are being reasonable and rational?

Here is a partial quote from Joel from the other topic in response to where he perceived Cap-Z-ron called him a troll: (emphasis mine)

    (http://overunity.com/Themes/default/images/post/xx.gif)   Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl) (http://overunity.com/14443/quantum-energy-generator-qeg-open-sourced-by-hopegirl/msg428086/#msg428086)  « Reply #3439 on: December 17, 2014, 10:44:38 PM » 
Quote (http://overunity.com/14443/quantum-energy-generator-qeg-open-sourced-by-hopegirl/3435/post/quote/428086/last_msg/428092/)
   "Cap-z

 

You are just stubborn!

 

Why are you even in an “overunity” forum going against overunity?

 

When you are using the word “troll” you are just trolling. Obviously, at this point you just want to insult and compare dick size. That shows your weak mind to be honest.

Regards...."   


I agree with Joel.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 19, 2014, 05:21:10 AM
I think it's something of an accomplishment when your opponent is so beaten that he can't engage you at all.  I suspect that Cap knows that discussing what is or is not reasonable/rational behavior is only going to make him look bad.  Just like discussing 'altering text' would only make him look like a whiner.  Just like discussing accusations of being a shill only would make him look silly.  Just like discussing "other whistleblowers" would make him look uninformed and discussing Kenya would make him look out of his depth.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 19, 2014, 07:48:01 AM
Recapping troll antics:

The forums preeminent chief ass kisser seems to purposely (if not, he's stupider that I could imagine) mischaracterize the liberties I take with words, as grammatical errors and evidence of my stupidity.

Tiring of my calling him on his conduct the lead CDC troll becomes flustered and cleaves to the arse kissers running theme, and builds upon it, by quoting me as calling myself stupid...in so many words.

When challenged it, he lets on like nothing happened...that wasn't flying, so he posts up something like 'fixed it for ya'...and then tries to carry on as though he gets another Mulligan on that too.

Feeling trapped, he flips the switch, doing some type of 'what, who, me...moi ???' schtick, then challenging me to present the evidence...yeah, as if.

But, the good old troll reset keeps bringing things right back to him altering the text in a quote of mine, in a lame attempt to cast me in a negative light.

Throw in a collection of other trolls and a re-energised and well puckered arse kisser, joining in a cacophony of denials and trivializations and a very astupid anal-sis of how fraud isn't really fraud.

Regards...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 19, 2014, 03:40:21 PM
But, the good old troll reset keeps bringing things right back to him altering the text in a quote of mine, in a lame attempt to cast me in a negative light.
So this is all you have to complain about.  Right? :)

Everyone.  Please listen to me.  I bring you news of the utmost gravity.   I urge you to sympathize with the plight of Cap-Z-ro.  He deserves it.  More than those who have had serious health problems and definitely more than starving children.   Please.  Please.  Please.  Send him money and sympathy.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 19, 2014, 04:05:55 PM
Here is a partial quote from Joel from the other topic in response to where he perceived Cap-Z-ron called him a troll: (emphasis mine)

    (http://overunity.com/Themes/default/images/post/xx.gif)   Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl) (http://overunity.com/14443/quantum-energy-generator-qeg-open-sourced-by-hopegirl/msg428086/#msg428086)  « Reply #3439 on: December 17, 2014, 10:44:38 PM »  Quote (http://overunity.com/14443/quantum-energy-generator-qeg-open-sourced-by-hopegirl/3435/post/quote/428086/last_msg/428092/)
   "Cap-z

 

You are just stubborn!

 

Why are you even in an “overunity” forum going against overunity?

 

When you are using the word “troll” you are just trolling. Obviously, at this point you just want to insult and compare dick size. That shows your weak mind to be honest.

Regards...."   


I agree with Joel.

Bill


Its almost unbelievable he would be stupid enough to put a link up that shows only the post where joel misunderstood my approach.

Predictably, in troll like disingenuous fashion, the miscreant intentionally left out the part where joel and I got things straight.

It was understandable that joel would mistake my 'tongue in cheek' post as another attack from the trolls and their arse kisser

That malicious distortion of fact akin to falsifying evidence and qualifies him as a liar by deception.

I don't think its a stretch to suspect that this ethical perspective was a feature of his work as a private detective

There isn't a helluva lot of difference between a fraud and someone who lies by deception

This is what happens when you're really desperate to gain advantage...and you do things that shred your integrity.

You'll never catch me lying or making misrepresentations...I have too much respect for the integrity I had since birth.

With some, integrity has a price, ergo the collection of trolls and arse kissers that plague all relevant information forums.



Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 19, 2014, 04:17:17 PM
Notice I don't need back up trolls.

I work without a net.

You will never see the troll pack work without a net...or a nut for that matter.

For those scoring at home...

So far we've uncovered a CDC paid troll - caught him altering my text to use against me.

And last, but also least, we have the forum arse kisser blatantly (and stupidly) just plain making up sh!t to cast me in a negative light.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 19, 2014, 04:29:38 PM
caught him altering my text to use against me.
That is, changing, in exactly one place "Cap-Z-ro" to "Cap-Mo-ron".

...and with that in mind I'd like to join with Cap in pleading with people to sympathize with him.  He has been sorely mistreated.  Please.  If you have any decency or any good in your heart.  Please.  Think well of him.  It is the right thing to do.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 19, 2014, 04:53:38 PM
Readers are wondering if this is a day where CDC troll admits or denies his fraud...maybe they're takings odd on that in Vegas ?

Regards...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 19, 2014, 05:13:31 PM
Please stand by...

The exposed CDC fraudster, his loyal arse kisser, and a number of forum trolls will be around later to try to convince the masses that altering someones text to convey a totally different meaning is not fraud.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 19, 2014, 05:29:42 PM
a number of forum trolls will be around later to try to convince the masses that altering someones text to convey a totally different meaning is not fraud.
I never really thought about until you asked.  According to...
Quote from: Wikipedia
Fraud is a deception deliberately practiced in order to secure unfair or unlawful gain

I think you might have a hard time demonstrating that I was deliberately trying to deceive anyone...or that the end result had a completely different meaning.  Perhaps you just mean "It hurts my feelings"?  So with that in mind...

...I continue to implore the masses to heap sympathy on Cap-Z-ro.  If there is a single person on overunity.com or perhaps the earth who deserves it.  It is he (or she).
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Madeo on December 19, 2014, 06:55:26 PM
what happened to this thread? Instead of discussing a controversial topic, it became all about personal attacks and trolling....


Nothing positive will come out of this...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 19, 2014, 07:33:16 PM
what happened to this thread? Instead of discussing a controversial topic, it became all about personal attacks and trolling....


Nothing positive will come out of this...

Madeo, the trolls are paid to roil the waters, so that you have to sift through an entire thread to find truth...and evidently, they are prepared to use any means possible.

They will fluctuate from one tactic to another, deflecting, rationalizing, and ridiculing, to earn their pay.

So far, we have toxic vaccination info posted up...followed up by a paid CDC troll who eventually needed the support of fellow trolls and arse kissers.

The flustered CDC troll couldn't resist the compulsion to start altering the data here too...backed up by an arse kisser, who also found himself in a position where he had to also start making things up to recover lost ground.

The arse kisser has likely vanished, after being exposed as fraud himself, while the CDC troll is left here alone, with both feet figuratively stuck in a tar baby.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: TinselKoala on December 19, 2014, 07:52:28 PM
Notice I don't need back up trolls.

I work without a net.

You will never see the troll pack work without a net...or a nut for that matter.

For those scoring at home...

So far we've uncovered a CDC paid troll - caught him altering my text to use against me.

And last, but also least, we have the forum arse kisser blatantly (and stupidly) just plain making up sh!t to cast me in a negative light.

Regards...

Oh, look, the original has been altered by making some of it RED. And the RED portion is either a blatant lie, or a crazy delusion or both. Captain Nothing cannot provide any evidence for the assertion that anyone posting here is PAID by the CDC, or by anyone else, to post here, and he knows it.  He casts himself in a negative light, blazingly, with his potty mouth and adolescent fascination with feces.  The delusion/lie of "CDC Paid Troll" is hereby documented, and from this point on it is entirely fair and truthful to refer to the person quoted as "that crazy liar Cap-z-ro." Unless and until, that is, he can come up with some supporting evidence for his crazy lying assertion, which is made time and again, as in the post immediately above. But of course he cannot.

All one has to do is to look up the definition of "internet troll" and then compare that definition to the posts in the past few pages to see who fits the bill, and who does not.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 19, 2014, 08:11:02 PM
Now the intention of this troll is attempt demonstrate that highlightint text is the same thing as altering the actual text itself

But then this is also the same troll who when he get frustrated from losing a debate likes to post stuff which implies that his opponent is a convicted criminal.

Somehow I don't think this is the kind of support the CDC fraudster troll was hoping for.

Hoping to gain advantage by posting deceptive information is epidemic among this lot.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 19, 2014, 08:33:21 PM
There is no autism among the unvaccinated people. (http://www.whale.to/vaccine/olmsted_h.html)

Quote from: Dr. Frank Noonan
I have not seen autism with the Amish.

The page has numerous links for further research.

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Madeo on December 19, 2014, 10:18:36 PM
There is no autism among the unvaccinated people. (http://www.whale.to/vaccine/olmsted_h.html)

The page has numerous links for further research.

That's a really interesting information. Now, that i have thought about it,  There is really hardly any case of Autism with the Amish community and/or population that have not been vaccinated. I used to live in a 3rd world country where vaccinations isn't as common compared to the U.S.  and there were no issues with Autism.  We had everything else including mongoloid kids, but that an entirely separate issue.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 19, 2014, 10:34:31 PM
There is no autism among the unvaccinated people. (http://www.whale.to/vaccine/olmsted_h.html)
The quote is actually reported by the author of the article Dan Olmnsted.
Quote from: Kevin Strauss, MD
“The idea that the Amish do not vaccinate their children is untrue,” says Dr. Kevin Strauss, MD, a pediatrician at the CSC. “We run a weekly vaccination clinic and it’s very busy.” He says Amish vaccinations rates are lower than the general population’s, but younger Amish are more likely to be vaccinated than older generations.

“Autism isn’t a diagnosis – it’s a description of behavior. We see autistic behaviors along with seizure disorders or mental retardation or a genetic disorder, where the autism is part of a more complicated clinical spectrum.”

Kevin Strauss is a doctor at the Center for Special Children in Strasbug in Lancaster County.  He also said that Dan somehow never visited the clinic (considering that autistic children require considerably more care than neurotypicals talking to all the local docs would be far smarter than just wandering around) he added “I don’t think he spent much time in Lancaster County.”
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 19, 2014, 10:47:22 PM
That's a really interesting information. Now, that i have thought about it,  There is really hardly any case of Autism with the Amish community and/or population that have not been vaccinated. I used to live in a 3rd world country where vaccinations isn't as common compared to the U.S.  and there were no issues with Autism.
If vaccinations caused autism then you would see the autism diagnosis rate vary with the vaccination rate.  We already know this isn't true.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 20, 2014, 01:18:40 AM
The readership wood like to know how much altering of the evidence was involved in this latest presentation by the paid CDC's troll.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 20, 2014, 01:54:35 AM
Notice I don't need back up trolls.

I work without a net.


Those fellows in the white jackets chasing after you will be happy to provide a net.

Quote

So far we've uncovered a CDC paid troll - caught him altering my text to use against me.


(Disclaimer: Bold type in the above quote added by me for clarity.  I did not modify the meaning of the words, I just made them in bold type.)


Totally, 100% untrue.  I submit that none of YOUR text was altered.  The forum software automatically posts the date, time, and your screen name when you hit the "quote" button...

Therefore, you NEVER typed your screen name so, if your screen name was altered, then it was not your typed text.  NOTHING you actually typed was ever altered.  This is the truth no matter how many times you lie about it.  Every one here, except you of course, knows you are lying.  You should have been raised not to tell lies.  You are also lying about anyone on here being paid by the CDC.  If you claim this is not a lie, then provide proof.  What? No proof?  Then you are lying.

No further questions your Honor.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 20, 2014, 02:00:16 AM


... by the paid CDC's troll.

Regards...

Again with the lie that someone on here is a paid troll.  Show us the proof/evidence that you claim to have to support this or...shut up.

Where is your proof?

Where?

Too bad you were not raised better.  Telling lies demonstrates this very clearly.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 20, 2014, 02:04:39 AM


I don't think its a stretch to suspect that this ethical perspective was a feature of his work as a private detective





Regards...

I have no idea what you are talking about here.  I am not, nor have I ever been, a Private Detective.  Keep your lies coming.  Just make stuff up and try to make people think it is true.  Oh wait, that is what you have been doing all along.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Madeo on December 20, 2014, 02:25:47 AM
If vaccinations caused autism then you would see the autism diagnosis rate vary with the vaccination rate.  We already know this isn't true.

Who's we ??  Different kids have varying levels of resistance to thimerosal (vaccine preservative) like one person might be drunk off a single bottle of beer while some may take several.  This is the same for tobacco and lung cancer. Altering the rate of how much people smoke does not necessarily change the lung cancer rate.

The only real way to determine this is to have two groups of test subjects.  One who gets vaccinated and one that doesn't.  Amish, apparently,  aren't too keen on getting vaccinated and their autism rate is either not recorded or non existent. However, this is still worth investigating.   

I know you are pro vaccine and that it is okay for kids (including yours) to be injected with a substance that contains mercury. That is fine for as long as it is your kids,  not mine.



Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 20, 2014, 02:27:27 AM
I seem to recall this creep mentioning that he was a private dick.

Seems he forgot that one...someone else must remember it too...he's too dense to realize that when you tell lies its hard to keep track of them all...case in point.

Notice how he avoided making up a situation between myself and member joel, by only posting a sentence or two out of context to buttress his lie...which is fraud by its nature.

In this thread only, he's has exposed himself as a drunken, stupid, lying, discredited arse kisser...nothing more.

He can't be paid troll because they don't pay people for stupidity...unless they lowered the troll qualification standards, and have taken to scraping the bottom of the porta-potty.

Regards...


Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 20, 2014, 02:39:17 AM
Kids...see what happens when you get caught red handed making things up.

If you have a massive ego (and a tiny dick) an apology is not an option...you end up in a vicious cycle of saying stupid things and making moronic rationalizations to attempt to extract yourself from the situation.

But, with me, that won't work...I have an iron grip...and only a public apology will release the hold.

In closing kids, as you go through life always remember, if you keep it real you don't have to keep track of what you say.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 20, 2014, 02:39:49 AM
Who's we ??  Different kids have varying levels of resistance to thimerosal (vaccine preservative) like one person might be drunk off a single bottle of beer while some may take several.  This is the same for tobacco and lung cancer. Altering the rate of how much people smoke does not necessarily change the lung cancer rate.

The only real way to determine this is to have two groups of test subjects.  One who gets vaccinated and one that doesn't.  Amish, apparently,  aren't too keen on getting vaccinated and their autism rate is either not recorded or non existent. However, this is still worth investigating.   

I know you are pro vaccine and that it is okay for kids (including yours) to be injected with a substance that contains mercury. That is fine for as long as it is your kids,  not mine.
Consider the issue of scale:  We are talking about 0.5mcg ethylmercury.  Next reconcile that with the fact that other environmental exposures to mercury that are far greater. 

The Amish don't suffer autism and don't get vaccinated fantasies have both already been debunked.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 20, 2014, 02:41:32 AM

(Quoted in part)

I seem to recall this creep mentioning that he was a private dick.


You recall wrong.  Never happened.

Quote

Seems he forgot that one...someone else must remember it too.


You can't remember something that never happened.  That would be stupid.


Quote

... posting a sentence or two out of context...



OK, so first you accuse folks of altering your posts, and now you accuse me of taking you out of context?
To be taken out of context, you first must have a context, which you do not.

So, what is your point?  Just more lies I suppose.

Please note where I say: " quoted in part" which means, because obviously you do not know, that all of your post is not being quoted...only a part...hence the "quoted in part" part.

Bill

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 20, 2014, 02:54:57 AM
Certainly not my quote(you have to be careful around here):

" Next reconcile that with the fact that other environmental exposures to mercury that are far greater.  "



Did it jump right out at you, like it did for me...on how it could be that someone who makes it appear they are an expert on just about everything(especially psychological tactics) has somehow neglected to consider that the "other environmental exposures" he listed weren't being INJECTED INTO THE BLOODY BLOODSTREAM !

I mean, can it be any more obvious that we are dealing with vested interest here ?

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 20, 2014, 03:04:11 AM
Already, 3 readers have requested they wood like to see more of the forum arse kisser clumsily making up stupid stuff about Cap...and then saying more and stupid stuff as Cap keeps him from getting outta the away of the blow back.

I'll do my utmost hold up my end of the board folks.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 20, 2014, 03:19:03 AM
Already, 3 readers have requested they wood like to see more of the forum arse kisser clumsily making up stupid stuff about Cap...and then saying more and stupid stuff as Cap keeps him from getting outta the away of the blow back.

I'll do my utmost hold up my end of the board folks.

Regards...

3 readers eh?  Which ones?  Can you prove this?  Of course not. Just like you can't prove anything else that you "claim".  Just more lies.  These "readers" we all know are just made up...which means you are lying about them.  You can almost be called a professional teller of none truths.  I said almost because, obviously, you are not any good at it as everyone knows that you are lying.  Please make a note...you mean "would" not "wood".  Please take a remedial English class.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 20, 2014, 03:36:11 AM
I gues I forgot to PM the arse kisser about the fictional write in readers who debuted here lat week...coincidentally, it was also on a doobie nite.

Maybe it was another booze nite for him...again.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 20, 2014, 03:51:25 AM
I gues I forgot to PM the arse kisser about the fictional write in readers who debuted here lat week...coincidentally, it was also on a doobie nite.

Maybe it was another booze nite for him...again.

Regards...

Gues?

Lat week?  Please type in English so you might be understood.  Are you high or something?  Most folks can make at least a little sense while being high.  I suppose that you are not one of them.  Do you even have a job?  You seem to be able to post on here all day.  Are my tax dollars supporting you?  I actually work for a living and do not live off of the efforts of others.  You should really try that.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 20, 2014, 04:12:44 AM
Who's we ??
Anyone who is willing to spend a little time to do a little math to refute your own beliefs.
Quote
This is the same for tobacco and lung cancer. Altering the rate of how much people smoke does not necessarily change the lung cancer rate.
It absolutely does.  Number of cigarettes smoked per person has almost perfect symmetry with a 20 year gap and lung cancer rate for over eighty years. Where have you been?
Quote
The only real way to determine this is to have two groups of test subjects.  One who gets vaccinated and one that doesn't.
Oh? And why, in your expert opinion is this the stronger test?  How much more power does that hold over epidemiological studies for things like overall thiomersol intake in children?
Quote
Amish, apparently,  aren't too keen on getting vaccinated
They are somewhat lower in the number of vaccinations.  However it's difficult to get the exact value.
Quote
and their autism rate is either not recorded or non existent.
It is neither non-existent nor unrecorded.  It is considerably better than 1 in 68 though.
Quote
However, this is still worth investigating.
Not really.  But please, tell me how you would construct this study.
Quote
I know you are pro vaccine
Absolutely wrong.  I am not pro-anything.  In fact during the anthrax attacks of 2001 I wouldn't have been vaccinated with AVA.  As it had not yet passed FDA and the information regarding it's safety profile was not public (and I was more likely to win the lottery than to get anthrax-by-mail). The only reason that I consider vaccines to be safe and effective is because that is what the useful evidence points to.  I have read probably every study heralded by anti-vaxers and I would say unreservedly that their opinions are utter crap.   Either they don't understand the study they are reading or they deliberately misunderstand how probability works or in the cases where they actually fund or participate in a study - such as when they took great joy in executing a bunch of primates - they do not understand the first thing about constructing a study.  Now all of these things happen in various parts of medical science but I rarely see a field where so much crap is focused with so much intensity as I do with people who campaign against vaccines.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 20, 2014, 04:19:46 AM
Gues?

Lat week? Please type in English so you might be understood.


This is for the intended use of the readership only...and the task of dissecting troll scroll is done solely in the interest of comedy:


If the troll will tell me the readership the meaning of " Gues? ",

I will reveal the meaning of " Lat week? "



Quote
Do you even have a job?  You seem to be able to post on here all day.  Are my tax dollars supporting you?  I actually work for a living and do not live off of the efforts of others.  You should really try that.

Bill


Apparently, his inebrience was a glass or 8 over the line when (many times) I wood mention being a health care professional...and this guy is very ill, believe me.



Quote
Are you high or something?


The stooge couldn't understand that its doobie nite at my place.



Quote
Most folks can make at least a little sense while being high. I suppose that you are not one of them.

Doobie's makes me forget to proof read sometimes...booze makes him even dumber than usual.
 

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 20, 2014, 04:39:42 AM

 

The stooge couldn't understand that its doobie nite at my place.



Doobie's makes me forget to proof read sometimes...booze makes him even dumber than usual.
 

Regards...

So, you do NOT work and smoke pot all day then?  No wonder you can't form a cogent argument.  No wonder you can post all day long.  Let me guess...this is medical marijuana right?  Is it supposed to help you with your mental disability?  (It is not working I can tell you)

So, all of our tax dollars are sent to you so you can not work, get high, and post BS on the internet?  What a leach on society you are.  I do not drink booze but,  if I did, I would not expect others to pay for it.  What a low life you are.

I have some advice for you:

Get a job!

It will make you feel better about yourself and give you some self respect, which obviously you are lacking considering the inane posts you have been making.

Possibly your posts are a cry for help?

If so, sorry, I am not a psychologist.  I do want the best for you in your life and, trust me, earning your own money instead of mooching off of others is way better for your self esteem.  I daresay that if you had a job and were paying your own way, your posts here would most likely be a lot less hostile and might make more sense.

Just think about it and consider it.  If I can help you to find a job, I will do that.

Just let me know.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 20, 2014, 05:45:14 AM
By trying to characterize me as jobless, what the arse kisser is really saying is that it is himself that is jobless, drunk (if he's not sleeping one off).

I'm posting during commercial breaks (Matlocks on)...and its doobie nite.

Everybody is still waiting for the arse kisser to go back to making sh!t up.

Regards...

 

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 20, 2014, 05:59:04 AM
What?


Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 20, 2014, 06:06:52 AM
Maybe smoking all of that pot is helping you after all?

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 20, 2014, 06:19:49 AM
The readers are still clamoring for more fake Cap smear campaigns or grammar lessons.

Regards...


Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 20, 2014, 06:30:33 AM
The readers are still clamoring for more fake Cap smear campaigns or grammar lessons.

Regards...

The readers realize quite easily that it is Crapzero that smears himself on a regular basis.  No need to ask anyone else to help. You are doing just fine.

Bill

PS  Remember the swine flu scare of 1976?  Crapzero is the perfect example of what happens when you do not get your vaccinations.  Please people, let this serve as an example.  Do NOT let this happen to you.  It could have been prevented...we have the technology...but...alas, he declined.  Poor bastard.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 20, 2014, 06:46:43 AM
*guffaws*

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 20, 2014, 07:25:53 AM
*guffaws*

Is that the sound one makes when not vaccinated and he inhales pot that is treated with whatever chemicals the drug cartels decide to sprinkle on it?

Man, I would not want to be you.  Talk about lab rabbits.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 20, 2014, 08:31:41 AM
Although not directly supportive of the 'vaccination'
question this video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=zS8uBq25bfw) demonstrates what is missing from
the American Medical Conventional Treatment regimen.

It seems that as we 'advance' in America, we at the same
time lose track of the heart and the soul.  Watch it and
think carefully about what is coming for all of us...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 20, 2014, 03:50:08 PM
Is that the sound one makes when not vaccinated
Bill

Thats the sound the readers make when an over vaccinated arse kisser gets outed for making up lame false stories and believes he's chief of the grammar police.

Regards...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 20, 2014, 05:48:48 PM
Although not directly supportive of the 'vaccination'
question this video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=zS8uBq25bfw) demonstrates what is missing from the American Medical Conventional Treatment regimen.
It's actually a better illustration as to what's wrong with science reporting.  There's a difference between disease progression, behavior management and simple point outcomes for cognition.  Which is what this video appears to be about.  I confess that all I did was read some (very positive) reviews of it.  Considering that Sea Monkey gives incredible endorsements even though having never watched/read whatever s/he's promoting.  I confess I'm not willing to watch an hours worth of video just to refute a position that s/he doesn't possess in any real sense.

Anyway while I'm sure that giving people ipods is probably inexpensive and low risk.  Before claiming that you've found the key to making everything better.  You might want to see how this therapy actually works in controlled conditions rather than in emotionally manipulative videos.  As far as I can tell the literature is a resounding: "meh".

Just sayin...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 20, 2014, 07:04:41 PM
The readers now wonder how much of that drivel was made up ?

They're just sayin...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 20, 2014, 08:01:31 PM
Even our beloved pets are not safe from the
'Love of Money' evils of the pharmaceutical
industry:

Pet Medicines:  How Safe are They? (http://www.healthfreedoms.org/pet-medicines-how-safe-are-they/)

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 20, 2014, 08:07:03 PM
?

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 21, 2014, 05:00:17 PM
Crap-Z-ro is now on IGNORE.

Peace on earth, good will toward men.

Merry Christmas everyone.

Bill

PS  Crap-Z-ro always needs to have the last word, and I am giving that to him.  Typical troll behavior on his part. Some deep seeded psychological need drives this behavior.  Merry Christmas Cap, this is my gift to you, the last word.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on December 21, 2014, 05:37:15 PM
Crap-Z-ro is now on IGNORE.

Peace on earth, good will toward men.

Merry Christmas everyone.

Bill

Translation:

The arse kisser grew tired of being outed as a repetitive liar...among other unsavory things.

Arse kissers, like vampires like to avoid mirrors.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 23, 2014, 06:25:43 AM
The Love of Money is capable of overriding common sense
with physicians too. (http://www.naturalnews.com/047427_Paul_Offit_vaccines_religious_exemptions.html#)

It is apparent that to some physicians their Hippocratic Oath
is meaningless.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 23, 2014, 06:47:05 AM
SeaMonkey believes that linking to something is equivalent to actually having an rational argument and making a point (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTc--4jz0GQ)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 23, 2014, 08:10:04 AM
Au Contraire mon frere!  The SeaMonkey believes that
readers are able to evaluate resources and arrive at
their own conclusions.  Whatever they may be inclined
to decide for themselves is not my concern - all are free
to utilize their free will on these matters to the full extent
of their abilities.

Wisdom is arrived at gradually through the assimilation
of information offered by numerous resources.  In the
final analysis, we must all learn to think for ourselves and
to rely upon our own judgments.

The SeaMonkey brings to the attention of interested readers
information which is not readily available within the Main
Stream Media.  TRUTH is the objective.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 23, 2014, 04:25:05 PM
The SeaMonkey believes that readers
...should be provided with the most misleading and poor quality information.
Quote
Wisdom is arrived at gradually through the assimilation of information offered by numerous resources.

Yawn.  Sorry but this is clearly the opposite of what you believe.  If this was the truth then the expectation would be for you to produce hart-to-find articles that are both for and against an issue.  Ones with particularly interesting points of view.

Instead you are a monotone of anti-medical nonsense. You produce articles that are not hard-to-find and do not approach an issue in a novel way.  For the most part they are old and have been refuted many times over.
The SeaMonkey brings to the attention of interested readers information which is not readily available within the Main
Stream Media.
Apparently SeaMonkey is living in 1995 where the Internet is not mainstream and is spelled with a capital 'I'.
Quote
TRUTH is the objective.
Nope.  You have provided nothing useful for determining the truth.  Simply a fountain of poorly explained and (mostly) catastrophically ignorant opinion.  Teaching people about critical thinking, reason and math.  In fact not one thing you have posted attempts to teach a GENERAL problem solving skill.  Hence you are clearly the opposite of what you purport to be. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 23, 2014, 08:03:38 PM
You are of course free to have a differing opinion and
to express that opinion as you choose.  That is the
beauty of such a forum as this one.

Your opinions are always informative and revealing;
particularly to those who are adept at such interpretation.

Carry on.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 23, 2014, 11:27:36 PM
You are of course free to have a differing opinion
Well it's a good thing we have you here to grant people the right to have opinions. :)  I mean if that's the way you really feel.

Again if you are actually interested in the truth.  Then show, clearly and unambiguously one specific piece of information which helps people differentiate between a true thing and an untrue thing.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 24, 2014, 12:54:21 AM
Quote from: sarkeizen
...
Again if you are actually interested in the truth.  Then show, clearly and unambiguously one specific piece of information which helps people differentiate between a true thing and an untrue thing.

There was a time not too long ago when such
skill was demonstrated in the home, in public
institutions and in the public schools. :)

At a time several decades ago when the campaign
of mass disinformation and deception was yet in
its early stages of development.  Since the advent
of mass mind control as practiced today in radio,
television, hollywood, periodicals, publications and
government it may be that most people are unfamiliar
with the skill. :o

But we do seem to have an inherent desire to find TRUTH
hard-wired into our being.  Exposing ourselves to information
which runs contrary to the 'official story line' may be all that
is needed to re-discover that dormant skill. 8)

In any case, TRUTH is on the way.  It shall make its appearance
world-wide in the not too distant future. ;)

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 24, 2014, 01:24:13 AM
In other words, by your own admission.  You have contributed nothing to determining the truth.

I appreciate you coming clean about this.  Now go somewhere else and pretend you know something over there. :)

(If you disagree the challenge is still open.  Quote one thing you have stated which clearly and unambiguously helps people determine truth from untruth.)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 24, 2014, 06:56:30 AM
TRUTH stands upon its own merits.  It does not
need anyone to spoon feed it into an empty
head.

Those who seek TRUTH recognize it and cherish
it.

The Wisdom of Man in its phoniness cannot accept
the simplicity of the transaction, always believing
that without persuasive 'help' TRUTH cannot be found.

Au revoir.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: ramset on December 24, 2014, 07:11:11 AM
SeaMonkey
I see the Oracle of all knowledge and research regarding Vaccines and Autism thinks he has something to say that we want to hear.


maybe he needs a bigger box to stand on.....


for myself
I will assume nothing and _Pay attention_ until we find the reason for Autism,nor will I assume that the Amish just hide their Autistic children and results ...
no stone left unturned


and yes saskatchewan vaccines are to be investigated.....
perhaps you should rethink your investment portfolio ??


thx
Chet
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 24, 2014, 04:59:25 PM
TRUTH stands upon its own merits.  It does not need anyone to spoon feed it into an empty head.
...and by your own admission that's all you do.  You can't provide one quote from anything you've said where you are providing people with a tool to differentiate the truth from untruth.
Quote
Those who seek TRUTH recognize it and cherish it.
Except that's, again by your own admission: not you.

Quote
always believing that without persuasive 'help' TRUTH cannot be found.
...and again by your own admission.  That is precisely, exactly and utterly yourself.  You provide nothing to differentiate truth from untruth.  Hence the only thing you provide is an opinion meant to persuade. 
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 24, 2014, 05:10:38 PM
I see the Oracle of all knowledge and research regarding Vaccines and Autism
I assume you're talking about me.  There's a certain irony when you mock people because they have investigated and analyzed something to considerable more depth than you have.  Why not just say: "I, Chet am ignorant and I'm proud of it"
Quote
thinks he has something to say that we want to hear.
I'm quite sure that you have no desire to hear what I have to say.  Despite my having no problem listening to what any of you have to say (when you choose to have something to say - instead of just posting links and funny pictures).
Quote
I will assume nothing
So how does that work?  Don't you have to assume there is true equipoise in order believe that both "sides" of an issue need to be investigated?
Quote
and yes saskatchewan vaccines are to be investigated.....
They already are and have been.  I simply maintain that people who suggest that vaxed, unvaxed studies will provide useful information are people who need to take a statistics class.
Quote
perhaps you should rethink your investment portfolio ??
Oh...is this implying that I have investments in vaccine companies like Merck?  Is that only reason for my thinking vaccines are safe and effective that you can think of?  :)  As far as investments go.  I have no investments in vaccine companies that I know of.   I have a few managed funds and a few grouped investments which could carry things like that.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 24, 2014, 10:42:34 PM
The Paradox of Our Age.

For each step we move 'forward' we seem to
take many steps 'backward.'

The following is an excerpt of
“The Paradox of Our Age,” from Words Aptly Spoken,
by Bob Moorehead. (http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Bob_Moorehead)

We have taller buildings but shorter tempers; wider
freeways but narrower viewpoints; we spend more
but have less; we buy more but enjoy it less; we have
bigger houses and smaller families; more conveniences,
yet less time; we have more degrees but less sense;
more knowledge but less judgement; more experts,
yet more problems; we have more gadgets but less
satisfaction; more medicine, yet less wellness; we take
more vitamins but see fewer results.

We drink too much; smoke too much; spend too
recklessly; laugh too little; drive too fast; get too angry
quickly; stay up too late; get up too tired; read too
seldom; watch TV too much and pray too seldom.

We have multiplied our possessions, but reduced
our values; we fly in faster planes to arrive there quicker,
to do less and return sooner; we sign more contracts
only to realize fewer profits; we talk too much; love too
seldom and lie too often.

We’ve learned how to make a living, but not a life;
we’ve added years to life, not life to years. We’ve been
all the way to the moon and back, but have trouble
crossing the street to meet the new neighbor. We’ve
conquered outer space, but not inner space; we’ve
done larger things, but not better things; we’ve cleaned
up the air, but polluted the soul; we’ve split the atom,
but not our prejudice.

We write more, but learn less; plan more, but
accomplish less; we make faster planes, but longer
lines; we learned to rush, but not to wait; we have
more weapons, but less peace; higher incomes, but
lower morals; more parties, but less fun; more food,
but less appeasement; more acquaintances, but fewer
friends; more effort, but less success. We build more
computers to hold more information, to produce more
copies than ever, but have less communication; drive
smaller cars that have bigger problems; build larger
factories that produce less. We’ve become long on
quantity, but short on quality.

These are the times of fast foods and slow digestion;
tall men, but short character; steep in profits, but
shallow relationships. These are times of world peace,
but domestic warfare; more leisure and less fun;
higher postage, but slower mail; more kinds of food,
but less nutrition. These are days of two incomes, but
more divorces; these are times of fancier houses, but
broken homes.

These are days of quick trips, disposable diapers,
cartridge living, throw-away morality, one-night stands,
overweight bodies and pills that do everything from
cheer, to prevent, quiet or kill. It is a time when there
is much in the show window and nothing in the stock
room. Indeed, these are the times!
 
Change starts with each person being individually
responsible for their actions and behaviour.  What
kind of world are we voting for with the way we choose
to live our life?

- See more at: http://www.spiritscienceandmetaphysics.com/the-paradox-of-our-age-how-our-society-is-backwards/#sthash.KvJG6D7l.dpuf (http://www.spiritscienceandmetaphysics.com/the-paradox-of-our-age-how-our-society-is-backwards/#sthash.KvJG6D7l.dpuf)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 24, 2014, 10:45:56 PM
We have taller buildings but shorter tempers; wider freeways but narrower viewpoints; we spend more but have less; we buy more but enjoy it less; we have bigger houses and smaller families; more conveniences, yet less time; we have more degrees but less sense; more knowledge but less judgement; more experts, yet more problems; we have more gadgets but less satisfaction; more medicine, yet less wellness; we take more vitamins but see fewer results. We drink too much; smoke too much; spend too recklessly; laugh too little; drive too fast; get too angry quickly; stay up too late; get up too tired; read too seldom; watch TV too much and pray too seldom.
We have multiplied our possessions, but reduced our values; we fly in faster planes to arrive there quicker, to do less and return sooner; we sign more contracts only to realize fewer profits; we talk too much; love too seldom and lie too often. We’ve learned how to make a living, but not a life; we’ve added years to life, not life to years. We’ve been all the way to the moon and back, but have trouble crossing the street to meet the new neighbor. We’ve conquered outer space, but not inner space; we’ve done larger things, but not better things; we’ve cleaned up the air, but polluted the soul; we’ve split the atom, but not our prejudice. We write more, but learn less; plan more, but accomplish less; we make faster planes, but longer lines; we learned to rush, but not to wait; we have more weapons, but less peace; higher incomes, but lower morals; more parties, but less fun; more food, but less appeasement; more acquaintances, but fewer friends; more effort, but less success. We build more computers to hold more information, to produce more copies than ever, but have less communication; drive smaller cars that have bigger problems; build larger factories that produce less.
Isn't it interesting how that is all spoon-feeding ideology?  Not a word about reason and how to do it. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 24, 2014, 10:59:57 PM
What is written may be considered or rejected
as each chooses.

Wisdom eventually enters in as we learn to
make correction to our wrong decisions.

Discovering TRUTH is never an instantaneous
process.  Too often it involves the pain of suffering
consequences as we respond to inappropriate desires.

Very sadly, some will never seem to 'learn' in this
present lifetime.  But there is hope never-the-less.
TRUTH is on the way!

But first there will be much chaos and destruction
as malevolent men (including women) carry out their
nefarious PLAN for World Domination.  It is happening
now before our very eyes.
 
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 25, 2014, 01:08:02 AM
I like the idea of personal responsibility.  I hope that others agree that personal responsibility includes making reasonable inquiries into ideas before accepting them as beliefs.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 25, 2014, 01:56:29 AM
Good advice.  Question everything that is propagated
both from government sources via the mainstream
media as well as alternative sources.  In this present
age disinformation abounds.

With unrelenting effort the ability to discern will fully
develop.

TRUTH is simply amazing.
 
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 25, 2014, 02:04:34 AM
Good advice.  Question everything that is propagated
both from government sources via the mainstream
media as well as alternative sources.  In this present
age disinformation abounds.

With unrelenting effort the ability to discern will fully
develop.

TRUTH is simply amazing.

Now this I totally agree with.  Due diligence and personal responsibility to find what is real...AND, what is not.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 25, 2014, 03:05:46 AM
What is written may be considered or rejected as each chooses.
In other words:  All you are doing is promoting a particular set of ideologies.  Right?  You also seem to do so without even the slightest amount of self-examination.  Right?

So given that all you do is push unexamined opinion.  How does this help move people toward the truth?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 25, 2014, 03:06:25 AM
Good advice.  Question everything that is propagated both from government sources via the mainstream media as well as alternative sources.  In this present age disinformation abounds.

In other words be the opposite of you. :)

Why must everything SM says be like listening to 4th grade debate club?  Seriously, has anyone ever thought about having a reasonably objective set of criteria to APPLY to ideas or having a useful well-defined and consistent process for evaluating ideas?  Or is there some attraction to poorly defined and logically inconsistent epistemology that I'm not seeing. For example is everyone incapable of dealing with a philosophy that can't be stated on a bumper sticker?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 25, 2014, 03:07:09 AM
I like the idea of personal responsibility.  I hope that others agree that personal responsibility includes making reasonable inquiries into ideas before accepting them as beliefs.
But not before advertising them? :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 25, 2014, 11:24:57 AM
Advertising an unverified idea as something one would like others to accept as true is foolish or worse.  Advertising an unverified idea in a solicitation for help with diligence is fine to me.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 25, 2014, 07:10:30 PM
Advertising an unverified idea as something one would like others to accept as true is foolish or worse.
"Negligent" is the word I use.  It's pretty obvious that SM at least attempts to appear of the later category.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 25, 2014, 09:38:12 PM
Quote from: MarkE
Advertising an unverified idea as something one would like others to accept as true is foolish or worse.  Advertising an unverified idea in a solicitation for help with diligence is fine to me.

There is never any pressure for others to accept
anything as 'true.'  TRUTH does not come from
casual acceptance without verification.

Materials presented should be naught more than
a beginning in the search for what is TRUE and
what is The Lie.

Our modern world has become enamored of The
Lie and makes use of it extensively to manipulate
into existence a false 'reality.'  Those who believe
that TRUTH is gained by simple acceptance are
easy game for the Liars.

Persevere!  TRUTH is within everyone's grasp!
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 25, 2014, 10:39:58 PM
Doctor Oz is finding that there is much resistance
to healing by nutrition from The Establishment. (http://www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/?p=108832)

True healing which is accomplished without spending
large sums payable to Big Pharma is tantamount to
heresy!

In so many ways, America seems to have lost its
zest for truth and integrity.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 26, 2014, 02:14:18 AM
There is never any pressure for others to accept anything as 'true.'
...or to run trwhen you shout "fire" in a crowded theater. You appear to present specific ideas as being generally correct (or considerably more so) despite the fact that you either know them to be false or they are trivially falsified.  I'd call this negligent.
Quote
TRUTH does not come from casual acceptance without verification.
Can you provide any verification for any of the things you present?  Didn't think so. :)  In other words you don't have any truth and by virtue of that you can not usefully contribute to the pursuit of truth. :)
Quote
Persevere!  TRUTH is within everyone's grasp!
Probably not yours. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 26, 2014, 03:05:41 AM
There is never any pressure for others to accept
anything as 'true.'  TRUTH does not come from
casual acceptance without verification.

Materials presented should be naught more than
a beginning in the search for what is TRUE and
what is The Lie.

Our modern world has become enamored of The
Lie and makes use of it extensively to manipulate
into existence a false 'reality.'  Those who believe
that TRUTH is gained by simple acceptance are
easy game for the Liars.

Persevere!  TRUTH is within everyone's grasp!
That's all fine philosophy.  There appear to be large discrepancies between that stated philosophy and your promotion of ideas that are belied by well established evidence.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 26, 2014, 03:07:48 AM
Doctor Oz is finding that there is much resistance
to healing by nutrition from The Establishment. (http://www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/?p=108832)

True healing which is accomplished without spending
large sums payable to Big Pharma is tantamount to
heresy!

In so many ways, America seems to have lost its
zest for truth and integrity.
Dr. Oz is an industry unto himself who has as much self interest as any other corporation.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 26, 2014, 05:23:49 AM
Quote from: MarkE
That's all fine philosophy.  There appear to be large discrepancies between that stated philosophy and your promotion of ideas that are belied by well established evidence.

If it is indeed well established as TRUTHFUL evidence
well and good.

If on the other hand, the 'well established evidence' is
deceitfully manufactured, that is another matter.

Assumption of Responsibility entails finding TRUTH.

Whether Dr. Oz conducts his business as a typical self-
interested corporation remains to be seen.  Advocating
nutrition by means of natural sources doesn't seem to
be as financially lucrative as conventional 'big pharma'
medicine.  Not to mention the fact that nutrition does
have the capability to enable the body to heal.

Junk Foods and Big Pharma seem to employ the same
sort of modus operandi for their benefit.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 26, 2014, 05:36:07 AM
You may or may not believe such things.  When asked for hard evidence that supports various claims you have made you have been very quiet. 

As to the good Dr.  Here is a comment he made in his own words concerning promotions he has done on his show:

Quote
Quote
"“When we write a script, we need to generate enthusiasm and engage the viewer,”"... “I recognize that often times they don’t have the scientific muster to pass as fact. I have given my family these products.”

Caveat emptor.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 26, 2014, 05:38:28 AM
If it is indeed well established as TRUTHFUL evidence
well and good.

If on the other hand, the 'well established evidence' is
deceitfully manufactured, that is another matter.

Assumption of Responsibility entails finding TRUTH.

Whether Dr. Oz conducts his business as a typical self-
interested corporation remains to be seen.  Advocating
nutrition by means of natural sources doesn't seem to
be as financially lucrative as conventional 'big pharma'
medicine.  Not to mention the fact that nutrition does
have the capability to enable the body to heal.

Junk Foods and Big Pharma seem to employ the same
sort of modus operandi for their benefit.

Dr. Oz makes millions of dollars.  Not that that is a bad thing but, you don't trust million dollar corporations yet you trust Oz?  Of course, he got his start on Oprah and has sold many books, does seminars, TV appearances, radio spots,etc.  His money is coming from somewhere and I feel sure that he takes the money source(s) into consideration when making decisions for his career.

If what some folks here think about big pharma were true, they would have taken out Oz a long time ago.  Ask why this has not happened.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 26, 2014, 05:39:51 AM
Doctor Oz is finding that there is much resistance
to healing by nutrition from The Establishment. (http://www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/?p=108832)
It's pretty funny when an article tries to make any point but the one in it's title.  :)
Quote
True healing which is accomplished without spending large sums payable to Big Pharma is tantamount to heresy!
I'm pretty sure this means you didn't even read the article you posted.

Just pointing out to everyone that the article is not about Dr. Oz at all.  It's one of Mike Adams (another person who makes considerable money off "natural" products and services)  meandering highly-self referencing and self-aggrandizing nonsense posts. :) Adams is also somewhat unhinged as he has at least once appeared to suggest that anti-GMO activists should consider murdering scientists and journalists. (although he edited his post afterwards and put in a disclaimer for some of the harsher text)

Is that your view as well SeaMonkey? Is that what you promote here? :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: orbut 3000 on December 26, 2014, 09:24:40 AM
The TRUTH: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pravda (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pravda)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 26, 2014, 10:37:09 AM
The TRUTH: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pravda (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pravda)
Da
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 26, 2014, 05:56:12 PM
I think you'll find http://weeklyworldnews.com/ to be more reliable.  They even tell you it's reliable.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 26, 2014, 07:43:26 PM
Quote from: MarkE
Caveat emptor.

This has always been and due to present
conditions in our modern World is ever
more important today.

Trust nothing.  Doubt everything.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 26, 2014, 07:55:09 PM
Quote from: sarkeizen
...
Is that your view as well SeaMonkey? Is that what you promote here? :)

What The SeaMonkey promotes is encouragement
to search for TRUTH.  There is much deception in
what is propagated in today's Media.

TRUTH will be discernible when we have become
ready to process it.  To find TRUTH it is necessary
to look outside the fabricated reality promoted by
those in power.  It is the desire of those who have
the means and the resources to replace TRUTH
with The Lie.  A malicious AGENDA is at work.

All People should be treated with respect;  as we
would ourselves like to be treated.  Even our
enemies are deserving of our love.  But not the
phony sort of 'love' which is popularized today;
TRUE Love.

It too is available for discovery.

Examples of how the AGENDA of DECEPTION works:

Who did the Sony hack? (http://www.thedailybell.com/news-analysis/35945/Was-the-Sony-Hack-a-Domestic-Ploy/?uuid=6F808B25-5056-9627-3C1C0B7DA4C0C1D3)

Why is the West attacking Russia? (http://www.thedailybell.com/editorials/35944/Ron-Holland-Putin-It-Is-Time-to-Play-Your-Ace-in-the-Hole/?uuid=6F808B25-5056-9627-3C1C0B7DA4C0C1D3)

The megalomaniacs of the West care only about
their future.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: fritznien on December 26, 2014, 09:03:26 PM
for another view on adams try this.
http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2014/12/26/mike-adams-defends-dr-oz-as-usual-hilarity-ensues/
more stuff for SM to ignore.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 26, 2014, 09:12:48 PM
Getting to the very heart of the matter of
the AGENDA of DECEPTION. (http://henrymakow.com/000305.html)

Our World has become a very crazy place.

Finding the solution to the problem of ignorance. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=i05m8w7rD_4)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 26, 2014, 10:22:19 PM
Getting to the very heart of the matter of
the AGENDA of DECEPTION. (http://henrymakow.com/000305.html)

Our World has become a very crazy place.

Finding the solution to the problem of ignorance. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=i05m8w7rD_4)
Do you support this headline claim on the link you supplied?

Quote
Quote
The suppression of Christmas is a symptom of

the cancer that infects mankind. We have been

subverted by a satanic cult, the Illuminati, that is responsible

for war, terror and cultural degradation in general. Society is

 satanically possessed.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 26, 2014, 10:30:38 PM
What The SeaMonkey promotes is encouragement to search for TRUTH. 
...and this is demonstrably false.  At no point have you provided anything remotely resembling something that would teach people to discern truth from untruth.  Hence if there is some search for truth going on.  You have opted out.
Quote
All People should be treated with respect
...uh you just posted an article from someone who compares particular scientists to Nazi's.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 26, 2014, 10:34:07 PM
Everyone knows that it's the the suppression of Kwanzaa which is the true mark of the Illuminati and their orbital mind control lasers.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 26, 2014, 10:36:29 PM
Everyone knows that it's the the suppression of Kwanzaa which is the true mark of the Illuminati and their orbital mind control lasers.
Don't forget the evil subliminal messages being transmitted by the dancing Kia rodents.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 26, 2014, 10:41:53 PM
Don't forget the evil subliminal messages being transmitted by the dancing Kia rodents.
...which originate from the subverted Church of the SubGenius and Trekkies.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 27, 2014, 02:18:15 AM
...which originate from the subverted Church of the SubGenius and Trekkies.
Even now gray matter of unwitting sleeper agents has been replaced with dreaded red matter.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on December 27, 2014, 03:22:08 AM
Hey, come on.  Festivus is being suppressed more than any other holiday.  People have to celebrate it behind closed doors living in fear that they will be discovered and reported by their neighbors.

I had to close my drapes so no one could see my Festivus pole.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 27, 2014, 03:35:59 AM
My neighbours always complain about the noise when it comes time for the feats of strength.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on December 29, 2014, 11:09:41 PM
The recent Autism explosion may be the result
of Glyphosate poisoning (http://www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/?p=109006) of the food supply
more than any other factor.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 30, 2014, 12:43:15 AM
The recent Autism explosion may be the result
of Glyphosate poisoning (http://www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/?p=109006) of the food supply
more than any other factor.
Autism is increasing as is use of flat panel versus CRT televisions.  Coincidence? 
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on December 30, 2014, 03:52:30 AM
I think we all can agree there is no going backwards be it cell phones, computers, computer displays, pesticides, herbicides, fertilizers or immunizations and so on thus the question remains... what is the way forward?. There is this argument that there is no going back and in many respects I do agree however there is no resolution to the conflict, no answer to the question to be found here.


I mean no offense but everyone seems overly involved with debating a mute point and it seems there is no rational debate towards a real solution and I must ask what is it exactly that were debating?. 5th beer, it is only my opinion but if the endless debate never answers the question,if it never ends in resolution nor closure then why debate the subject at all?. it all seems like so much chatter and noise, so impulsive, so much ado about nothing... :) .


AC
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: orbut 3000 on December 30, 2014, 04:31:53 AM

What's the way forward? It's simple:
-Don't vote
-Post meme pictures that discourage voting and other means of participation in the political process
-Feel disenfranchised 
-Hoard guns and gold
-Post more memes and buy Alex Jones' penls enlargement pills in huge quantities.
-Feel even more disenfranchised
-Blame the Joos
-Post some more memes
-???
-Profit
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on December 30, 2014, 05:05:30 AM
@orbut 3000
Wow good answer in a really strange yet disconcerting way but I'm not sure I understand your point?. It's like trying to fit the pieces of a jigsaw puzzle in which all the pieces are the same color which doesn't actually form a picture at all. Why don't you tell us what's really on your mind, hmm?.


AC
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on December 30, 2014, 05:20:42 AM
I think we all can agree there is no going backwards be it cell phones, computers, computer displays, pesticides, herbicides, fertilizers or immunizations and so on thus the question remains... what is the way forward?. There is this argument that there is no going back and in many respects I do agree however there is no resolution to the conflict, no answer to the question to be found here.


I mean no offense but everyone seems overly involved with debating a mute point and it seems there is no rational debate towards a real solution and I must ask what is it exactly that were debating?. 5th beer, it is only my opinion but if the endless debate never answers the question,if it never ends in resolution nor closure then why debate the subject at all?. it all seems like so much chatter and noise, so impulsive, so much ado about nothing... :) .


AC
Vaccinations have had a huge positive impact on public health.  Scourges like polio have been nearly wiped out due to modern vaccines. 

Repeatedly a claim has been put forward that vaccinations threaten individual health.  Some people believe that claim and have relied upon it to prevent vaccinating their children against at least some diseases.  The most often cited claim is that vaccines contain mercury, notably Thimerosal. 

I have looked into this and found that according to the CDC Thimerosal is only used in multiple dose flu vaccine distributions.  The CDC states that any given vaccination contains 0.5ug of Methyl Hg.  The CDC states that Methyl Hg is fully eliminated by the body and so does not accumulate. 

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: orbut 3000 on December 30, 2014, 05:22:00 AM
@orbut 3000
Wow good answer in a really strange yet disconcerting way but I'm not sure I understand your point?. It's like trying to fit the pieces of a jigsaw puzzle in which all the pieces are the same color which doesn't actually form a picture at all. Why don't you tell us what's really o your mind, hmm?.


AC

Where did I lose you?.


ETA:  I think I posted this in the wrong thread, but:
 
The way forward is to find a balance between worst and perfect, between black and white. There is no chance to have perfect solution, but there is a good chance to steer our society around the most dangerous obstacles. 


But it does not help when the most idealistic and passionate just opt out and boycott the only process that is in place to influence and change things. There is no instant gratification in the democratic process, it takes time, patience and persistence. And that may be good, even, because it protects us a little bit from expressing the worst in us. And there is a lot of bad and ill inside us that wants to creep up and destroy our civilized communities by spreading hate, fear and rage. Almost all western democracies are designed to even out those flashes of rage.
An analogy:
The voting population is the weather and their will is slowly reflected in the climate that is the slowly changing actual policy.
Of course this system is not flawless.
Lobbyists and special interests can be a big problem. That's a field where pressure needs to applied.
Transparency is very important.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on December 30, 2014, 06:01:26 PM
I think we all can agree there is no going backwards be it cell phones, computers, computer displays, pesticides, herbicides, fertilizers
However it seems entirely plausible to have different phones, computers, etc..
Quote
or immunizations
Not that long ago you were arguing that generally those with low-IQ (as discovered by observation...somehow) get immunized.  Doesn't that mean you can go back?  At least the implication would be that the high-IQ folks have gone back.  People like SM and Capt-Z-ro at least appear to claim that there is almost no efficacy in vaccination (and you claim there is much higher risk in it).  So again it seems trivial to go back...unless vaccines actually DO work and they are very, very, very safe.  Let me know when you figure out what you're saying.
Quote
I mean no offense but everyone seems overly involved with debating a mute point and it seems there is no rational debate towards a real solution and I must ask what is it exactly that were debating?
Well given that SM, you and Capt-Z-ro can't really produce a point an defend it.  I'd say nothing.  It's more like watching you guys make strong assertions and then watch you act like having selective amnesia.

However, in most cases if you actually were somehow able to function in this way.  We would be debating if these things in fact cause the problems that people like you, SM and Capt-Z-ro claim.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 01, 2015, 07:51:32 AM
A wee bit more food for thought:
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 01, 2015, 08:02:52 AM
A wee bit more food for thought:

Where do you find this unsubstantiated crap?  Where is the study?  Who did the study?  Where are the references?

None?

We expect no less.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 01, 2015, 08:26:37 PM
Quote from: Pirate88179
Where do you find this unsubstantiated crap?  Where is the study?  Who did the study?  Where are the references?

None?

We expect no less.

Those are the kinds of questions you would do well
asking your Physician, your Pharmacist, the
Pharmaceutical Industry and the CDC/FDA.

Very unfortunately for the health of the People,
much data put forth in published 'studies' is
pure fabrication.  Even the data that is valid is
very short term with no apparent concern for
possible long-term adverse effects.

Yes, we do need TRUTH.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 01, 2015, 11:42:04 PM


Very unfortunately for the health of the People,
much data put forth in published 'studies' is
pure fabrication.


Where is your proof for this statement?  What data is false?  Who has proven this?  What studies are using false data?

More, unsubstantiated posts.  You may believe this but, you do not show us the evidence as to why you believe this.  So, why should we just take your word?  Did you just take some other person's word?

Do you see what I mean?

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 02, 2015, 01:45:26 AM
A wee bit more food for thought:
I think they look more stupid this way (like that ominous thunderstorm over the evil vaccinating CVS pharmacy LOL) but YMMV.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 02, 2015, 02:02:11 AM
Where is your proof for this statement? 
Deeper than that.  What would have to be true for sea monkey's statement to be true.  What does "much of the data" mean?  Most?  To anyone with a little bit of background in statistics it's pretty obvious if SM is implying that MOST data is wrong/false then anyone of asserts that is far, far, far, far, far, far, far, far more likely not to know what they are talking about.

But if you're Seamonkey you don't care. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 02, 2015, 02:24:33 AM
Quote from: Pirate88179
Where is your proof for this statement?  What data is false?  Who has proven this?  What studies are using false data?

More, unsubstantiated posts.  You may believe this but, you do not show us the evidence as to why you believe this.  So, why should we just take your word?  Did you just take some other person's word?

Do you see what I mean?

I can encourage you to make the effort to find
the 'proofs' but I cannot prevent you from doing
so.  Only you yourself are able to prevent yourself
from doing the essential research and digging.

Even the MainStream Media will on occasion report
falsified study data.  Not nearly as often as they
should but only enough to create the impression that
they are credible in what they report.  Most cases of
falsified data are reported only in Technical Journals
or by private correspondence among high echelon
personnel.  Most reports are never presented to the
general public.

You should not 'take anyone's word' for any subject of
discussion.  Everything that you may wonder about should
be proven to your own satisfaction.  Even when (especially
when) the subject matter is presented by those who you've
been programmed to see as ethical authorities.

It isn't always easy to find TRUTH.  In fact, it is becoming
more difficult.  While we still have the internet, hone your
research skills to find TRUTH.  The liars and deceivers are
working to suppress the ability of the internet to counter
their lies with TRUTH.  You know, the old 'conspiracy theory'
gig.

Or not, as you choose.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 02, 2015, 03:05:40 AM
Only you yourself are able to prevent yourself from doing the essential research and digging.
So you believe the things you post?  If so, doesn't that mean YOU have done the digging? If so where is that data?   Isn't asking you for the data which proved this to YOUR satisfaction a reasonable step in finding the truth?

I mean, I'm pretty sure all you need is some line on a poorly designed graphic before you believe something (Well, as long as it conforms to your pre-existing beliefs) but it would be interesting to find out different and perhaps show you how incredibly lax and stupid your digging process is. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Dog-One on January 02, 2015, 03:20:51 AM
I can encourage you to make the effort to find
the 'proofs' but I cannot prevent you from doing
so.

Actually SeaMonkey, I'd prefer you refrain from saying any more than you already have.  There is a natural justice in all this.  Those that prefer to argue with you are far more inclined to blindly follow the mandates of the authorities.  To be quite honest, that suits me fine, let'm go.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 02, 2015, 03:54:13 AM
Actually SeaMonkey, I'd prefer you refrain from saying any more than you already have.  There is a natural justice in all this.  Those that prefer to argue with you are far more inclined to blindly follow the mandates of the authorities.  To be quite honest, that suits me fine, let'm go.
It's interesting how you think SeaMonkey is actually providing useful information.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Dog-One on January 02, 2015, 05:07:09 AM
It's interesting how you think SeaMonkey is actually providing useful information.

I'll admit, I did find the dialog in this thread useful.  Unlike SeaMonkey though, I anticipated the responses he received.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 02, 2015, 05:18:17 AM
I'll admit, I did find the dialog in this thread useful.  Unlike SeaMonkey though, I anticipated the responses he received.
I think it's easy to anticipate people asking "provide support to your point"...and in a lot of SM's posts...."please actually make or clarify your point".  These are actually part of the social contract in conversation.  People expect your words to, as they say "go somewhere".

:)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on January 02, 2015, 05:42:53 AM
More news


Quote
By 2013, there were 800 children with narcolepsy who had been linked to vaccination against the flu across Europe, with doctors reporting more cases emerging in adults. The Scandinavian studies were supported by research from France, Norway, Ireland and the UK with some scientists reporting a seven to 13-times higher risk of narcolepsy after vaccination.
http://www.ctvnews.ca/w5/sleeping-sickness-a-w5-investigation-into-the-sudden-rise-in-childhood-narcolepsy-1.1524420#ixzz3NdO1CjQS (http://www.ctvnews.ca/w5/sleeping-sickness-a-w5-investigation-into-the-sudden-rise-in-childhood-narcolepsy-1.1524420#ixzz3NdO1CjQS)[/size][/color]


http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2010/11/01/flu-vaccine-and-its-side-effects.aspx







Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 02, 2015, 06:21:49 AM
Unless you've gone "Seamonkey" (the disease where you can only post links and prattle vacuously).  Can you answer how strong do you consider the evidence is here and why?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on January 02, 2015, 06:45:04 AM
More news

 http://www.ctvnews.ca/w5/sleeping-sickness-a-w5-investigation-into-the-sudden-rise-in-childhood-narcolepsy-1.1524420#ixzz3NdO1CjQS (http://www.ctvnews.ca/w5/sleeping-sickness-a-w5-investigation-into-the-sudden-rise-in-childhood-narcolepsy-1.1524420#ixzz3NdO1CjQS)[/size][/color]


http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2010/11/01/flu-vaccine-and-its-side-effects.aspx
Each of those articles are rather dated.  Where is the follow-up data?  Does it support or refute the suspicions offered?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 02, 2015, 07:15:11 AM
Could someone present evidence that injecting foreign into the human body have any positive effect ?

To date, I haven't seen any...I don't meant the "evidence" forwarded by vested interests.

I mean a a totally i dependent body.

What...no such body exists !!!

I wonder why that is...with all those $2000.00 toilet seats they buy...on your dime too.

I've lost track of how many people told me of getting the flu right after the vaccination.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: kEhYo77 on January 02, 2015, 08:51:29 AM
Hi.
Here is something about false data.

Quote
My name is William Thompson. I am a Senior Scientist with the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, where I have worked since 1998. I regret that my coauthors and I omitted statistically significant information in our 2004 article published in the journal Pediatrics. The omitted data suggested that African American males who received the MMR vaccine before age 36 months were at increased risk for autism. Decisions were made regarding which findings to report after the data were collected, and I believe that the final study protocol was not followed.

Learn more: http://www.naturalnews.com/046630_CDC_whistleblower_public_confession_Dr_William_Thompson.html#ixzz3NeGNEFOZ (http://www.naturalnews.com/046630_CDC_whistleblower_public_confession_Dr_William_Thompson.html#ixzz3NeGNEFOZ)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 02, 2015, 02:15:41 PM
Hi.
Here is something about false data.

Learn more: http://www.naturalnews.com/046630_CDC_whistleblower_public_confession_Dr_William_Thompson.html#ixzz3NeGNEFOZ (http://www.naturalnews.com/046630_CDC_whistleblower_public_confession_Dr_William_Thompson.html#ixzz3NeGNEFOZ)
Except the data that wasn't used in the aggregate analysis were excluded on the original standards of the study.  The inclusion of the data only changes the result when you use an analysis method which is more likely to get a false positive.

Thompson may well be feeling guilty and may be sincere in his apology but that doesn't make his opinion correct. :)

(Also the verb "learn" really doesn't belong with any link to "natural news". :) )
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on January 02, 2015, 04:31:06 PM
@Cap-z-ro
Quote
I've lost track of how many people told me of getting the flu right after the
vaccination.
Just yesterday I heard on the radio that flu cases are spiking in Alberta and the latest vaccinations are only around 50% effective. So really the best they have amounts to a toss of a coin 50/50. Ain't science wonderful?. I swear fact would seem to be stranger than fiction most days and normalcy a form of mental disorder promoted by underachievers.

AC
 
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 02, 2015, 04:44:51 PM
It's kind of interesting how you've been asked all sorts of questions and all you can do here is give Capt-Z-ro a handjob.
and the latest vaccinations are only around 50% effective. So really the best they have amounts to a toss of a coin 50/50.
50% effective in what sense?  No, you didn't think about it.  Did you?
Quote
normalcy a form of mental disorder promoted by underachievers.
Well in that sense you've shown a pretty "normal" ability at statistics.  I hope math has little to do with your career. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on January 02, 2015, 05:21:31 PM
@Sark
Quote
50% effective in what sense?  No, you didn't think about it.  Did
you?
Well in that sense you've shown a pretty "normal" ability at statistics.
Uhm perhaps you could enlighten me then because I would love to hear your spin on this statement.
Quote
People who come into contact with any strain of influenza this year will have
only about a 50-50 chance of being protected by the flu shot.
Now what do you think this statement means?.
AC
 
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 02, 2015, 05:40:09 PM
@SarkUhm perhaps you could enlighten me then because I would love to hear your spin on this statement. Now what do you think this statement means?.
AC


He's busy trying to locate stats made up by the vaccinators...or failing that he will just alter the figures like usual.

And, I'm willing to bet his right hand is arthritis ridden and no longer good for hand jobs...a condition that may even have cost him his job at the bath house, as his lips are easily chaffed.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 02, 2015, 07:14:04 PM
perhaps you could enlighten me then because I would love to hear your spin on this statement.
Didn't you say that the risks of vaccination weren't worth the benefits?  Then retreat to a position of "it's just my opinion"?

Didn't you imply that the IQ of someone could be determined by observing them getting vaccinated?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on January 02, 2015, 07:53:55 PM
@Sark
Quote
Didn't you say that the risks of vaccination weren't worth the benefits?  Then
retreat to a position of "it's just my opinion"?
I'm not sure I understand, when I say something then obviously that is my opinion isn't it?. Im' not sure how one could retreat to a position of "it's just my opinion" when all we have are opinions... it makes no sense.
Now back to my last question, which part of the statement below do you not agree with again?.
Quote
People who come into contact with any strain of influenza this year will have
only about a 50-50 chance of being protected by the flu shot.
AC
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 02, 2015, 08:53:59 PM
I'm not sure I understand, when I say something then obviously that is my opinion isn't it?. Im' not sure how one could retreat to a position of "it's just my opinion"
Yawn.  Like talking to a 4th grader. Sure what you say is often your opinion however it's rarely purely your opinion.  When someone says "the risks outweigh the benefits" they are referencing something that is not purely a matter of opinion.   Hence you can, in fact retreat to a position of "it's just my opinion".

You also implied that you (and others) could determine someones IQ by watching them getting vaccinated.

"People who come into contact with any strain of influenza this year will have only about a 50-50 chance of being protected by the flu shot."

Well...

a) That isn't what you said originally and...
b) it's what I'd call "poorly phrased to the point of being useless".  "Any strain" - you mean any extant strain?  That's not exactly a useful metric since there are at least eleven serotypes and who knows how many extant strains.  Even if you were to assume you meant "prevalent strains" to determine what that means requires subtyping and less than a third of all virology is subtyped during flu season.  Not to mention we aren't even halfway through flu season.  So even here the statement is deceptive at best.  Now assuming I've been hired to do your homework for you and attempt to come up with a different statement which might be accurate.  One could see that the majority of typing that has been done is H3 and there have been concerned that there isn't a good match between what's in the current vaccine (A/California/7/2009 (H1N1)pdm09,A/Texas/50/2012 (H3N2), B/Massachusetts/2/2012) and a H3N2 strain which has been circulating.  Given that vaccine effectiveness varies between 60% and 80% for Influenza A anyway.  50% effectiveness isn't a bad estimate.  However that's just me trying to find an argument that fits your numbers.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on January 02, 2015, 09:13:18 PM
@SarkUhm perhaps you could enlighten me then because I would love to hear your spin on this statement. Now what do you think this statement means?.
AC
Let's suppose that this year's vaccine prevents flu in exactly 50%of patients who receive the vaccination.  Please explain what additional information, if any, that you would evaluate before making a recommendation for or against a given segment of the population getting the vaccination or skipping it.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 02, 2015, 09:13:42 PM
Quote from: Dog-One
Actually SeaMonkey, I'd prefer you refrain from saying any more than you already have.  There is a natural justice in all this.  Those that prefer to argue with you are far more inclined to blindly follow the mandates of the authorities.  To be quite honest, that suits me fine, let'm go.

DogOne,
I'm truly appreciative of your sage advice.
Being eternally hopeful I'm too often inclined
to expend effort where it would be best to just
let things roll along on their own. ;)

Those who've not been inside the "Authoritarian
Beast' simply cannot appreciate that it frequently
resorts to lies, deceptions and other unethical
activities as it works to implement the AGENDA.

In due time all will be awakened whether they wish
it or not...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 02, 2015, 09:31:53 PM
I'm too often inclined to expend effort
There really isn't much evidence to suggest you do this.  So don't worry. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 02, 2015, 09:53:21 PM
Quote from: sarkeizen
There really isn't much evidence to suggest you do this.  So don't worry. :)

When one is stuck within the Matrix one has very
limited vision.  Fear not, your eyes too will be opened
when the time is right.  All will be awakened whether
they wish it or not.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 02, 2015, 09:56:21 PM
When one is stuck within the Matrix one has very...
See, it requires no effort to make sweeping generalizations and imply that someone is mistaken.  However to clearly state a point and defend it does.  Hence, by your own admission once again.  You don't really put any effort in here. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: marathonman on January 02, 2015, 10:36:52 PM
I think it is hilarious to see people scramble every year like good little dumb robots to get their flu shots that have been proven time and time again that they are totally ineffective against fighting anything except your immune system and causing all kinds of heath problems. not to mention they have trace amounts of mercury and lead derivatives that do massive damage to your brain, liver, nervous system, sterility  and God knows what else.
i have stupid friends that get these idiotic shots every year and are sick all the time but someone like myself that knows better than to fall for this bull crap and knows the truth have been completely healthy like (forever).
The MOB owns 51% of the Pharmaceutical Companies so you do the math (if that's possible)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on January 02, 2015, 10:43:23 PM
@Sark
Quote
Yawn.  Like talking to a 4th grader. Sure what you say is often your opinion
however it's rarely purely your opinion.  When someone says "the risks outweigh
the benefits" they are referencing something that is not purely a matter of
opinion.
Oh your such a sweet talker, lol, So my opinion is not really my opinion even if I said it is according to you, I think. Uhm ok let's just leave it at that then. ??? 
AC
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on January 02, 2015, 11:01:25 PM
@Mark E
Quote
Let's suppose that this year's vaccine prevents flu in exactly 50%of patients
who receive the vaccination.  Please explain what additional information, if
any, that you would evaluate before making a recommendation for or against a
given segment of the population getting the vaccination or skipping it.
I would recommend everyone review both sides of the argument for and against the issue for themselves and not believe something from someone they do not even know such as me. Personally I get the flu once every few years for a day or so and then I'm good to go. As such a flu shot which may only be 50% effective and may have some serious side effects makes absolutely no sense for me. It is not even a minor inconvenience for me so really I see no point in it whatsoever.
My concern is that the government and pharmaceutical agencies seem to be saying the flu shot is "safe and effective". However at the same time the media is saying the flu shot may only work 50% of the time and that there may be serious side effects. I don't know who is correct, how could I, but I do know someone is most likely wrong and I would rather be safe than sorry. I simply offered an alternative view to the main stream one , no more no less.
AC
 
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 02, 2015, 11:15:30 PM
So my opinion is not really my opinion
No.

Something you say may be your opinion, however it may also actually be true.  Are you with me so far?  Do you need help?  No?  Ok.  Let's move on...

In fact the assumption in conversation is that when you assert something about the world you are doing so with the implicit proviso that your assertion is not just something not based on anything in reality.  In other words people are interested in the true parts of your opinions or at least discerning the true parts from the not-true parts.  Got that?  Think you can handle the next step?  No?  Ok take five, rest your brain.  Feel up to it now?  Good.

Now due to this when someone wants you to explain yourself and you offer nothing but "It's just my opinion".  You are considered to have retreated to this position.  Why?  Well because the assumption was that you were expressing not just that you believe something but that there is some reason - hopefully a good reason that it is true.  Another way to look at it is that conversation wouldn't work if we assume that every point of fact is more likely than not something the speaker just made up.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 02, 2015, 11:25:27 PM
Personally I get the flu once every few years for a day or so and then I'm good to go.
So a day or two and then no symptoms at all?  Then it's likely you are not getting the influenza that we vaccinate against...and that's probably in no small part because you are surrounded by people who are vaccinated.
Quote
As such a flu shot which may only be 50% effective and may have some serious side effects makes absolutely no sense for me.
It probably does.  You are much more likely to get the flu than you are a side effect.
Quote
My concern is
Doubtful that this is your concern, you've already asserted that you unequivocally determined that vaccinations generally are not worth the risk. It's kind of ingenuous to pretend like you have any equipoise here...but I'll play along... :)
Quote
the government and pharmaceutical agencies
What is a pharmaceutical "agency".  Is that like the CIA - Ciprofloxacin Investigative Agency?
Quote
seem to be saying the flu shot is "safe and effective". However at the same time the media is saying the flu shot may only work 50% of the time and that there may be serious side effects.
Are you saying that "safe and effective" isn't compatible with working up to 90% of the time and being able to have a million seasonal flu shots before an adverse effect?
Quote
I do know someone is most likely wrong and I would rather...
...think it couldn't possibly be yourself.  I get it. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on January 02, 2015, 11:55:39 PM
@Sark
LOL
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 03, 2015, 12:01:02 AM
@Sark
LOL
Kind of a step back from "It's my opinion."

It seems pretty reasonable that if you had any even partially thought out rationale for your position.  We would have likely seen it by now.   Is there a reason you keep playing "hide my argument"? Do you enjoy the attention that much? :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 03, 2015, 02:14:59 AM
A statistical study published in Science (http://rt.com/news/219347-cancer-random-bad-luck/) which offers
good cause to scratch one's head.  The 'scientists'
seem baffled - but then again, it is only statistical.

Quote from: Co-Author
“Cancer-free longevity in people exposed to cancer-causing agents, such as tobacco, is often attributed to their ‘good genes,’ but the truth is that most of them simply had good luck,” said the study co-author Bert Vogelstein.

The Cancer Industry is a huge money making
proposition.  Apparently it needs more money.
Advocating more testing to detect early cancer
definitely produces more money...

The establishment places little emphasis on the
need for healthy nutrition and strengthening of
the immune system.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 03, 2015, 02:19:46 AM
Another vacuous SeaMonkey post.
A statistical study published in Science (http://rt.com/news/219347-cancer-random-bad-luck/) which offers
good cause to scratch one's head.
Why is this a "good cause to scratch one's head"?
Quote
Advocating more testing to detect early cancer definitely produces more money...
Who is doing this where?
Quote
The establishment places little emphasis on the need for healthy nutrition
Who is "the establishment".  Doctors definitely emphasize improvements in lifestyle.
Quote
and strengthening of the immune system.
The immune system isn't a muscle.  It's not even a single thing and outside of vaccines there's very little you can do to "strengthen" it.  Sorry.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 03, 2015, 03:03:38 AM
Quote from: Sark-eizen
The immune system isn't a muscle.  It's not even a single thing and outside of vaccines there's very little you can do to "strengthen" it.  Sorry.

That is certainly a very strange statement.  Is
that an example of what is being taught in
establishment institutions today?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 03, 2015, 03:57:33 AM
That is certainly a very strange statement.  Is that an example of what is being taught in establishment institutions today?
then
I have no idea what an "establishment institution" is.  So I couldn't tell you.  However if you can provide some non-moronic information demonstrating how the immune system (whatever you mean by that) can be strengthened in some significant way.  Then please do.

I expect either something you've barely read which has a headline which you think agrees with you or sweet, sweet silence...hmmm but now that I've said that the smart money is probably on "disappear for a bit and post something entirely different pretending this conversation (if you can call it that) didn't exist".

Let's see which one you go for.... :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 03, 2015, 04:32:22 AM
...it's likely you are not getting the influenza that we vaccinate against...

I take it that wood be the 'royal' "we"...which in this case wood mean the 'vested we'.


Quote
You are much more likely to get the flu than you are a side effect...

Great advice folks...gamble that you won't have a life altering reaction to the cocktail of dubious content in vaccinations...OR, up your hygiene protocols during "flu season".


Quote
...you've already asserted that you unequivocally determined that vaccinations generally are not worth the risk. It's kind of ingenuous to pretend like you have any equipoise here...

Wow, I'd like to see the figures, which were compiled by an independent agency, that doesn't exist, that will back up these ludicrous statements.


Quote
Are you saying that "safe and effective" isn't compatible with working up to 90% of the time and being able to have a million seasonal flu shots before an adverse effect?

Now he's rockin' stats and numbers...but, whats baking them up you wood ask ?  Other that teir own "study's" that is.

Nothing, the readers are saying.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 03, 2015, 07:50:03 AM


The Cancer Industry is a huge money making
proposition.  Apparently it needs more money.
Advocating more testing to detect early cancer...


"more testing to detect early cancer"

Isn't that kinda like conducting tests to determine which cells were the first to die from the impact of the bullet ?...totally ignoring where the bullet originated...

Metaphorically speaking, one may conclude the bullet had the Dow Chemical stamp of approval.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 03, 2015, 10:36:01 PM
Quote from: sarkeizen
I have no idea what an "establishment institution" is.  So I couldn't tell you.  However if you can provide some non-moronic information demonstrating how the immune system (whatever you mean by that) can be strengthened in some significant way.  Then please do.

I expect either something you've barely read which has a headline which you think agrees with you or sweet, sweet silence...hmmm but now that I've said that the smart money is probably on "disappear for a bit and post something entirely different pretending this conversation (if you can call it that) didn't exist".

Let's see which one you go for.... :)

Postings, such as that above, which contain many
words but little substance;  provocative appeals for
'engagement' in the framework of sophistry; lacking
sincerity and appearing to arise from mindless regurgitation
of the 'official story line' are best left to expire in their own
basket.

Mindless Conformity to what flows down from the Establishment
is not my gig.

An Short Video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=ErT-5FUxS2k) which explains well how such
'operatives' do their 'thing' and what motivates them.

Question everything!  Think Critically!
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 04, 2015, 12:10:21 AM
Very comprehensive video.

It appears the 'royal' shill is out of gas (hot air)...maybe his arse kisser has something to add.

Oh, thats right, he's only programmed for yes man input...and grammar critique.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 04, 2015, 03:01:29 AM
provocative appeals for 'engagement' in the framework of sophistry;
It's more about asking you to support your point.  That is, sadly for you not sophistry.  Unless you are claiming that all you can produce is sophistry. :) In fact the only person who is keeping us from discussing your points critically is you.
Quote
Think Critically!
Perhaps can you can show me where you have engaged in critical thinking of any kind in the ideas you post here.  How much time have you spent attempting to refute those ideas.  The answer seems to be zero.  Let me know. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 04, 2015, 04:09:08 AM
He keeps asking for relevant points, yet ignores them when presented.

Is Cap feeling ignored, the readers wonder ?

Nope...just avoided...like the plague, fittingly enough.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 04, 2015, 07:01:34 AM
Quote from: sarkeizen
It's more about asking you to support your point.  That is, sadly for you not sophistry.  Unless you are claiming that all you can produce is sophistry. :) In fact the only person who is keeping us from discussing your points critically is you. Perhaps can you can show me where you have engaged in critical thinking of any kind in the ideas you post here.  How much time have you spent attempting to refute those ideas.  The answer seems to be zero.  Let me know. :)

Nay, your invitation is declined so as not to become
an enabler of your addiction.  Others may choose to
play that role for you if they desire.

It is presumed that you have the ability to conduct
research, digest resource materials and in time
come to your own considered conclusions.

Whether you're capable of existence outside the
Matrix is not positively known, however, the
language of your postings would indicate that
such may be an option to fearful to contemplate.

It is hard for someone to believe something when
their source of salary requires their not believing
it.  Such is life in the Matrix.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 04, 2015, 07:32:46 AM
your invitation is declined
Well it's nice to see you fessing up to deliberately thwarting the discussion of your views.  That's your business but it is interesting. :)

Quote
It is presumed that you have the ability to conduct research
On your views?  Nope, it is demonstrably impossible for anyone to research with any measurable degree of success what you believe without you being available to discuss it.  If you have something useful to say, you should say it.

Anyway, anytime you actually want to subject your views to critical thought orders better than your own.  Feel free to post them clearly and be willing to answer questions and provide supporting information.  If you want to keep pretending you have something to say, keep withholding your views. 

Let me know when you want to talk with the grownups. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 04, 2015, 08:37:09 AM
Sark-eizen,

Your need for intercourse (addiction) is
unappealing.

Whatever views I may possess are unimportant.

Your views of my views are unimportant.

What is important is finding TRUTH about all things.
Finding TRUTH often demands that we look in what
we may think of as 'unusual' places.  We need to be
fearless in our search and not let concerns about what
others may think become an impediment.

Those who are dependent upon the Matrix for all manner
of sustenance and whose loyalty is devoted to the Matrix
will find it very difficult to deviate from what is considered
'normal' thinking for fear of being accused of heresy.

For them the Matrix is all, does all and demands all.  Criticism
or critical thinking is not permitted.

Freedom to them is not freedom unless it is accompanied
by the rattle of their chains.

When you develop your individuality and decide to break
free from the restraints of the Matrix, discussion at some
level may be a real possibility.

Those who've awakened to your plight will not be persuaded
by your desperate pleas.  Your 'programming' is all too
obvious.


Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 04, 2015, 08:50:57 AM
Whatever views I may possess are unimportant.
The truth is they are clearly, obviously and inescapably important for anyone who is interested in the truth.

If they contradict my views and they are correct and I am interested in the truth then clearly they are important to me.  Unless you're claiming that all of your views are less correct than my own.  If that's your position then clearly you have nothing to offer me. 

But in that case, if you truly have even the tiniest interest in the truth.  Then you would provide your opinions in plain, unambiguous terms so they may be discussed and your views subjected to critical thought well beyond anything you are capable so your views would become more correct.

See despite your whining there are only two options to people interested in the truth.  Either one or more of your views are better than my own and therefore they should be presented to me to correct my errors or your views should be presented so that they may be corrected by me - as your critical thinking is probably amongst the worst anyone has ever seen.  I'm reasonably confident that my left sock is considerably better at determining the truth than you are. :)

Your refusal tells us that you are someone who is uninterested in the truth. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 04, 2015, 09:20:20 AM
Truth be told, “vaccinations” are only band-aids for the body.

The same “vaccination” will be needed for next year!!!!!! and that only is to a virus frequency only! And the “vaccination” cannot be used again to the same virus that becomes “immune” to it. Speakeing of immune, the only vaccination there is, is a way to SUPPORT our immunity!

Don't even want to go there where cancer is just lazy people not hunting for food!!!!

These stupid scientists are so smart that have figured out life yet we are heading down south, well whats the vaccination to the existence of this world? Doctors!!!!

PS. thanks web
 developer for not banning great minds. You need to be a millionaire`-*!
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: orbut 3000 on January 05, 2015, 12:43:50 AM
Health insurance, vaccinations and cancer screening is a rubbish, folks. Connect the money and follow the dots...
The truth is out there. Suppressed, yes. But it's out there just look it up.


Yeah, Folks, just buy them secret 12 p formulation for lots of stamina's and healthinesses and advanced apostrophy.
http://store.infowars.com/Secret-12_p_1427.html (http://store.infowars.com/Secret-12_p_1427.html)

TRUTH. Study it out. On the internet.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 05, 2015, 12:50:20 AM


Don't even want to go there where cancer is just lazy people not hunting for food!!!!


Cancer is caused by lazy people not hunting for food?

Man, what sort of drugs are you on?

Holy crap!  Or better yet....

Great Scott!

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 05, 2015, 12:28:50 PM
Quote
Man, what sort of drugs are you on?

I'm use to speaking in a psychophysical way mostly. Cancer is two things only 100% genetic and influential!!! Those are the only two things!! Being more at risk of cancer is mainly to the genetic code! And I believe in medicine to a certain extend but then I see GREED, or, ignorance. When a doctor believes he knows everything there is to learn in life just because he is only HELPING the immune system fo the body.

Doctors only HELP the immune system of the body = nothing else nothing more!. And this is very simplistic and expected because our “evolution” is what got us here and not doctors healing bodies? Well here I go again getting ahead of myself!

People need to hunt for food in order to process it! It is not just a matter of feeding them GENERIC stuff! Since the world is not generic! How to explain this?

The facts are that there are millions of microbes in all animals bodies trying to take over the body. Cancer is just the immune system trying to protect the body. “inflammation” cancer would not exists if the body would not protect the body!!! period. So you have to understand how the inflammation first occurs? Define the inflammation 100% from all angles and then define the preventative measures and then from that you will understand those that are born genetically predisposed!

But for some reason I don't have a feeling you can think about that!

Quote
Holy crap!  Or better yet....

Great Scott!

blah blah blah, explain how cancer is born? Explain inflammation and how is born? Then explain the steps the inflammation gets inflated? It is really not that hard to understand! It is all genetic or influenced. That is all. There is nothing more to try to figure out. Obesity causes cancer....being skinny causes bulimia....plain and simple stuff!

I seriously don't think you have the thoughts of how cancer works!

Well lets prove that right now today!

How does cancer work? (remember when I asked you how dishwashers work and you JB welded a fan blade lol. From that simple explanation of how dishwashers work, it showed you only based 'fixing" dishwashers by that alone! where you failed miserably. So I find it hard to believe anything that comes out of your writings/mouth, truth be told = facts)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 05, 2015, 02:37:04 PM
I'm use to speaking in a psychophysical way mostly.
Your phrasing isn't very cogent.
Quote
Cancer is just the immune system trying to protect the body.
How exactly?  What success rate would this have?  Cancer is an umbrella term for a number of different diseases which are related by all having various rates of unregulated cell growth.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: ramset on January 05, 2015, 03:28:57 PM
According to Dr. Stephanie Seneff, Senior Research Scientist at the MIT Computer Science and Artificial Intelligence Laboratory, by 2025, half the kids born in the U.S. will be diagnosed with autism.Dr. Seneff isn’t respected by the ivory towers of the pharmaceutical medicine paradigm or industrial agriculture, but she has something to say about autism. She is a computer scientist who transitioned into biology and toxicology, so people like to attack her credentials, but what Dr. Seneff has to say is key, and many other mainstream researchers have been negligent in reporting these findings.
She has been studying autism for over 7 years, along with the environmental factors that lead to the disease. Decreased exposure to sunlight, poor diet, vaccines (specifically aluminum and mercury), as well as glyphosate [color=rgb(27, 142, 222) !important]toxins[/color] from RoundUp are causing skyrocketing rates of autism. She explains this in a two-hour presentation given recently at Autism One.
Aluminum and Glyphosate
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
2025....remember 2005 ,that's how far away we are from 2025...
1 in 2 .thats a BIG change for your society .


Heresy.... silly.....?


snark,  you better start paying attention..the next generations to hit the planet ,will be  quite "modified"
very odd ..very odd indeed...


Chet
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 05, 2015, 04:45:07 PM
She has been studying autism for over 7 years, along with the environmental factors that lead to the disease. Decreased exposure to sunlight, poor diet, vaccines (specifically aluminum and mercury), as well as glyphosate [color=rgb(27, 142, 222) !important]toxins[/color] from RoundUp are causing skyrocketing rates of autism. She explains this in a two-hour presentation given recently at Autism One.
Aluminum and Glyphosate
Well firstly AutismOne is a conference for cranks but let's put that aside for a minute.  Shall we? Next it's worth looking at her webpage and see that while she has lectured a fair bit about these topics - she has published virtually nothing.   As someone who knows something about universities I'll tell you this.  As long as you don't get arrested or cost the institution money.  They don't care what you lecture on.  The majority of this persons education is in EE and CS.  So when some uneducated person says Seneff has been "studying autism for 7 years" they don't mean the same thing as someone who actually researches autism.  However, again let's put that aside.

Of the things on her website I saw a presentation she made for the Weston Price foundation which specifically mentioned vaccines.  So I looked at the slides.  While they don't give her notes, you'll see that most of what's being presented is just stuff from other known cranks.  Like Blaxil and Habakus. 

So what I'd suggest is that Seneff adds nothing to the discussion.  She has done virtually no original research and relies on people who are almost complete morons in their methodology and treatment of research.  IMHO you could cut off Mark Blaxil's head and he would continue produce equally useful information to what he has been making his money off for the past years. :)

The 2025 prediction isn't mentioned much but were I to guess it's probably based on extrapolation based on the idea that already refuted arguments are correct.  If you have anything directly linking to the math they are using for this prediction (but not a video I have little patience for one of the slowest methods of transferring information) I'd be happy to show you how stupid they are being (or admit I'm wrong but more likely the former) :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: ramset on January 05, 2015, 05:08:36 PM
Sigh...
she did mention 167 peer reviewed papers [apparently a bit more than the 2 persons  you mentioned].
and What position does she hold at MIT ??


stick your head back in the sand box..errhh hows that go??
nothing to see here folks
Move along...



Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 05, 2015, 05:45:00 PM
she did mention 167 peer reviewed papers [apparently a bit more than the 2 persons  you mentioned].
Then please post one that you feel provides very strong and clear evidence of a vaccine causing autism.  If there's 167 papers that make her points very clearly then she doesn't need to refer to Blaxil who has 0 to his name.  However you probably won't because when someone says something like that you don't think you just swallow it whole. :)
Quote
and What position does she hold at MIT ??
Perhaps you, because you know all about universities can tell me what you think her position has to do with her providing something worth discussing?  Again, I'm reasonably sure you can't answer this. :)

I more expect that you because you really haven't researched anything.  Will just pull a SeaMonkey - pretend there's information out there somewhere and it's up to someone else to make your argument for you (and then refute it). :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on January 05, 2015, 06:34:39 PM
@Ramset
Quote
According to Dr. Stephanie Seneff, Senior Research Scientist at the MIT Computer Science and Artificial Intelligence Laboratory, by 2025, half the kids born in the U.S. will be diagnosed with autism.Dr. Seneff isn’t respected by the ivory towers of the pharmaceutical medicine paradigm or industrial agriculture, but she has something to say about autism. She is a computer scientist who transitioned into biology and toxicology, so people like to attack her credentials, but what Dr. Seneff has to say is key, and many other mainstream researchers have been negligent in reporting these findings.


It would seem to be a vicious circle, those outside the circle who have no vested interest are ridiculed while those within it who represent a clear conflict of interest are not. It is simply another flavor of racism in my opinion and they have simply replaced the color of ones skin with credentials.


It would seem to me a computer scientist would know how to gather meaningful data better than anyone else as this is their field of expertise. So really she is being criticized because she has no vested or conflict of interest as the other researchers working within the system obviously do. It is odd how so many in science claim to be independent and unbiased and yet their employment relies on a lack of real solutions. You see if they actually found a cure or solution to any problem then they would no longer be needed and find themselves unemployed. It is quite ridiculous when we think about how the system works fundamentally.


At which time we could make a simple observation, billions upon billions are poured into research each year and yet we find they have found no real solutions to much of anything. Thus I must presume they are either stupid or incompetent or both. In the real world when a person is not getting the job done they are fired however in academia this would not seem to be the case. I believe it may rely on the terminology, Academia: professional scholars and students. Now what does that tell you?, why I know a few people who have went to university for over 25 years and never held a full time job and never done anything which matters in any way... a professional student, lol.


Thus we might understand their profession is not dependent on solutions but solely to retain their status or employment as a student or scholar. In effect they have created the perfect circular system whereby results do not matter but retaining their status is the primary concern which of course relates directly to their income. Why we may as well just come out and say it, academia is white and everyone else black which of course explains why the method of choice is degrading and ridiculing rather than open unbiased debate.



AC
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 05, 2015, 07:13:20 PM
It would seem to be a vicious circle
That's not what that idiom means - unless you add "Mrs. Parker and the" to the beginning. :)
Quote
those outside the circle who have no vested interest are ridiculed
Actually everyone has a vested interest in being right.  Mark "the moron" Blaxil has sold "vaccines causes autism" for years.  It would be nice if he could have a Pauline moment but it's not likely.  His entire career is as much or more based on this idea as Offit is on the opposite (probably more because Offit's pre-guardasil rep was more high-profile than Blaxil's was).
Quote
while those within it who represent a clear conflict of interest are not.
Your idea of conflict of interest is ridiculously distorted.  Certainly many people in the scientific community and those doing research have something to gain from the success of various pharmaceuticals however none of them have as much to lose as people who go around crusading on a particular idea.   
Quote
It is simply another flavor of racism in my opinion and they have simply replaced the color of ones skin with credentials.
LOL.  Racism is about differentiating based on race or ethnicity the reason that is wrong is because those things clearly do not have anything to do with (or it is reasonable to assume such) peoples ability to the vast majority of things in life.

However to compare that to the idea that we are reluctant to let people who have no experience as plumbers do plumbing.  Is both monumentally stupid and offensive.   Good show there.

Quote
It would seem to me a computer scientist would know how to gather meaningful data better than anyone else as this is their field of expertise.
No. Computer science, as a discipline generally sits between one of two polls.  Implementation - e.g. knowing how to write code and Algorithms - e.g. knowing how a particular approach scales in memory and time with input size.  This has absolutely nothing to do with "gathering meaningful data" you utterly. ignorant. moron.

Quote
yet their employment relies on a lack of real solutions. You see if they actually found a cure or solution to any problem then they would no longer be needed and find themselves unemployed. It is quite ridiculous when we think about how the system works fundamentally.
Your assumption is that there is an exceptionally small number of problems to be worked on in a particular field.  You can prove, in computer science since you are pretending (stupidly) you know something about this.  That there is no sort algorithm which can outperform a complexity of O(n log n) when the input width is arbitrary.   Yet somehow nobody kept this a secret and nobody got fired in this field as a result.   Please be stupid elsewhere.

Quote
Thus we might understand their profession is not dependent on solutions
So according to you.  If I found a cure - however you're defining that - for a disease.  You don't think that would help my employment?  This is really what you think.  That if I was a medical researcher and applied for the director of research at another institution that having two or three disease cures under my belt would actually harm my chances of getting that position?

...and people think academics are out of touch.  Sheeesh. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on January 05, 2015, 08:12:44 PM
@Ramset

It would seem to be a vicious circle, those outside the circle who have no vested interest are ridiculed while those within it who represent a clear conflict of interest are not. It is simply another flavor of racism in my opinion and they have simply replaced the color of ones skin with credentials.


It would seem to me a computer scientist would know how to gather meaningful data better than anyone else as this is their field of expertise. So really she is being criticized because she has no vested or conflict of interest as the other researchers working within the system obviously do. It is odd how so many in science claim to be independent and unbiased and yet their employment relies on a lack of real solutions. You see if they actually found a cure or solution to any problem then they would no longer be needed and find themselves unemployed. It is quite ridiculous when we think about how the system works fundamentally.


At which time we could make a simple observation, billions upon billions are poured into research each year and yet we find they have found no real solutions to much of anything. Thus I must presume they are either stupid or incompetent or both. In the real world when a person is not getting the job done they are fired however in academia this would not seem to be the case. I believe it may rely on the terminology, Academia: professional scholars and students. Now what does that tell you?, why I know a few people who have went to university for over 25 years and never held a full time job and never done anything which matters in any way... a professional student, lol.


Thus we might understand their profession is not dependent on solutions but solely to retain their status or employment as a student or scholar. In effect they have created the perfect circular system whereby results do not matter but retaining their status is the primary concern which of course relates directly to their income. Why we may as well just come out and say it, academia is white and everyone else black which of course explains why the method of choice is degrading and ridiculing rather than open unbiased debate.



AC
Appeal to authority is a logical fallacy.  No matter how qualified an expert is, it is the data and not the expert's representation of the data that tells the story.  Experts like Garwin say cold fusion claims are a load of bovine excrement.  Whether Garwin is right or wrong is not determined by his expertise but by the actual data.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 05, 2015, 09:01:21 PM
Appeal to authority is a logical fallacy.
Not exactly the way you seem to be using it.  Authorities, that is people are acceptable sources of information about a subject in an argument.  What is usually meant by "appeal to authority" is when a person cited is not an expert, misinterpreted or is asserting a non-consensus view (which is the case here but it seems more clear to simply say "they are not an expert and they are asserting a non-consensus view")

Quote
is not determined by his expertise but by the actual data
An expert saying something to you IS actual data.  It's just data where it's hard to quantify the error.  Didn't you say something roughly like: People absolutely MUST pay attention to people who meet your particular criteria for scientists (careful, diligent) even if they claim something utterly implausible?  I thought, to you ignoring those people would be hubris of the highest order. :)

Yet here you are saying that it's only their data that matters in terms of judging their rightness or wrongness. :)

But you seem to be able to judge the rightness or wrongess of making a useful error on the basis of their expertise. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: ramset on January 05, 2015, 10:47:21 PM
In this case the MIT  "data" is a collation Of 167 Peer reviewed papers specific to the study of  individuals that have been forever "modified"  by some  environmental  "effect"  which has apparently altered their DNA or changed them in other ways not easily understood at this point.


To suggest that these investigations are irrelevant or with out merit or substance is almost beyond belief.


Looney toons to say the least...


I will only post additional Research Data here ,there is no point in your silly "points" its just to argue .
This topic and this Research are not about arguing ,nor are either of you qualified to post an "original" sentence worthy of contribution to this research.


unless you Are secretly involved in your own ongoing research if so Please  contribute..
otherwise you contributions have no Merit beyond "gossip"


thx


Chet
 
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on January 05, 2015, 10:48:27 PM
Not exactly the way you seem to be using it.  Authorities, that is people are acceptable sources of information about a subject in an argument.  What is usually meant by "appeal to authority" is when a person cited is not an expert, misinterpreted or is asserting a non-consensus view (which is the case here but it seems more clear to simply say "they are not an expert and they are asserting a non-consensus view")
An expert saying something to you IS actual data.  It's just data where it's hard to quantify the error.  Didn't you say something roughly like: People absolutely MUST pay attention to people who meet your particular criteria for scientists (careful, diligent) even if they claim something utterly implausible?  I thought, to you ignoring those people would be hubris of the highest order. :)

Yet here you are saying that it's only their data that matters in terms of judging their rightness or wrongness. :)

But you seem to be able to judge the rightness or wrongess of making a useful error on the basis of their expertise. :)
There are also a number of references to an appeal or argument from authority where recognition in one area is illegitimately used to imply a reliable opinion where the speaker is not a SME.  However, I have good references, like this one that go further and state that argument from authority includes accepting a conclusion merely because it is the view of an SME:

http://www.princeton.edu/~achaney/tmve/wiki100k/docs/Appeal_to_authority.html 

Lots of SMEs make mistakes sooner or later.  When that has happened in civil engineering the consequences have sometimes been disastrous.

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 06, 2015, 12:14:11 AM
However, I have good references
Is that an intentional joke? Because accepting a definition of "argument from authority" from a "good reference" is effectively an argument from authority in the particular sense of accepting a conclusion ("an argument from authority is...") from someone simply because they are a SME ("a good reference"). :)
Quote
like this one that go further and state that argument from authority includes accepting a conclusion merely because it is the view of an SME:
It seems to say to accept an authority as infallible is fallacious.  Which is fine but I doubt a) that's really what you were talking about when you were contrasting the authority with data and b) it's probably not what the arguer - sorry I really can't remember the particular nutbars name in this case - had in mind.   In a everyday argument people do not have to assert that they consider some person, source or *gasp* even the sacred DATUM are fallible because we know they all are.  An informal argument isn't to produce a NECESSARY conclusion (necessarily :) ) but a reasonable one.

It would be different someone claimed or was in some kind of context where they were making a FORMAL logical argument.  In which case that sense of "argument from authority" would be a useful criticism.   However even data in that context would fall under the same criticism.   Which puts some pretty heavy limits on what can be discussed in that context.  Which is IMHO kind of the limitation which Wittgenstein was on about.  That said formal reasoning isn't without merit because it's good to show where the gaps are.  Where we have to rely on some person, reference, data...which is sort of where I was going when I was pushing profits for a formal argument back when I was hijacking the quenco thread.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 06, 2015, 12:23:53 AM
collation Of 167 Peer reviewed papers specific to the study of  individuals that have been forever "modified"  by some  environmental  "effect"  which has apparently altered their DNA or changed them in other ways not easily understood at this point.
Well, as we all know you haven't read any of them.  So actually all you have is someone's claim that 167 papers exist.  I'd point out that what we are discussing are vaccines and unless you've described the character poorly.  None of them have to be about vaccines or any ingredient in them. 
Quote
To suggest that these investigations are irrelevant or with out merit or substance is almost beyond belief.

Looney toons to say the least...
So you assert that ANY collection of papers totally 167 in number MUST BE ABSOLUTELY TRUE and RELEVANT TO ANYTHING?  Seems like the answer there would be "no" in both cases.  So you're still kind of stuck having to make a case between these alleged 167 papers and something even remotely like what we are discussing. :)

As I said why not pick out one paper which presents the STRONGEST EVIDENCE AGAINST VACCINES and we can destro....discuss it. :)

Quote
I will only post additional Research Data here ,there is no point in your silly "points" its just to argue .
"Additional" implies that you have already provided research data.  I'll I've seen is a claim by you.

Quote
nor are either of you qualified to post an "original" sentence worthy of contribution to this research.
Wrong.  I am qualified to review papers that use statistical methods.  So go ahead and post some of this research, actual papers and we will see what we will see....idiot.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on January 06, 2015, 12:48:26 AM
@Sark
Quote
No. Computer science, as a discipline generally sits between one of two polls.  Implementation - e.g. knowing how to write code and Algorithms - e.g. knowing how a particular approach scales in memory and time with input size.  This has absolutely nothing to do with "gathering meaningful data" you utterly. ignorant. moron.


Oh my name calling already?,  I have been programming and interfacing,building control systems for computers since the first personal computers were invented. Now let's ask an intelligent question, how do you think they get all the data and filter out data not relevant. Well... they use what's called data mining algorithms to sift through millions of files on the databases for relevant data. As such it seems obvious a computer scientist would know how to find the most relevant meaningful data in the most efficient way versus let's say a biologist who knows very little about computers or data mining.


Uhm which part of this do you not understand because it seems pretty straightforward?.


Quote
Wrong.  I am qualified to review papers that use statistical methods.  So go ahead and post some of this research, actual papers and we will see what we will see....idiot.


You may be but unfortunately we cannot believe a word you say until we see your credentials, lol. As you have implied, until we have proof we will have to assume your just another crack-pot just like the people you have criticized.
Your funny :) .

AC




Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on January 06, 2015, 12:58:48 AM
@Sark

Oh my,  I have been programming and interfacing,building control systems for computers since the first personal computers were invented. Now let's ask an intelligent question, how do you think they get all the data and filter out data not relevant. Well... they use what's called data mining algorithms to sift through millions of files on the databases for relevant data. As such it seems obvious a computer scientist would know how to find the most relevant meaningful data in the most efficient way versus let's say a biologist who knows very little about computers or data mining.


Uhm which part of this do you not understand because it seems pretty straightforward?.



You may be but unfortunately we cannot believe a word you say until we see your credentials, lol.

AC
Computer programs are available that assist in myriad of fields and tasks.  That fact says nothing about the skills of anyone involved in the science or engineering of computer.  The specific mathematic skills that would be relevant to evaluating study reports are skills in probability and statistics. 
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 06, 2015, 01:02:38 AM
Or maybe just a crack head on pot ?

Gotta love those straight lines.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on January 06, 2015, 01:07:43 AM
@Mark E

Quote
Computer programs are available that assist in myriad of fields and tasks.  That fact says nothing about the skills of anyone involved in the science or engineering of computer.  The specific mathematic skills that would be relevant to evaluating study reports are skills in probability and statistics.


Now who do you suppose wrote those programs?, Do you guys even know how computers actually work?. Unfortunately it's not like going down to the store to buy a loaf of bread and the software always needs refinement to perform specific tasks in the most efficient manner, now who do you suppose would do this... a biologist?. I'm thinking no.


AC







Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on January 06, 2015, 01:30:32 AM
@Mark E


Now who do you suppose wrote those programs?, Do you guys even know how computers actually work?. Unfortunately it's not like going down to the store to buy a loaf of bread and the software always needs refinement to perform specific tasks in the most efficient manner, now who do you suppose would do this... a biologist?. I'm thinking no.


AC
I know very well that expertise in computer scinece does not equate to expertise in design or use of software for any specific application.  I know full well that many programmers work on software where they have little or no understanding of the theory that underlays the end application.  Even if someone were smart enough to understand all of Knuth's books backwards and forwards, that would not give them any particular expertise in any computer application.  It would equip them to define efficient computer based algorithms to approach a defined task. 

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 06, 2015, 02:48:04 AM
Oh my name calling already?
No, that's my measured opinion of your intellectual abilities.
Quote
I have been programming and interfacing,building control systems for computers since the first personal computers were invented
Then you can thank David Dunning and Justin Kruger for your marvelous insight into other fields. :)
Quote
Now let's ask an intelligent question
I'm pretty sure it's not nearly as intelligent as you think it is.
Quote
how do you think they get all the data and filter out data not relevant.
All the data for what exactly? in what situation?  Most of the time an application filters data based on simple criteria provided by the designer. The number of times someone writes an algorithm to do something like trending is actually, by comparison pretty small.
Quote
they use what's called data mining algorithms to sift through millions of files on the databases for relevant data.
"relevant" is the wrong word.  It's data that matches a pattern or heuristic.  This pattern has been coded or otherwise described to the machine.  For example "Folding@home" looks for molecules which match certain characteristics to label them as drug candidates for specific diseases.
Quote
As such it seems obvious a computer scientist would know how to find the most relevant meaningful data in the most efficient way
The CS person (or more frequently a grad student) codes a program to match a set of criteria.  However the set of criteria is provided by someone who actually knows the subject matter.
Quote
Uhm which part of this do you not understand because it seems pretty straightforward?
That's Dunning and Kruger talking. :)
Quote
You may be but unfortunately we cannot believe a word you say until we see your credentials, lol. As you have implied, until we have proof we will have to assume your just another crack-pot just like the people you have criticized.
There's some irony that you are so bad at this that you didn't realize that I actually took the persons credential at face value.  What I didn't accept is the doofus's (sorry I don't remember the posters name I only recall his stupidity) assertion that someone who has an irrelevant degree, almost no current published work in the field of medicine and zero published work on vaccine harm.  Would have anything useful to say about vaccine harm.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 06, 2015, 02:55:44 AM
Now who do you suppose wrote those programs?,
Often it's a collaborative effort between SME's and some code monkey.  However it's irrelevant to performing data analysis.  For example, many researchers and people like myself use R.  You could hire the greatest CS person in the universe and it would be trivial to give them R and a question about determining if correlation exists between a very complex set of inputs.  That they would be utterly and completely lost at.   Believe it or not, the volumes and volumes of books on statistical analysis are not entirely contained in the mind of most CS grads.  In fact statistics is such a devilish discipline that an awful lot of statisticians aren't that good.
Quote
Do you guys even know how computers actually work?
Only all too well.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on January 06, 2015, 02:58:40 AM
@Sark
Quote
There's some irony that you are so bad at this


There lies the truth I believe as "this" has little to do with facts in my opinion but is a form of psychotic narcissistic behavior where people feel empowered by degrading and belittling others...not unlike racism. So I will leave you to "this" as I simply do not feel compelled to play your silly games. It is quite childish and pointless so I will leave you to it.


AC
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 06, 2015, 03:07:00 AM
There lies the truth I believe as "this" has little to do with facts
You're right, in the sense that you have been asked many, many, many times to provide something resembling facts and all you have come up with is "it's my opinion". :)
Quote
a form of psychotic narcissistic behavior where people feel empowered by degrading and belittling others...not unlike racism.
You mean like thinking that because someone is a CS major they are the best at data analysis? :)

Dude, if I have offended you I sincerely apologize however your inability to disclose and clarify your opinion but constantly consider it superior to every contrary one (many times implying that you have better information) is the tone of someone pretty arrogant.  If you want to have a discussion come off your high horse and support your point or simply say that there's really no reason for what you believe.  That's cool too.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 06, 2015, 04:19:16 AM
Good trolling...except for one or 2 minor details.

All this was done without ever having to disclose his study's, his peer reviewals and other "unvested" droolings, and trying to pass it off of evedence that injecting a witch's brew of chemicals were good for you.

Remember the names they had for native americans while they were about gifting them with blankets contaminated with small pox ?

The victims change, and the game remains the same.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 07, 2015, 04:53:52 AM
New York City is moving forward with its requirement
for flu shots making them mandatory. (http://www.globalresearch.ca/new-york-city-mandates-flu-shots-for-toddlers-even-after-centers-for-disease-control-cdc-admits-they-dont-work/5423201)

The article contains links to information regarding
exemptions (Medical or Religious) which still permits
opting out of the requirement.

The Matrix desires that all within it are 'fully compliant'
with its wishes.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 07, 2015, 06:10:41 AM
The article contains links to
...mostly nonsense written by people who have lower IQ's than the clothes I'm currently wearing.  Don't you think it's interesting that nobody who writes these things seems to know how to compare an annual .5ml flu-shot and the 690580 ml of water you drink per year.

Is it your contention that they know some SEEEEEEECRET MATH or are they just wrong? :)

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on January 07, 2015, 06:30:01 AM
...mostly nonsense written by people who have lower IQ's than the clothes I'm currently wearing.  Don't you think it's interesting that nobody who writes these things seems to know how to compare an annual .5ml flu-shot and the 690580 ml of water you drink per year.

Is it your contention that they know some SEEEEEEECRET MATH or are they just wrong? :)
Wait how does this remarkable thing called arithmetic work:  Concentration of material times material consumed = absolute quantity.  So, eight cups of water is about 1.9 liters per day at a safe limit concentration of 1/25,000 per day compared to 5/10,000 liters in the shot is 19/125 the absolute quantity in the shot, carry the five while sucking from a soda contained in an aluminum can, and burping a fine meal from McDonalds, and find out that the shot is equivalent to the safe limit in drinking water consumed in less than a week.  There must be something wrong with that math.  We better try this again after eating a nice tuna salad for brain food.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 07, 2015, 06:46:32 AM
I think you missed a π somewhere and perhaps forgot to take the octagonal root of ɛ.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on January 07, 2015, 07:08:04 AM
I think you missed a π somewhere and perhaps forgot to take the octagonal root of ɛ.
Well it goes without saying that if we don't exponetiate phi that we will possibly miss the nuances of 2 multiplied by 2, but this is a family oriented audience so racy things like raising things to powers have to be held in check.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: orbut 3000 on January 07, 2015, 09:56:35 PM
http://beforeitsnews.com/alternative/2014/08/brain-eating-nanobots-being-put-in-vaccines-says-whistleblower-3006640.html (http://beforeitsnews.com/alternative/2014/08/brain-eating-nanobots-being-put-in-vaccines-says-whistleblower-3006640.html)


This is scary.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 07, 2015, 10:06:34 PM
This is scary.
It's kind of awesome really. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 08, 2015, 02:27:05 AM
Wait how does this remarkable thing called arithmetic work:  Concentration of material times material consumed = absolute quantity.  So, eight cups of water is about 1.9 liters per day at a safe limit concentration of 1/25,000 per day compared to 5/10,000 liters in the shot is 19/125 the absolute quantity in the shot, carry the five while sucking from a soda contained in an aluminum can, and burping a fine meal from McDonalds, and find out that the shot is equivalent to the safe limit in drinking water consumed in less than a week.  There must be something wrong with that math.  We better try this again after eating a nice tuna salad for brain food.

Mark:

Do not forget that a small percentage of that water is actually heavy water, which was an important substance used in the creation of the nuclear bomb.  So, the more water one drinks...the more heavy water they consume.

Oh, the horror.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on January 08, 2015, 03:25:27 AM
Mark:

Do not forget that a small percentage of that water is actually heavy water, which was an important substance used in the creation of the nuclear bomb.  So, the more water one drinks...the more heavy water they consume.

Oh, the horror.

Bill
Do I look all rancid and clotted? You look at me, Jack. Eh? Look, eh? And I drink a lot of water, you know. I'm what you might call a water man, Jack - that's what I am. And I can swear to you, my boy, swear to you, that there's nothing wrong with my bodily fluids. Not a thing, Jackie.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 08, 2015, 03:40:24 AM
How do you do this...it's magic. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on January 08, 2015, 03:45:55 AM
How do you do this...it's magic. :)
It's all done through clean living and respecting the property rights of the Coca-Cola Company.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 08, 2015, 04:15:29 AM
Does Tim Conway have an opening readily available in his schedule to direct this cacophony ?

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 08, 2015, 05:27:30 AM
And here, ladeeees and gentlemen...yet another CDC oopsy moment.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x47Qk-go4ZE


Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 08, 2015, 08:37:14 AM
Medical Monsters Turn Joy into Horror (http://www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/?p=109341)

Therein may lie a partial explanation.

For the 'weirdness' of certain folk in today's
U.S.

It is truly unfortunate that 'medicine' in the U.S.
has been touched in a big way by Love of Money.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 08, 2015, 01:27:56 PM
It is truly unfortunate that 'medicine' in the U.S. has been touched in a big way by Love of Money.
...more unfortunate how utterly uncritical you are of your own ideas. :)  I'm not an expert in they way US hospitals are managed (this is an important phrase because you pretty much assume you are the absolute expert in everything you post on) but I do know how Canadian hospitals are managed.  Docs are salaried.  So there is absolutely no benefit to them personally for giving drugs or advising on procedures that are unnecessary.  Yet we use pretty much every intervention listed at close to the same rate.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 09, 2015, 08:58:25 AM
Quote
How exactly?  What success rate would this have?  Cancer is an umbrella term for a number of different diseases which are related by all having various rates of unregulated cell growth.

Let me guess, you DO NOT know that your common male deodorant has micro-aluminum beads. Why you ask? Well, the intent purpose of that is for the aluminum micro pieces is to “plug” the sweat ducts! Lol. Hence, once the ducts are plugged, it will stop the sweat! But they forget that the smell comes from the bacteria and not the sweat!!! this is very simplistic to understand that the “deodorant” (to prevent bad odor) is just trying to plug the sweat ducts and add some nice scent on top of the layer!

Like I said, cancer is only derived by only TWO things! 1) generic 2) influenced.

- smoking will cause cancers
-obesity will cause cancers
-alcohol will cause cancers
-couch potatoes will cause cancers

This is very simple but it cannot be stopped because of the BLINDED mentality of all current main stream mentality....which is GREED!

Is like the QEG, there is an answer to make one but it is stop based on the “secrecy to protect the country”...so none of the QEGs will get out because of that law.

Now as of health, the cure will never come out because human deceases are cash cows.

I 100% am sure that TV commercials cause ADD and other disorders! They play commercials to make you a zombie and implant a psychological memory. Now is like you are speaking with someone and they keep on bothering you and distracting your brain 24/7 = ADD! Oh, "take this pill for your cure sir", says the doctor! = give me money for your never ending cure! lol. (we don't know where it comes from because we only focus on the money...ahem, i mean the cure)

The cancers can be stopped all the way down to the GENETIC ones only. Theres no need to understand how cancers work, it's only a matter of knowing what causes them.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 09, 2015, 09:23:11 AM
Quote
This is scary.

That has being going on for a long time = generic. They try to distract you from all of that with Hollywood and their movies while they are doing their dirty work in the background!

Do you not see how the media abuses humans minds and bodies, for example the show “naked and afraid” where we know 100% no one will face that danger since 50% of the trees and animals are gone since the year 2000 but yet they BRAINWASH people to go to the show as to prove that they are worth something!

They try to distract you via the human body urge of the opposite  (seeing them naked) and the “evolutionary” way of life = survival!

If you want the COLD HARD TRUTH, we are in a world wide extinction as we speak...in a few more years 90% of all trees and non-human animals will go extinct that NASA only will try to seek another world to escape to. Money cannot be going on 90% of the time since we where never “evolved” due to money/GREED!

This is a pathetic way of those NERDS and INTELLIGENT people trying to control the population. But a lot of people are already too blinded to see this, so your brainwashed brain only want to focus on the next video game/movie/comedy show....instead of trying to fight to fix this sick mentality that it shows obviously they can't do anything about it = 50% of all animals are gone since the year 2000 and that animal numbers will continue to decline...call me joeltradamus! Oh, wait, i'm just going to sit in my couch and say "for shame" and then change the channel! lol I mean what else can we do if we know the answer? Besides debating with people on forums?


Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 09, 2015, 02:57:34 PM
Like I said, cancer is only derived by only TWO things! 1) generic 2) influenced.
You said it was the immune system.  So perhaps you can say why you think this instead of just talking about everything but that? :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 09, 2015, 02:58:48 PM
channel! lol I mean what else can we do if we know the answer?
Decide that maybe you don't and see where that gets you. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 09, 2015, 04:09:05 PM


Let me guess, you DO NOT know that your common male deodorant has micro-aluminum beads. Why you ask? Well, the intent purpose of that is for the aluminum micro pieces is to “plug” the sweat ducts! Lol. Hence, once the ducts are plugged, it will stop the sweat! But they forget that the smell comes from the bacteria and not the sweat!!! this is very simplistic to understand that the “deodorant” (to prevent bad odor) is just trying to plug the sweat ducts and add some nice scent on top of the layer!


Totally incorrect.

You have just demonstrated that you do not know the difference between an antiperspirant and a deodorant.  Two totally different things.
Two totally different feature/benefits.

If you are confused about something as simple as this, it makes one wonder what else you are confused about when you post about complex things.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 09, 2015, 10:18:28 PM
A short, (9 min. 38 sec.)very informative video about flu
vaccinations and more. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvXIqUyOdK4#t=186)

And, an informative article about
The Problem with Western Medicine. (http://www.thedailybell.com/news-analysis/35984/In-the-Race-to-Medicalize-Cannabis-Big-Pharma-Stumbles/?uuid=6F808B25-5056-9627-3C1C0B7DA4C0C1D3)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 10, 2015, 03:15:36 AM
A short, (3 min.)very informative video about SeaMonkey. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5YKbYLb5GVc&t=4m6s)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 10, 2015, 03:29:13 AM
I wonder if it means that I have a highly developed sense of nonsensical trivia if I have no interest in clicking that link ?

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 10, 2015, 03:34:25 AM
And, an informative article about
More like a meandering and poorly constructed article. One particularly amusing quote:

"Anyway, this is Western medicine's big flaw. Call it the "chemicalization" of medicine. The natural products on which most Western medicine is built may have various effects as well, but surely chemical effects are more unpredictable and noxious."

The problems with that statement are pretty obvious:
i) Unless you are using some pretty idiosyncratic definition of "natural product" you are saying something misleading.  The number of true natural products which are also useful medicine are few.
ii) Those which are derived from natural products often have low to no effect.  i.e. You could try to use willow bark as an anti-pyretic but you would likely not be successful and even evidence for it's use from the 1800's were done using a refined form. The closest example I can think of is Quinine but even that needs to be distilled in some way.
iii) Those which are useful in their natural form have no control over the dosage or toxicity in their natural form.

So what would happen is this.  Suppose you had cancer and you wanted to take Toxol from Yew Bark.  You would...

a) Most likely end up having no effect because the dose you are taking is way to small to have a useful effect.
b) If you did somehow take a clinical dose by eating bark.  You would end up engaged in mass deforestation and...
c) Probably end up dying from one of the thousands of other chemicals in the bark.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 10, 2015, 03:52:38 AM
Cherry picking = commonly used method to avoid acknowledging relevant evidence...usually in cover-ups of one kind or another.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 10, 2015, 04:51:31 AM
A short, (3 min.)very informative video about SeaMonkey. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5YKbYLb5GVc&t=4m6s)

Well, what can I say Sark-Eizen?  ;D

You try and you try but always seem to miss
the mark. ;)

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 10, 2015, 06:17:00 AM
Quote
You said it was the immune system.  So perhaps you can say why you think this instead of just talking about everything but that?

well YES the immune system is what causes an unbalance hence cancer. Pretend a human immunity cells always try to defend the body against a foreign object! And this is kind of beautiful in its own way because it shows that human cells think for themselves! As if the human cells are not controlled by the human body but they are acting upon themselves to heal the animal alone with out the human brain telling them what to do! For example, the human body gets a cut, and you can be watching a movie thinking about boobs while the cells are busy repairing your pathetic stinky body lol (I talk drama lol)

So in an obese person, the human cells get confused because obesity is not evolution! Since human cells know evolution is the TRUTH...so in an obese person the human cells get confused and try to protect the human body from obesity as a way of telling the fat person “hey you are fat and your life expectancy will be lower” so please eat less. Once the person does not slim down to make the cells happy and not confused, they start to become “obese” themselves. IOW, they start to get confused and may even attack healthy cells because they are so confused but they mean well= immune system.

The reason I say that cancer relates to the immune system is because the “cancerous” cells are only trying to protect the body. BUT, the cells can do so much if the animal brain cannot understand how life works. So the cells will attack it's own body if they get confused (obesity, smoking, alcohol, etc) = cancer.

What I mean by generic is you being born with your moms/dads nose. What I mean about influenced is you making your human IMMUNE system confused to the point your cells attack your own body because they are out of balance!
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 10, 2015, 06:48:39 AM
Quote
Decide that maybe you don't and see where that gets you.

Well I see all of this stuff in my little head! To the point that I wish I was in the realm of “ignorance is bliss”. Then I try to tell the “ignorant” that being ignorant is not bliss but is being a slave. But then all I get is “your are wrong based on TV” lol

Let me ask you this “wise one”, how do you influence people for their benefit? You don't want their money, you don't want his wife, you don't want anything from that obese person but just tell the obese person, by being obese you are shaving 20 years of your life for sure.

It is the same with EARTH, I don't want money, I don't want female virgins, I just see the next GREAT EXTICNTION coming soon! The human population will implode and a new civilization will grow as has been shown in the history of time space! SO, i'm here sitting in the present looking at the future where my hands are tied...and I find it hard to convince others. Mark my words, WE ARE IN THE MIDDLE OF THE NEXT WORLD WIDE EXTICTION. Now I need to go play my PS4 from this facts.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 10, 2015, 07:00:39 AM
Quote
You have just demonstrated that you do not know the difference between an antiperspirant and a deodorant.  Two totally different things.
Two totally different feature/benefits.

lol I knew you where going to say that! Which I truly believe that you only speak about stuff right after you google them. Lol.

How do I know that? You ignored the rest of my main points! Even if I give you the crown of you “correcting” me still you only focus on one angle alone!

I am still right that antiperspirant uses micro aluminum beads to plug the sweat ducts while using some type of oily layer with a nice pleasant scent to the nose. A deodorant is still nice pleasant way odor over the bad smelling bacteria in your arm pits.

We would not need any deodorant if you washed your armpits in the first place!

Quote
If you are confused about something as simple as this, it makes one wonder what else you are confused about when you post about complex things.

Well JB weld your armpits together bro! Lol = case closed!

You are not brain capacity challenge bro!
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 10, 2015, 07:40:24 AM
lol I knew you where going to say that! Which I truly believe that you only speak about stuff right after you google them. Lol.

How do I know that? You ignored the rest of my main points! Even if I give you the crown of you “correcting” me still you only focus on one angle alone!

I am still right that antiperspirant uses micro aluminum beads to plug the sweat ducts while using some type of oily layer with a nice pleasant scent to the nose. A deodorant is still nice pleasant way odor over the bad smelling bacteria in your arm pits.

We would not need any deodorant if you washed your armpits in the first place!

Well JB weld your armpits together bro! Lol = case closed!

You are not brain capacity challenge bro!

Exactly why I only use deodorant....once I learned this difference in college in the 70's.  Sorry, no Google back then.  JB Weld is great, you might learn how to use it one day.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 10, 2015, 08:02:13 AM
Quote
Exactly why I only use deodorant....once I learned this difference in college in the 70's.  Sorry, no Google back then.  JB Weld is great, you might learn how to use it one day.

Well I don't use a deodorant nor antiperspirant cause I wash my armpits. Since the 70's you have not washed your armpits properly bro? Lol

I know about JB weld very clearly, and I tell you, JB welding a fan motors blade will eventually fail....it is wayyyyyyyyyyyy better to drill a hole and use a screw and nut to keep them together, other than that, use a welder to weld the two! But JB weld is the bottom feeder.

How old are you bill? Much respect for the elder.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 10, 2015, 08:16:27 AM
Well I don't use a deodorant nor antiperspirant cause I wash my armpits. Since the 70's you have not washed your armpits properly bro? Lol

I know about JB weld very clearly, and I tell you, JB welding a fan motors blade will eventually fail....it is wayyyyyyyyyyyy better to drill a hole and use a screw and nut to keep them together, other than that, use a welder to weld the two! But JB weld is the bottom feeder.

How old are you bill? Much respect for the elder.

Well...that fan was repaired without removing the motor...which was the point.  This woman had called a "certified" repairman, and he told her that he had to drill out the rivets holding the motor to the frame, and then replace the motor.  His estimate?  $250.00.  I repaired it for her for less than $1.  I did not have to remove the motor.  This was over 4 years ago and, last time I saw her, she thanked me again and said everything was working just fine.

So, I am not sure what your point is?  There was a problem, I fixed it...it is still fixed.  JB Weld will eventually fail?  Well, the spot weld from the factory eventually failed after only 6 months.  Your point is?

Yes, I shower daily but, if you do not use a deodorant, then I am glad you are wherever you are and not here.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 10, 2015, 08:34:11 AM
Quote
Well...that fan was repaired without removing the motor...which was the point.  This woman had called a "certified" repairman, and he told her that he had to drill out the rivets holding the motor to the frame, and then replace the motor.  His estimate?  $250.00.  I repaired it for her for less than $1.  I did not have to remove the motor.  This was over 4 years ago and, last time I saw her, she thanked me again and said everything was working just fine.

Yes but I 100% here can tell you that JB weld is not as strong as induction welding, plasma welding, or bolts holding it together.

I can appreciate you fixing her dishwasher with JB wled, but that does not mean you understand how the whole dishwasher works. In fact, the engineers whom designed it know this and her dishwasher crapping is just a matter of assembly line error, nothing else nothing more. The mere fact that your “fixed” the fan to the motor is no big deal. You should not be proud of since that fan was made to cool the motor windings! IOW, the motor needs air circulation over it to cool it down or else it will over heat and the windings will short out! But you don't think about WHY dishwashers fail even if their FAN BLADES are in tact in the motor shaft do you? NO! You only based fixing dishwasher based on your JB weld Fixing! Only.


Quote
So, I am not sure what your point is?  There was a problem, I fixed it...it is still fixed.  JB Weld will eventually fail?  Well, the spot weld from the factory eventually failed after only 6 months.  Your point is?

My point is that you understand why the fan is there in the first place right? And if the fan is not there, then the motor dies? It is like the heart of a human! Jb welding for four years is not the same as living for 100 years.

Why are you so proud of fixing this motor blade with JB weld? It is not as strong as actual metal to metal welding and this has been shown by those dorks of “myth busters”...case closed!

Quote
Yes, I shower daily but, if you do not use a deodorant, then I am glad you are wherever you are and not here.

lol, Why do you use a deodorant if you wash the bacteria away from the armpits daily?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 10, 2015, 08:44:07 AM


Why are you so proud of fixing this motor blade with JB weld? It is not as strong as actual metal to metal welding and this has been shown by those dorks of “myth busters”...case closed!



Myth busters are idiots, and if you do not know this than you are ignorant.

Quote

lol, Why do you use a deodorant if you wash the bacteria away from the armpits daily?


So I do not smell like you.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 10, 2015, 08:56:30 AM
Quote
Myth busters are idiots, and if you do not know this than you are ignorant.

Well you just ignored everything I said before I mentioned the “myth busters”...I have nothing to say to that that I find them stupid!

Still, I don't see the MAIN point you are trying to make!

Tell me why armpits stink and need deodorant? Yar yara yaray!

Quote
So I do not smell like you.

LOL, all armpit bacteria smells the same. You telling me that you use a “deodorant” to cover the smell only implies you are covering the gases the bacteria emit. I tell you that I don't use a deodorant because I kill armpit bacteria and you tell me that you are glad that I kill armpit bacteria while you just use a deodorant to cover yours, priceless. I seriously don't find any brain power in your brain bro.

Use deodorant to cover the bacteria smell while I don't use any because I don't allow the bacteria to live there! OK! Call me stupid!  ::)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 10, 2015, 02:49:58 PM
I seriously don't find any brain power in your brain bro.

Use deodorant to cover the bacteria smell while I don't use any because I don't allow the bacteria to live there! OK! Call me stupid!  ::)


In defense of the pirate joel, he has shown himself to be quite google smart on many occasions.

Also, he was probably busy kissing some arse, and may have been schlightly distracted when he posted.

Regards...


 
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 11, 2015, 12:31:33 AM
You try and you try
Anytime you want to step into the ring...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 11, 2015, 12:35:37 AM
So the cells will attack it's own body if they get confused (obesity, smoking, alcohol, etc) = cancer.
Uh...in a word..."no".  How do we know you're wrong?  Well there's already an unrelated series of diseases where an immune response acts against ones own tissues.  These are called auto-immune disorders.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 11, 2015, 12:38:36 AM
And if you wish to be ignored once you get in the "ring", just ask him to produce real evidence that vaccines are effective...never mind safe.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 11, 2015, 12:39:31 AM
Well I see all of this stuff in my little head! To the point that I wish I was in the realm of “ignorance is bliss”.
...and never once do you question even slightly if you are right.  Your so-called angst over informing people that they are wrong seems to be more about YOU than about other people.   There's some actual food-for-thought. eh?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 11, 2015, 12:43:41 AM
Where is the royal arse kisser ?

The "king" requires his royal arse kisser.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 11, 2015, 01:08:37 AM
We would not need any deodorant if you washed your armpits in the first place!
Actually it's more complex...

Everyone has bacteria on their skin and everyone has sweat glands.  The smell comes from the bacteria consuming lipids from apocrine sweat glands.  Some people produce more of these substances than others (the AA allele of ABCC11 for example often means you will rarely if ever have body odour).

Now your skin is actually slightly hostile to this bacteria due to it's natural Ph (somewhere between 4 and 6).  When you wash your skin you bring your skin Ph closer to 8 and if you wash with soap (which is often alkaline) this increases your Ph even more.  So washing, while it will reduce some of the bacteria and a lot of the lipids it will also promote bacteria growth.

At some point your body has enough bacteria and is producing enough lipids from the apocrine glands that you will smell.  For some people this can simply be washing, others would have to wash many times a day with soap.  For these people anti-perspirant is a perfectly reasonable option.

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on January 11, 2015, 01:40:28 AM
Actually it's more complex...

Everyone has bacteria on their skin and everyone has sweat glands.  The smell comes from the bacteria consuming lipids from apocrine sweat glands.  Some people produce more of these substances than others (the AA allele of ABCC11 for example often means you will rarely if ever have body odour).

Now your skin is actually slightly hostile to this bacteria due to it's natural Ph (somewhere between 4 and 6).  When you wash your skin you bring your skin Ph closer to 8 and if you wash with soap (which is often alkaline) this increases your Ph even more.  So washing, while it will reduce some of the bacteria and a lot of the lipids it will also promote bacteria growth.

At some point your body has enough bacteria and is producing enough lipids from the apocrine glands that you will smell.  For some people this can simply be washing, others would have to wash many times a day with soap.  For these people anti-perspirant is a perfectly reasonable option.
The new Muriatic Acid Wash from NoReg Industries Hoboken NJ gently removes bacteria and softens your skin at the same time.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 11, 2015, 01:52:40 AM
Quote from: Sark-Eizen
Actually it's more complex...
...
At some point your body has enough bacteria and is producing enough lipids from the apocrine glands that you will smell.  For some people this can simply be washing, others would have to wash many times a day with soap.  For these people anti-perspirant is a perfectly reasonable option.

Anti-perspirants and deodorants are
resorted to by those who are unaware
of the simple, inexpensive solution.

Sodium Bicarbonate solution in the
armpits and other sweat prone regions
of the body will keep them 'clean' and
healthy and smelling good.

The 'old ways' are often the best.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 11, 2015, 01:57:37 AM

How old are you bill? Much respect for the elder.



I am 56, although this winter is about to kill me.  (I work outside all day long)  It was -8 here on Wed. and I almost froze to death.  I have good gear which is why I survived.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 11, 2015, 03:03:43 AM
Sodium Bicarbonate solution in the armpits and other sweat prone regions of the body will keep them 'clean' and
healthy and smelling good.
Water is going to sluice off bacteria and lipids.  So if you have relatively easy to control odor and you wash yourself. You can add any nonsense remedy you want and chalk it up to success.   Which I suspect is a big part of your life - assuming you're not just a troll.

If your "solution" is more of a paste and contains a lot of NaHCO3 you will likely end up irritating the skin.   Why?  Same reason that it becomes biotoxic.  It raised the pH.
Quote
The 'old ways' are often the best.
See this is a perfect example of how much you aren't really someone who thinks about what's true.  If you did, you would realize that such a statement would require knowledge of a representative sample of "old ways" and a representative sample of "new ways".  Which you likely don't (putting aside that the terms themselves are pretty poorly defined).
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 11, 2015, 04:48:16 AM
Quote
Uh...in a word..."no".  How do we know you're wrong?  Well there's already an unrelated series of diseases where an immune response acts against ones own tissues.  These are called auto-immune disorders.

All I mean is 100% FACTS that smoking, alcohol, obesity will cause cancers. This is facts right? That is all I mean by my statements! If I want to duel DEEPER in how that works, I would learn how body cells work and how the human immunity work. I know for a fact that human cells are encoded in their brain what to do! (like I said, repairing a cut in an animal)

So you cannot disagree with me that smoking, alcohol, and obesity do not cause cancers. That is what I call “influenced” and the GENETIC part is another thing.

Tell me how or why a cancer happens in an alcoholic person?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 11, 2015, 05:00:51 AM
Quote
...and never once do you question even slightly if you are right.  Your so-called angst over informing people that they are wrong seems to be more about YOU than about other people.   There's some actual food-for-thought. eh?

I question myself all of the time. Me and my brain have a hate and love relationship lol.

I know for a FACT that obesity will reduce your life expectancy by as much as 30 years and when I even think in the wild an obese person is easy picking for the hunters and very delicious.

To stay on point, I don't see where i'm wrong when I say that obesity, alcoholism, smoking, does not cause cancers! This i'm sure the people whom are obese, are smoking, and are drinking deep down know this. But their “addicted” part of their brain is more powerful than the “retional” part of their brain...and we can keep on digging deeper and deeper but over the top layer, we can see where that is headed = cancers. And this is only based on “influencing” cancers but there is also genetic cancers.

A skinny person will suffer lest body wise than an obese person 100% facts. And here I go into the real of GREED, well an obese person will buy more mcdonals than a skinny person. And i'm pretty sure they ad some scientific ingredients in there by the paid scientists to hit on that craving gene in all of us so we can keep on buying! But then i'll be going really deep in to the corruption of society!

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 11, 2015, 05:16:26 AM
Quote
Everyone has bacteria on their skin and everyone has sweat glands.  The smell comes from the bacteria consuming lipids from apocrine sweat glands.  Some people produce more of these substances than others (the AA allele of ABCC11 for example often means you will rarely if ever have body odour).

Still, every time you take a bath, you are washing away the body bacteria. Same as when you brush your teeth! No matter what you say, all animals shower to get rid of aliens on their skin/feathers.

Quote
Now your skin is actually slightly hostile to this bacteria due to it's natural Ph (somewhere between 4 and 6).  When you wash your skin you bring your skin Ph closer to 8 and if you wash with soap (which is often alkaline) this increases your Ph even more.  So washing, while it will reduce some of the bacteria and a lot of the lipids it will also promote bacteria growth.

The point is that bacteria will always live in your body, i'm sure I have 3 billion of them right now all over my body. And my body immune system sees them while I can't with my eyes. But I am 100% sure that taking a shower will take one million of the bacteria down the drain off my body.

I even thought about washing your hands. We wash our hands before we eat to WASH away the bacteria that want to get inside our body. And some of them do get through...(we also have air borne ones but thats another story for another day). I made a conclusion that most of the bacteria that enters our body even after washing our hands that come from our hands is via the thumb, since the thumb is not close to the other four fingers, it stays the dirtiest. I thought about that that i'm 100% the thumb stays the dirtiest when people wash their hands. At any rate! I bet $100 US dollars that the thumb has more bacteria than the rest of the fingers!!!!

Quote
At some point your body has enough bacteria and is producing enough lipids from the apocrine glands that you will smell.  For some people this can simply be washing, others would have to wash many times a day with soap.  For these people anti-perspirant is a perfectly reasonable option.

Well sweating is the HVAC cooling system of the body! If you plug the sweat glands with aluminum, i'm sure you are causing another imbalance.

The micro world is more complicated than the things that your see with the naked eye. I'm not even going to pretend that I know the microbial world but i'm 100% sure that obesity is a cash cow and will lower your life expectancy.

I just can't grasp why antiperspirant is needed at all?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 11, 2015, 06:10:44 AM
All I mean is 100% FACTS that smoking, alcohol, obesity will cause cancers. This is facts right?
Depends one what you mean.  Various factors increase the lifetime risk of specific cancers.

You still haven't mentioned what this has to do with the immune system attacking your own tissue.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 11, 2015, 06:16:37 AM
I question myself all of the time.
Not enough to have any discernible doubt about your beliefs.
Quote
I know for a FACT that obesity will reduce your life expectancy by as much as 30 years
What makes you think that?
Quote
I don't see where i'm wrong
How can you say that you question yourself but you can't see where you would be wrong.  This is enormous evidence that you don't question yourself.   If you did, you would know what would have to be true in order for you to be right...and by virtue of that you would know how you could be wrong.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 11, 2015, 06:31:56 AM
I just can't grasp
...and yet you claim to question yourself.
Quote
why antiperspirant is needed at all?
Seriously? it is entirely beyond your comprehension that some people would:

a) Highly value not smelling bad
b) Would consider it impossible or considerably inconvenient to shower more than once in the morning and once at night
c) Would produce sufficient lipids and have sufficient bacteria to consume them to end up smelling bad.

If you can't grasp those things then I wish you all the best as you enter the 4th grade.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 11, 2015, 06:52:52 AM
Quote
Depends one what you mean.  Various factors increase the lifetime risk of specific cancers.

OK tell me how ALL cancers are born?

Quote
You still haven't mentioned what this has to do with the immune system attacking your own tissue.

I already mentioned that there are two ways to get cancer A) genetic B) influenced. Obesity is “”influenced” way of getting cancers and lots of other disorders like DIABETES! For example.

The human immunity cannot defend against obesity if the human keeps on eating none-stop = obesity. And the stomach or other organ are at higher risk to get cancers than a skinny persons stomach! Plain and simple!

The immune system starts to attack it's own body when there is an unbalance in the body like obesity or alcoholism....  the immune system then start to attack it's own tissue and then there is an over growth of inflammation and tumors and our own cells attacking the body from these foreign obesity cells that should not be there in the first place.

In fact, I believe it's a way of “evolution”. There is a genetic code that teaches us to live longer and if we don't listen, out own body goes on self destruction! Cancers, tumors, STDs, you name it!


Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 11, 2015, 06:59:21 AM
Quote
What makes you think that?

this is very simple looking at both the civilized world and in the animalistic world.

In the civilized world we understand that obesity will cause diabetics and a lot of other ailments.

In the animalistic world, we can gather that a fat cheetah will not be able to run at it's full speed to be able to hunt and provide for it's young. So there it is, there are no obese cheetahs that will live their full expected life expectancy.

So we can conclude that being obese is both harmful in the civilized world and in the animalistic world and that 100% being obese is only a way to make money for the “big boys” a.k.a., fast generic food buying. Plain and simple!

Show me an obese animal in the wild that lives longer than it's counterparts?  8)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 11, 2015, 07:21:05 AM
OK tell me how ALL cancers are born?
It's a question without a useful answer because were pretty sure that cancers - neoplasms - happen for a variety of reasons.  Some have a viral precursor, some ionizing radiation, etc...
Quote
the immune system then start to attack it's own tissue and then there is an over growth of inflammation and tumors
Nope.  Inflammation comes from vascular tissue.  Neoplasms come from unregulated cell division.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 11, 2015, 07:25:35 AM
Quote
Seriously? it is entirely beyond your comprehension that some people would:

a) Highly value not smelling bad
b) Would consider it impossible or considerably inconvenient to shower more than once in the morning and once at night
c) Would produce sufficient lipids and have sufficient bacteria to consume them to end up smelling bad.

If you can't grasp those things then I wish you all the best as you enter the 4th grade.

Huh! Nobody likes to smell bad.

Huh! Well we all shower....I took a shower today and dlushed many stinky bacteria down the drain today....as I will tomorrow because vacteria reproduce very fast..lol

Huh! Well LIPIDS are cheese burgers to obesity bacteria lol you continue to mention “lipids” lets kills all lipids?

OK, what are LIPIDS since you seem to be talking about them all over the place?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 11, 2015, 07:28:25 AM
In the civilized world we understand that obesity will cause diabetics and a lot of other ailments.
No.  Obesity can be defined as having a BMI anywhere from 27 or more (depending on where you live).  Obesity is CORRELATED with various ailments.  That's not the same as CAUSING ailments.

For example there are olympic athletes who have a BMI > 27.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 11, 2015, 07:33:12 AM
OK, what are LIPIDS since you seem to be talking about them all over the place?
Fats.  For someone who claims to have spent an enormous amount of time challenging his own ideas.  You never seemed to bother to crack a book in the process.

Again you say it is utterly beyond your comprehension why someone would consider it necessary to use antiperspirant

Since you agree that there exist people who don't like to smell bad, people who have no opportunity to shower during the day.  Is what you are stuck on the idea that various people have different amounts of bacteria and different amounts of lipids (and other body odor precursors)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 11, 2015, 07:39:45 AM
Quote
It's a question without a useful answer because were pretty sure that cancers - neoplasms - happen for a variety of reasons.  Some have a viral precursor, some ionizing radiation, etc...

Are you escape goating? So you have zero CLUE where cancers come from?

Quote
Nope.  Inflammation comes from vascular tissue.  Neoplasms come from unregulated cell division.

What is “vascular tissue”?

What is “Neoplasms”?

What are “regulated” cells?

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 11, 2015, 07:52:25 AM
Quote
No.  Obesity can be defined as having a BMI anywhere from 27 or more (depending on where you live).  Obesity is CORRELATED with various ailments.  That's not the same as CAUSING ailments.

For example there are olympic athletes who have a BMI > 27.

Contradiction much?

What are you talking about this BMI > 27 and stuff?
A fat obese person is fat just by looking at one! Like over 50% of the USA population!
What do you mean?

Oh, let me ask, How much do you weigh in USA lbs? lol (please say the truth)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 11, 2015, 07:50:39 PM
So you have zero CLUE where cancers come from?
Depends on what you mean.  Some cancers we don't have a very good idea where they come from.  Some we do.  H
Quote
What is “vascular tissue”?
Tissue made up of several different cell types that allows for the transportation of blood.
Quote
What is “Neoplasms”?
New tissue growth - particularly in the form of a tumor but some cancers don't grow that way. 
Quote
What are “regulated” cells?
Cells where most of their time is spent resting that is, not engaged in cell division.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 11, 2015, 07:54:41 PM
What are you talking about this BMI > 27 and stuff?
That is the clinical definition of obesity.  If you have another definition you need to supply it.  More evidence that you have spend very little time questioning yourself.
Quote
A fat obese person is fat just by looking at one! Like over 50% of the USA population!
The reason researchers say that X% of a population is obese is because their BMI is > some agreed upon number.  They don't just "look" at people. :)
Quote
Oh, let me ask, How much do you weigh in USA lbs? lol (please say the truth)
185
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 11, 2015, 09:51:19 PM
How come Crap-Z-ro gave up posting over here?

Maybe he is but, I have him on ignore so........

What a great feature.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 11, 2015, 10:57:46 PM
Should we take a census to determine how many members the arse kisser has fooled into thinking that he really has me on "ignore" ?

I highly doubt that a gossipbag old woman like him wood be able to stand the suspense.

I've often wondered whether he goes around with a dildo up his back passage, or can only afford a butt plug...maybe we should take a 'pole' on that too ?

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 12, 2015, 01:49:54 AM
And if you wish to be ignored once you get in the "ring", just ask him to produce real evidence that vaccines are effective...never mind safe.
If you think you've been treated unfairly I'll give you another chance.  Please clearly state your argument and be prepared to clearly and directly respond to questions concerning it.

I currently have you on ignore.  I see that you post but I have to click on a link to see what you post. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 12, 2015, 02:18:31 AM
Quote from: Sark-Eizen
...
If your "solution" is more of a paste and contains a lot of NaHCO3 you will likely end up irritating the skin.   Why?  Same reason that it becomes biotoxic.  It raised the pH.See this is a perfect example of how much you aren't really someone who thinks about what's true.  If you did, you would realize that such a statement would require knowledge of a representative sample of "old ways" and a representative sample of "new ways".  Which you likely don't (putting aside that the terms themselves are pretty poorly defined).

Your suppositions are the voice of inexperience.
The solution need not be strong and can be
applied with a moistened cotton ball.

The Baking Soda solution to the problem goes
back over 100 years.  Even today certain underarm
preparations still contain Sodium Bicarbonate in
addition to their other 'Money' ingredients.

It is proven effective.  Of course it is so ridiculously
inexpensive and readily available that the 'Love of
Money' oriented corporate interests would rather
people used their costly products instead.

Knowledge is freedom from 'consumer' mentality.

For those who dare learn TRUTH.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 12, 2015, 02:47:15 AM
The solution need not be strong and can be applied with a moistened cotton ball.
So what mechanism do you imagine is at work here?  You are not plugging the pores and there's absolutely no way that a solution as incredibly weak as you're describing is having a anti-bacterial effect.  So what then?  Faries? Love? Magic?

You don't know do you?  You have absolutely nothing to offer in this respect. Which is the true voice of inexperience...and ignorance. :)
Quote
Even today certain underarm preparations still contain Sodium Bicarbonate
This is true but it's pretty interesting that you've got the "love of money" relation backward.  While it's possible that there is some clinical effect of sodium bicarbonate at the right dose.  It's far, far, far more likely that this is a company (for example Arm and Hammer) who is attempting to leverage peoples the gullibility of people...like yourself who believe in this folk remedy.  After all if it worked then that's all you would need in the product but if you look closely at A&H's Aluminum free "essentials" Natural deodorant - you'll see it contains triclosan.  An antibacterial agent.  If I was really looking to make money I'd leave that out.  The reason it's there is likely because it doesn't work very well without it. :)

Quote
It is proven effective.
Then please provide a reference to a double-blind placebo-controlled study with an n>200 and I'll be convinced.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 12, 2015, 02:53:59 AM
You can also rub dog crap under your arms to eliminate under arm odor.  This is proven to work, by thousands, possibly millions.  The list of studies that proves this are many in number and too long for me to mention, or link to any here.

Now, they are working on a "cure" for dog crap odor.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 12, 2015, 03:10:20 AM
If you think you've been treated unfairly I'll give you another chance.  Please clearly state your argument and be prepared to clearly and directly respond to questions concerning it.

I currently have you on ignore.  I see that you post but I have to click on a link to see what you post. :)


I've always been a good dot connector...looks like my talents are needed again(wink wink nudge nudge).

His words:  "clearly state your argument"

Let me see if I can at least lead this horsey to water.

Now, if i just try reversing the order of his last post, maybe he'll see it.

Cap's quoted words:

Quote from: Cap-Z-ro on January 11, 2015, 12:38:36 AM (http://overunity.com/15147/vaccinations-recent-developments/msg432194/#msg432194)                                                                                                                                                                                                          " And if you wish to be ignored once you get in the "ring", just ask him to produce real evidence that vaccines are effective...never mind safe. "


Dots connected...fingers crossed.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 12, 2015, 03:43:30 AM
ask him to produce real evidence that vaccines are effective...never mind safe.
Yawn.  Is your argument that there is no evidence that vaccines are effective or safe?

See the point of you actually stating your argument is then I don't have to constantly ask "Do you mean this?"
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: ramset on January 12, 2015, 03:52:19 AM
Yeesh
Sarc you "solicit" agita now??


do you sleep on a bed of nails too...........



Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 12, 2015, 03:55:37 AM
Sarc you "solicit" agita now??
I think you need to go to remedial quotation school.

If Cap-Mo-ron has a valid point I'm willing to hear him out.  He probably doesn't but hey neither do most of the people here. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 12, 2015, 03:57:20 AM
I think you need to go to remedial quotation school.

If Cap-Mo-ron has a valid point I'm willing to hear him out.  He probably doesn't but hey neither do most of the people here. :)




Hey, I resemble that remark.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 12, 2015, 05:15:10 AM
I think you need to go to remedial quotation school.

If Cap-Mo-ron has a valid point I'm willing to hear him out.  He probably doesn't but hey neither do most of the people here. :)

Well, a reader pointed out that in the previous post, he sniffed at the challenge but didn't lift his leg...while in this post its clear he sees the hook in the bait.

Again, he moves on...and his royal arse kisser helps by creating a diversion.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: ramset on January 12, 2015, 10:05:50 AM
_""Sarc_""


To" What" do you "attribute" the "Epidemic" and "increasing" Levels of "Autism" in the "population" """?"""











Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 12, 2015, 10:15:57 AM
Quote
Depends on what you mean.  Some cancers we don't have a very good idea where they come from.  Some we do.  H

OK describe the ones that you know where they come from?

Quote
Tissue made up of several different cell types that allows for the transportation of blood.

What do you mean by this? Explain please!

Quote
New tissue growth - particularly in the form of a tumor but some cancers don't grow that way. 

Again, please describe the cancers that are you familiar with!

Quote
Cells where most of their time is spent resting that is, not engaged in cell division.

Regulated by what? What cells are doing this you speak off?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 12, 2015, 10:30:59 AM
Quote
That is the clinical definition of obesity.  If you have another definition you need to supply it.  More evidence that you have spend very little time questioning yourself.

Well I find it hard to believe that the mere EYESIGHT does not play a role!!! since we learn from looking and learning. So if I see a round body, I'm 100% that person has been doing more eating than another.

Quote
The reason researchers say that X% of a population is obese is because their BMI is > some agreed upon number.  They don't just "look" at people.

Well that's a problem. So you are here telling me that I cannot distiguish between a fat person VS a skinny person with my eye sight? I don't even know what your are trying to imply! As if there is not way to see a fat person with the eye sight and only with your BMI numbers?

Whatever you have to say no matter what! It is 100% true that the USA has more fat people than skinny ones! 100% facts! And this is because fat people spend more money than skinny people! The same reason it is better to keep all stupid because if they are smart, they would not spend as much money!

I would like you to consider what is GREED!

I would like you to consider that 50% of all animals have gone extinct since the year 2000 and those numbers are continuing to decline as we speak!

Now with all of this happening, where do you see the world in 50 more years?

If supposedly your SMART INTELLIGENT brain is for the “greater” good! Why all of this murdering of the “evolution”?

So no matter what you believe you know or what you believe you have figured out, the facts are that this world is dying! We are headed in a new wold wide extinction!

So much cell understanding you preach to know but the end results is all pollution of the world and the body!

It seems like you cannot see the whole picture and only living in your bubble only looking for a cookie to be had.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 12, 2015, 10:44:13 AM
Quote
You can also rub dog crap under your arms to eliminate under arm odor.  This is proven to work, by thousands, possibly millions.  The list of studies that proves this are many in number and too long for me to mention, or link to any here.

Now, they are working on a "cure" for dog crap odor.

Sir, I am younger than you are and I expected more maturity from you! Time and time again you fail to provide any ounce of significant knowledge.

I as a young person could easily poke fun on your old age. (old fart) but I don't do that because that is not the way of life! And I hear you poking fun of others talking about dog crap in the arm pits? Well, looks like you don't seek truth and only here to bully people!

I wish not to be like you when I'm your age sir!
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 12, 2015, 01:09:14 PM
OK describe the ones that you know where they come from?
No but for example ionizing radiation can knock out a gene (such as MDM2) which reduces the amount of a protein (such as p53) in cells which has at least three responses to DNA damage.  Any of which could stop the damaged DNA from reproducing.
Quote
What do you mean by this? Explain please!
You need to ask a more specific question.  Do you not understand the terms "tissue", "blood" or how blood is transported through tissue. :)
Quote
Again, please describe the cancers that are you familiar with!
No but since the actual statement was about cancers that don't produce tumors. Leukemia is one, it produces an over-abundance of abnormal white blood cells. 
Quote
Regulated by what? What cells are doing this you speak off?
Cancer is a broad term for diseases where cells divide more than usual.  Do you disagree?  If not, then what do you think tumors are?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 12, 2015, 01:18:33 PM
Well I find it hard to believe that the mere EYESIGHT does not play a role!!!
What you believe is so very unimportant it scarcely matters.  Studies are generally blinded in one way or another.  So the person doing the analysis doesn't get to see anyone. 
Quote
Well that's a problem. So you are here telling me that I cannot distiguish between a fat person VS a skinny person with my eye sight? I don't even know what your are trying to imply!
That your eyesight is sadly not the basis for correlating any diseases in any useful way.   So when you say "obesity causes x" you are very likely just referencing something which used a BMI calculating to establish that correlation.  So that was why I assume you were using BMI to talk about obesity and it's correlation to disease.  However if you have some other made-up definition then please share it. :)

Quote
It is 100% true
But you spend so much time doubting yourself...right?

Quote
100% facts!
Yes i can see you must really examine yourself critically.

Quote
that this world is dying!
See normally I'd say something like "Sure, the 2nd law of thermodynamics says that" but since I'm currently speaking to a resident of crazy-town...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 12, 2015, 01:22:40 PM
Well, a reader pointed out that in the previous post, he sniffed at the challenge but didn't lift his leg...while in this post its clear he sees the hook in the bait.
I've asked you plainly what your argument is.  You made a cryptic response.  I simply asked a clarifying question and you can't give me a clear answer.

Again, you claim that you've "entered the ring" but you won't even produce a clear statement of your argument.  Again, the invitation is open.  Whenever you feel like sitting and the grownup table.  Just let me know.  I will from time to time read your posts even though you're on ignore. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 12, 2015, 01:41:25 PM
To" What" do you "attribute" the "Epidemic" and "increasing" Levels of "Autism" in the "population" """?"""
Do you perhaps mean:
Quote from: someone who knows English better than ramset
To what do you attribute the increasing number of reported cases of autism in the population?
My answer to that would simply be a top two reasons for this observation.  Primarily it would be diagnostic criteria changes.  This seems to be pretty obvious - that when you broaden who gets called autistic you will end up with more people with that label.  There was a study just this month showing this using Danish data.

There is already an established link between maternal (and more recently paternal) age and autism.  Parental age has been on the rise for a while now.

Does that explain all new cases?  Probably not but what it leaves us with is much too low to blame on things like vaccines. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 12, 2015, 03:39:43 PM
You don't have to be psychic to predict that he will not be supplying the non existent evidence that vaccines are effective.

Instead, he much prefers demanding evidence that they are not effective.

He quacks exactly like a paid shill...because he just is.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 12, 2015, 08:17:32 PM
You don't have to be psychic to predict that he will not be supplying the non existent evidence that vaccines are effective.
Is that your argument?  That there is absolutely no evidence for the effectiveness of vaccines?  Again, simple and clear answers gets you in the ring.  I'm sure it's pretty obvious to most people how hard you are trying to stay out. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 12, 2015, 08:31:04 PM
Is that your argument?  That there is absolutely no evidence for the effectiveness of vaccines? 


A reader opined: Surely, if he truly missed the queries, he could be led directly to the oft posed question...again, by simply consulting his royal arse kisser...who has shown an obsession for correcting grammatical mistakes and typo's.

I agree.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 12, 2015, 08:38:39 PM
The ongoing saga of 'vaccinations' and their side
effects (consequences) either un-intended or
otherwise. (http://www.naturalnews.com/048265_chickenpox_mandatory_vaccinations_South_Korea.html)

In this day and age of 'science miracles' as never
before, it is strange indeed that vaccinations have
not been made safe.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 12, 2015, 08:56:36 PM
The Agricultural Chemical Industry and the
practices it advocates has not been good for
the health of people World-wide. (http://www.healthfreedoms.org/top-doctor-exposes-monsanto-as-the-cause-of-a-huge-autism-spike/)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 12, 2015, 09:05:12 PM
In this day and age of 'science miracles' as never before, it is strange indeed that vaccinations have not been made safe.
For any useful definition of the word "safe" they have.

The ring is still there.  Anytime you want to subject your opinions to actual critical thought feel free to step in.  If you want to keep padding your pre-existing notions.  Then by all means, just keep posting links then running away. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 12, 2015, 09:09:30 PM
if he truly missed the queries
Last chance.   Please confirm my assessment of your argument or restate it in a clear and unambiguous way.

Refuse and you lose your argument about getting ignored once you enter the ring.  Since you now have thrice refused to enter. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 12, 2015, 09:23:08 PM
Quote from: Sark-Eizen
For any useful definition of the word "safe" they have.
...

As in 'completely safe for all,' or

100% safe in every respect, or

vaccinations which are incapable of causing
any adverse effect.

In a Sane World 'safe' in the fullest sense would
be attainable.

In our present Crazy World of agenda driven
'Love of Money' manipulations it seems to be
undesirable.

Population Reduction 101
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 12, 2015, 10:09:14 PM
vaccinations which are incapable of causing any adverse effect.
Every natural remedy you've advertised here is capable of causing an adverse effect. :)
Every action you perform from driving a car (if you're old enough) to flipping a light switch is capable of causing an adverse effect. :)

or are light switches and baking soda also part of your delusion of population reduction. :)

So again, it's really very simple.  You need a useful (I even used that word before) definition of safe.  Not a...for lack of a better term...moronic one.  Keep being stupid - it is very entertaining. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 12, 2015, 11:31:02 PM
Last chance.   Please confirm my assessment of your argument or restate it in a clear and unambiguous way.

Refuse and you lose your argument about getting ignored once you enter the ring.  Since you now have thrice refused to enter. :)

We need the royal arse kisser...this cabal horse refuses to drink.

Oh, faithful butt pirate, where art thou ?

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 13, 2015, 02:19:33 AM


I wish not to be like you when I'm your age sir!



I am afraid that you couldn't even if you tried.  It would take years of studying engineering, machining, (Master Machinist) Flying, Music and the arts for you to ever be able to catch up.  You should have started learning when you were younger.

A mind is a terrible thing to waste.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 13, 2015, 03:06:52 AM
Quote from: Sark-Eizen
Every natural remedy you've advertised here is capable of causing an adverse effect. :)
Every action you perform from driving a car (if you're old enough) to flipping a light switch is capable of causing an adverse effect. :)
...

Any 'remedy' if improperly utilized or
negligently enacted may cause an adverse
consequence.

Adverse Effect = Negligence of Some Sort

Odd that you should agree, isn't it?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 13, 2015, 03:16:28 AM
Any 'remedy' if improperly utilized or
negligently enacted may cause an adverse
consequence.

Adverse Effect = Negligence of Some Sort
SeaMonkey post = Poor logic of some sort.

What you are doing is making a directional fallacy (I will of course define this if you are interested in learning but we all kind of know that you're not.  So I won't hold my breath. :) ) Pity they don't teach logic where you live especially since you're so very interested in truth. :)

Just keep on being a moron SM.  It makes me happy. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 13, 2015, 03:49:09 AM

Just keep on being a moron SM.  It makes me happy. :)

Who/what else but a troll would make such a statement.

Case proven

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 13, 2015, 04:27:23 AM
Quote
No but for example ionizing radiation can knock out a gene (such as MDM2) which reduces the amount of a protein (such as p53) in cells which has at least three responses to DNA damage.  Any of which could stop the damaged DNA from reproducing.

I asked you to describe how some cancers are made and you give me this? At any rate, if I gather what you are trying to imply, you seem to be talking about a cure I guess.

But the main question was describe the PROBABILITIES of what causes cancers since we are always talking about probabilities.

Quote
You need to ask a more specific question.  Do you not understand the terms "tissue", "blood" or how blood is transported through tissue.

I know tissue, I know blood, I know veins in the body like veins in a tree leaf! But I do not know further in the realm of this. I'm sure if I took my time I would learn it.

There are two things happening here! You are trying to “understand” the cure while I UNDERSTAND the cause. Two things are happening here. I don't need a PHD to understand the CAUSE! When it comes to INFLUENTIAL, only in the GENTIC being born with is where it is needed!

So when I ask you what you mean “Tissue made up of several different cell types that allows for the transportation of blood.” is just a way of me trying to get to the meat of the bone!

First you need to explain how cancers work! Like I would a dishwasher if I want to repair it!

The you have to understand what is the purpose of cancer. Like I would understand the purpose of a dishwasher!

The you have to understand other things e.g. like how the immune system works or how vaccines work.

You need to give a greater explanation of your answers if you believe you know how cancers work!
I don't know how to “repair” cancer, I just know the PROBABILITIES of how it can be caused.

Quote
No but since the actual statement was about cancers that don't produce tumors. Leukemia is one, it produces an over-abundance of abnormal white blood cells. 

 Yes bone cancers, lung, white blood, red blood, all cancers are an imbalance of the body! I'm asking you me as a non-PHD having understanding how cancers and tumors are PROBABILITIES of human actions and you are supposedly the PHD having that understand how to cure them?

I only asked you to describe the cancers that you are familiar with, nothing else nothing more. And once you describe them, show why you are close to the cure and why you have not found the cure?

Quote
Cancer is a broad term for diseases where cells divide more than usual.  Do you disagree?  If not, then what do you think tumors are?

I already mentioned that tumors are an imbalance growth of cells and is similar to cancer. If you have a guy careing a weight over 100 lbs over his shoulders for years, the tissue becomes damage and this over-repairing of the dead tissue causes a lump.  You can even see how the martial art people use this  to get their fist callous to thicken the skin as to give a greater punch!

That simplistic understanding carries over to cancerous cells = obesity, alcoholism, viruses, pimples, bruises! And I only know this by looking at the history of human body alone. If I want to dig deeper and get a PHD on understanding cancers, then i'm just going there to find a cure. Which i'm guessing you are trying to do that but i'm sure you have no magic pill to cure it since you cannot of you are trying to repair the EFFECT while ignoring the CAUSE!
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 13, 2015, 04:47:42 AM
Quote
I am afraid that you couldn't even if you tried.  It would take years of studying engineering, machining, (Master Machinist) Flying, Music and the arts for you to ever be able to catch up.  You should have started learning when you were younger.

Well then we would never have “evolution” or when the student surpasses the teacher. :P

I understand your pride, but your learning will never be STATIC since space time is always ticking! Lol

Is not like you did not learn from others? = “evolution” = CAUSE = AFFECT.

I will never stop learning in my living life and i'm 100% sure you are still learning,,,lol
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 13, 2015, 04:48:41 AM
I asked you to describe how some cancers are made and you give me this? At any rate, if I gather what you are trying to imply, you seem to be talking about a cure I guess.

But the main question was describe the PROBABILITIES of what causes cancers since we are always talking about probabilities.

I know tissue, I know blood, I know veins in the body like veins in a tree leaf! But I do not know further in the realm of this. I'm sure if I took my time I would learn it.

There are two things happening here! You are trying to “understand” the cure while I UNDERSTAND the cause. Two things are happening here. I don't need a PHD to understand the CAUSE! When it comes to INFLUENTIAL, only in the GENTIC being born with is where it is needed!

So when I ask you what you mean “Tissue made up of several different cell types that allows for the transportation of blood.” is just a way of me trying to get to the meat of the bone!

First you need to explain how cancers work! Like I would a dishwasher if I want to repair it!

The you have to understand what is the purpose of cancer. Like I would understand the purpose of a dishwasher!

The you have to understand other things e.g. like how the immune system works or how vaccines work.

You need to give a greater explanation of your answers if you believe you know how cancers work!
I don't know how to “repair” cancer, I just know the PROBABILITIES of how it can be caused.

 Yes bone cancers, lung, white blood, red blood, all cancers are an imbalance of the body! I'm asking you me as a non-PHD having understanding how cancers and tumors are PROBABILITIES of human actions and you are supposedly the PHD having that understand how to cure them?

I only asked you to describe the cancers that you are familiar with, nothing else nothing more. And once you describe them, show why you are close to the cure and why you have not found the cure?

I already mentioned that tumors are an imbalance growth of cells and is similar to cancer. If you have a guy careing a weight over 100 lbs over his shoulders for years, the tissue becomes damage and this over-repairing of the dead tissue causes a lump.  You can even see how the martial art people use this  to get their fist callous to thicken the skin as to give a greater punch!

That simplistic understanding carries over to cancerous cells = obesity, alcoholism, viruses, pimples, bruises! And I only know this by looking at the history of human body alone. If I want to dig deeper and get a PHD on understanding cancers, then i'm just going there to find a cure. Which i'm guessing you are trying to do that but i'm sure you have no magic pill to cure it since you cannot of you are trying to repair the EFFECT while ignoring the CAUSE!

Life causes cancer than, using your "logic".  Have you ever heard of a dead person developing cancer?  No?  Well, there you have it.  You have to be alive to get it so, life must cause it.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 13, 2015, 05:12:58 AM
I asked you to describe how some cancers are made and you give me this?
It is, in fact how some cancers are made.
Quote
At any rate, if I gather what you are trying to imply, you seem to be talking about a cure I guess.
No, I'm talking about how some cancers are made. :)
Quote
But the main question was describe the PROBABILITIES of what causes cancers since we are always talking about probabilities.
No, you asked where they come from.  That's not the same as a "risk factor".  If that's what you mean.
Quote
I know tissue, I know blood,
Then why don't you understand how inflammation is a response from vascular tissue?
Quote
You are trying to “understand” the cure while I UNDERSTAND the cause.
No I'm talking about one potential cause of cancer.  You are just making sentences that mean virtually nothing. :)
Quote
First you need to explain how cancers work!
Such as genes which encode proteins which regulate cell division. :)
Quote
I just know the PROBABILITIES of how it can be caused.
Then what is the probability of the kind of cancer I described: where an MDM2 knockout causes a reduction in  p53 which affects the ability to correct DNA or initiate apoptosis.

Whoops...guess you don't know the probability of that. :)
Quote
Yes bone cancers, lung, white blood, red blood, all cancers are an imbalance of the body!
The problem with your sentence here is it doesn't say anything useful.  Is a reduction p53 a "imbalance"?  In some entirely uninformative way sure.  However it's only because I know three of the functions of p53 that I can say that.
Quote
I'm asking you me as a non-PHD having understanding how cancers and tumors are PROBABILITIES of human actions
You are barely speaking English at a elementary school level.   If I take a wild guess, I would assume you're talking about risk factors.  So in the case of a MDM2 knockout - the risk factor is exposure to ionizing radiation. 
Quote
I only asked you to describe the cancers that you are familiar with
...and I described the mechanism for one type of cancer I'm familiar with.  That's it.  You are just so incredibly ignorant you didn't understand that.
Quote
show why you are close to the cure and why you have not found the cure?
I have not found a cure for cancer, I have never even come close because that is not my job.
Quote
I already mentioned that tumors are an imbalance growth of cells and is similar to cancer.
Are you saying that tumors are NOT cancer?  That something is called a cancer because cells are dividing without the usual limits on them?  Is that what you're saying?

Quote
You can even see how the martial art people use this  to get their fist callous to thicken the skin as to give a greater punch!
When you injure tissue you can end up with scaring.  Scaring is again not the same as a tumor.  Scar tissue looks different under a microscope than a cancer cell and cancer cells tend to look different under a microscope than normal tissue.  For example the Leukemia blasts are smaller than normal white blood cells.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 13, 2015, 05:42:45 AM
Quote
Life causes cancer than, using your "logic".  Have you ever heard of a dead person developing cancer?  No?  Well, there you have it.  You have to be alive to get it so, life must cause it.

Hmmm, I work out, I gain muscle mass. I eat more than expected, I gain weight. I stick my dirty thumb in fire, I get burn. I'm obese, 100% sure I will get a cancer if I was not genetically predisposed to one!

That little statement makes you believe that you know what you are talking about....you are just on attack mode bro! Where your senses are full of adrenaline and fail your logic.
First the dishwasher, then, you believing that I can't never learn what you know, then this = EGO! Egotistic while I'm just trying to find truth! You are responding to replies I was not even replying to you bro! That's not good forum etiquette...lol
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 13, 2015, 06:06:49 AM


That's not good forum etiquette...lol

How the hell would you know?

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 13, 2015, 06:29:19 AM
Quote
It is, in fact how some cancers are made.

Well speak in 5 year old language since I'm 6 years old. I told you that obesity it is how cancers are made too! (which I'm right)

I was more towards you explaining point by point how only ONE cancer is created SCIENTIFICALLY!

I don't understand these numbers you speak off! If I was in your same class, I would, but I never was!

Quote
No, I'm talking about how some cancers are made.

Ok, can you explain again HOW some cancers are made from obese people? Or are you talking about how some are predisposed to get cancer regarding the genetic code?

You are not explaining much!

Quote
No, you asked where they come from.  That's not the same as a "risk factor".  If that's what you mean.

No, lol you seem to always start your sentences with NO towards me. As if you already predicted your future. At any rate, where they come from is not the same as “risk factors”?

I already told you there are only two places where they come from 1) genetic, e.g. being borne with it = predisposed! 2) influenced = obesity, alcoholism, caring 100lbs of weight on your back!

Is not being an obese person a “risk factor” for cancer?

Quote
Then why don't you understand how inflammation is a response from vascular tissue?

I already mentioned that I understand INFLAMATION as the mere example of a guy carying a 100 lb weight on it's back would get an inflamated back = out of balance.

If you mean “vascular tissues” may lead to cancerous cells, then I agree with you. Maybe there is a language barrier here!

Quote
No I'm talking about one potential cause of cancer.  You are just making sentences that mean virtually nothing.

NO! lol, you always seem to respond with NO! Life is all about CAUSE and EFFECT! Learning is CAUSE and EFFECT! Learning is CAUSE and EFFECT! Cancer is CAUSE and AFFECT!

One potential CAUSE of cancer always comes from the “potential” of EFFECT! = Cause AND effect! The CAUSE in the cancer comes from the EFFECT!

Quote
Such as genes which encode proteins which regulate cell division.

Well a human body is a regulated cell division animal! The body is also GEOMETRICAL two arms, two legs, two eyes. The DNA has already been encoded to make a human animal since the sperm! You are being to BROAD if you proclaim to know a lot about this subject!

You are now claming to know the “encode” process and “what regulates” cell division?

Quote
Then what is the probability of the kind of cancer I described: where an MDM2 knockout causes a reduction in  p53 which affects the ability to correct DNA or initiate apoptosis.

Whoops...guess you don't know the probability of that.

Well geeee, let me guess what that maybe, ONLY looking at it from one angle!

Well here you are knowing what all cells in the body are?

You keep mentioning these MDM2 and p53...what do you mean by that? Besides me knowing that you have no cure and maybe just one understanding of one cancerous cell?


Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 13, 2015, 06:32:05 AM
While on the subject of Trolls the terms used by
the Chinese (and Taiwanese) to define (describe)
them are brilliantly fascinating:

Quote from: Wiki excerpt 'other languages'
In Chinese (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_language), trolling is referred to as bái mù (Chinese (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_language): 白目 (http://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E7%99%BD%E7%9B%AE); literally: "white eye"), which can be straightforwardly explained as "eyes without pupils", in the sense that whilst the pupil (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pupil) of the eye is used for vision, the white section of the eye cannot see, and trolling involves blindly talking nonsense over the internet, having total disregard to sensitivities or being oblivious to the situation at hand, akin to having eyes without pupils.

 An alternative term is bái làn (Chinese (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_language): 白爛; literally: "white rot"), which describes a post completely nonsensical and full of folly made to upset others, and derives from a Taiwanese slang term for the male genitalia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_male_genitalia), where genitalia that is pale white in colour represents that someone is young, and thus foolish.

 Both terms originate from Taiwan (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taiwan), and are also used in Hong Kong (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hong_Kong) and mainland China (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mainland_China). Another term, xiǎo bái (Chinese (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_language): 小白; literally: "little white") is a derogatory term that refers to both bái mù and bái làn that is used on anonymous posting internet forums.

 Another common term for a troll used in mainland China is pēn zi (Chinese (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_language): 噴子; literally: "sprayer, spurter").


The 'boldings' above seem most applicable to certain
Troll Personalities who are present within this discussion. ;)

Quote from: Wiki article Psychological Characteristics
Two studies published in 2013 and 2014 have found that people who are identified as trolls tend to have dark personality traits (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_triad) and show signs of sadism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sadistic_personality_disorder), antisocial behavior (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisocial_behavior), psychopathy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychopathy), and machiavellianism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Machiavellianism).[37][38] The 2013 study suggested that there are a number of similarities between anti-social and flame trolling activities[37] and the 2014 study suggested that the noxious personality characteristics known as the "dark triad (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_triad) of personality" should be investigated in the analysis of trolling, and concluded that trolling appears "to be an Internet manifestation of everyday sadism."[38]

Their relevance is suggested by research linking these traits to bullying (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bullying) in both adolescents and adults. The 2014 study found that trolls operate as agents of chaos on the Internet, exploiting hot-button issues (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Politicized_issue) to make users appear overly emotional (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emotional) or foolish (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foolishness) in some manner. If an unfortunate person falls into their trap, trolling intensifies for further, merciless amusement.

This is why novice Internet users are routinely admonished, "Do not feed the trolls!" The 2013 study found that trolls often have a high expectation of what it means to be successful, which is higher than they are able to attain, and this results in them resenting others who think they are successful but who fall below their standards.

Aye, that is about the size of it...

Source (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_%28Internet%29)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 13, 2015, 06:40:35 AM
Quote
How the hell would you know?

I'm sure 99% of the population knows you don't quote responses to others and responds for them! You only respond when you are being spoken too period. You never respond to others when they are talking to someone else. That is life/forum etiquette sir and I thought you knew this based on your 'maturity'.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 13, 2015, 06:54:10 AM
I'm sure 99% of the population knows you don't quote responses to others and responds for them! You only respond when you are being spoken too period. You never respond to others when they are talking to someone else. That is life/forum etiquette sir and I thought you knew this based on your 'maturity'.

Did you just make this up?  This must be in your head...right?

So, you make up a rule and then claim that 99% of everyone on forums knows this?

Total BS.

I have been on forums longer than you have been alive most likely.  Well over 30 years anyway.  100% of the folks I have interacted with never mentioned a rule like this.

Please try again, and this time, maybe be a little more realistic?

So, you come on to a forum and say something about a topic.

Another person responds to you.

You respond back and then you say something stupid (not really a stretch for you) like: "Gravity does not exist."

Under your rule, are you telling me that no other person on that forum can respond to your idiocy because you were not talking to them?

Horse feathers.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 13, 2015, 07:09:51 AM
I was responding to sarkeizen and you decided to respond to me while quoting my responses to sarkeizen! What more proof do you need that you abused forum etiquette?

Now you are trying to tell me that you have a right to respond to others when they are not even talking to you.

I can picture you having a conversation with someone in real person and then someone else cuts you off and speaks for you. Lol

But I guess you have been on the internet for so long that you already forgot what etiquette means?

I'm 100% sure you would not like it if someone else answers for you and this can be proven 100% so I don't really know what you are arguing about unless you have an over inflated head that you seem to believe that you are “untouchable”!

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 13, 2015, 01:09:16 PM
While on the subject of Trolls the terms used by the Chinese (and Taiwanese) to define (describe) them are brilliantly fascinating:
The real interesting part is how all the definitions focus on reaction.  What would be the opposite of just wanting people to react to a post? I'd suggest that discussing a post is the opposite of merely reacting, talking to a person instead of around them or addressing a hypothetical audience.

I wonder who that describes. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 13, 2015, 01:18:50 PM
I was responding to sarkeizen and you decided to respond to me while quoting my responses to sarkeizen! What more proof do you need that you abused forum etiquette?
Actually you will see most people doing that here.  If you open your eyes and look.  Not even counting trolls like SM, Cap-mo-ron who indirectly respond to someone. :)
Quote
I can picture you having a conversation with someone in real person and then someone else cuts you off and speaks for you.
"Forum" is latin for "public outdoor place".  In a public discussion it is entirely normal for someone you did not directly address to respond to you. If you want to respond to me privately then use a private message.
Quote
I'm 100%
...and you keep saying that you spend time criticizing your own opinions.  I'll give you a hint,  people who really think about things almost never say things like that. :)
Quote
his can be proven 100%
or this...
Quote
so I don't really know what you are arguing about unless you have an over inflated head that you seem to believe that you are “untouchable”!
I'm not sure if you are trolling or if you are simply too young to be talking here. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 13, 2015, 03:01:22 PM
trolls like SM, Cap-mo-ron  :)

Oh, the humanity...to be called a troll by a paid shill.

*is crest fallen*

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 13, 2015, 09:17:52 PM
Quote from: Cap-Z-ro
Oh, the humanity...to be called a troll by a paid shill.

*is crest fallen*

Regards...

'Tis naught more than classic diversion.  The
'perps' nearly always accuse their 'targets' of
being what they positively are. 8)

This too shall pass.

Their addiction for intercourse is extreme. :o
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 14, 2015, 12:56:05 AM
'Tis naught more than classic diversion.  The
'perps' nearly always accuse their 'targets' of
being what they positively are. 8)

This too shall pass.

Their addiction for intercourse is extreme. :o

The challenges are many multiples of three,

when you are paid by the stroke of key.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 14, 2015, 01:29:02 AM
what they positively are.
I have a theory about people who use words like '100%' or 'positively' in a context where you can't really be sure.  I tend to think that people like this are actually revealing their insecurity in their position and are compensating by "papering over" their doubts with extreme terms. 8)  What do you think?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 14, 2015, 03:50:18 AM
Quote from: Sark-Eizen
I have a theory about people who use words like '100%' or 'positively' in a context where you can't really be sure.  I tend to think that people like this are actually revealing their insecurity in their position and are compensating by "papering over" their doubts with extreme terms. 8)  What do you think?

If the shoe fits, wear it.

A tree is known by the fruit it bears.

Failure is a detour, not a dead-end street.

And:
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 14, 2015, 04:05:18 AM
I was responding to sarkeizen and you decided to respond to me while quoting my responses to sarkeizen! What more proof do you need that you abused forum etiquette?

Now you are trying to tell me that you have a right to respond to others when they are not even talking to you.

I can picture you having a conversation with someone in real person and then someone else cuts you off and speaks for you. Lol

But I guess you have been on the internet for so long that you already forgot what etiquette means?

I'm 100% sure you would not like it if someone else answers for you and this can be proven 100% so I don't really know what you are arguing about unless you have an over inflated head that you seem to believe that you are “untouchable”!

You are kidding...right?  I mean, you come on a public forum, and want to hold a private conversation...is that it?

There is a device called a p.m. (private message) built into this software that allows for that.

You claimed that 99% of all people on all forums agree with your new rule.  I would sure like to see the study that proves that correct.  Everyone on this forum, and all of the others I have been on for years, act like they are all together in a room speaking.  Have you never been to a cocktail party?

If you are at a cocktail party, and want to have a private conversation, you go outside, or into another room. (PM)

Surely you can not be this ignorant can you?

Also, what the hell does  "I can picture you having a conversation with someone in real person and then someone else cuts you off and speaks for you" mean?
I am not going to abide by this new rule that you just made up.  I doubt that anyone else here will do so either.

Try the p.m.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 14, 2015, 04:09:29 AM
If the shoe fits, wear it.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 14, 2015, 04:17:30 AM
I rather doubt anyone else went past the first letter of that piece of spam.

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 14, 2015, 05:53:49 AM
Ah, well... ;)

The things children will do to act out
their frustrations. ::)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 14, 2015, 05:58:09 AM
The things children will do to act out their frustrations.
I've heard that some nurse their wounds through vacuous dime-store affirmations.  Perhaps you have some insight there? :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 14, 2015, 11:13:00 AM
Quote
You are kidding...right?  I mean, you come on a public forum, and want to hold a private conversation...is that it?

OMG! Are you really that ill in the mind?

Quote
There is a device called a p.m. (private message) built into this software that allows for that.

What does that have to do with anything? I really find you corrupted in the brain!

Quote
You claimed that 99% of all people on all forums agree with your new rule.  I would sure like to see the study that proves that correct.  Everyone on this forum, and all of the others I have been on for years, act like they are all together in a room speaking.  Have you never been to a cocktail party?

OMG! Lol i'm talking to a mental person! Now I want to treat you special treatments. You have zero knowledge about anything what so ever! 30 year moderating has done a nice gone to your brain!

Quote
If you are at a cocktail party, and want to have a private conversation, you go outside, or into another room. (PM)

Ohhh OK! Lol, well i'm sure you will be there talking for the other person in the “private conversation”...you have no brain matter man!

Quote
Surely you can not be this ignorant can you?

hey JB weld BOY! Lol you are too cocky to speak knowledge!

Quote
Also, what the hell does  "I can picture you having a conversation with someone in real person and then someone else cuts you off and speaks for you" mean?
I am not going to abide by this new rule that you just made up.  I doubt that anyone else here will do so either.

Holly crap on a pedestal! You are so sick in the brain that you have no cure! Lol i'lll always remember as a JB weld boy! Nothing that comes out of your mouth is even SMART! The only solution for you is to give you a taste of your onw medicine dodo bird!

I seriously see this guy half brain dead! Lol
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 14, 2015, 11:26:31 AM
Sarkeizen is also the WANT_TO_BE_DOCTOR!

I asked him soo many times to explain the cancers he supposedly understand and HE does not know anything!

How many times do you ask a sane person to explain themselves when you just have to acknowledge them as mental? = delusional?

Pirate88179 is totally mental! I'll JB weld a fan on a motor and that means I understand how dishwashers work! Poor old guy! He believes that he understands dishwasher by JB welding a blade on a 3-phase motor and he did a good job since it has been 4 years and no complains...lol...i'm 100% sure he heard this racket from the motor and he visually saw the fan loose so he used JB weld and not think he understand how dishwashers work! Lol that is sad and funny at the same time.

Then he has been moderating for 30 years! And he will continue to till the creep keeper comes along! Lol. He is so ill in the brain that I hope he gets a brain transplant soon...ohhh, wait, old brains have less electronic exchange= IOW, less thinking power! That means a 30 yr old has a healthier brain than a 57 yr old, 100% facts! But his old brain will fight that he is the smartest oerson in the world with his machining skills and forum moderating skill and jb welding a fan on a motor skills, oh my! lol

He believe that no other person will surpass his brain power (it is not really that powerful) i sure there is nothing to be learned form this guy! lol

 ;D
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 14, 2015, 11:41:53 AM
Look at the smart response from pirate! It is so ignorant and stupid that what else do you respond to this leech?

http://i.imgur.com/kq5z7ph.png

Notice How i was not speaking to him! lol To be honest I believe his parents never taught him any manners/etiquette!

Now he is all over the place trying to say that what he does is NORMAL 99.9% of the rest of humans do this! lol...poor guy...someone needs to wake him a wake up call!
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 14, 2015, 12:06:08 PM
Well there you  have it from the most intelligent person in the world.

Quote
Have you ever heard of a dead person developing cancer?  No?  Well, there you have it.  You have to be alive to get it so, life must cause it.
Being alive causes cancers...lol  and JB welding a fan on a motor will make the machines live longer!

LOL, what do you answer to such ignorant statements...lol? I'm actually laughing when I read that!

He just went out of topic too!
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 14, 2015, 02:39:05 PM
Sarkeizen is also the WANT_TO_BE_DOCTOR!
Nope not interested in being a doctor. I'm happy with what I do. 8)
Quote
I asked him soo many times to explain the cancers he supposedly understand and HE does not know anything!
I did explain one cause of cancer.  You just appear not to have understood. :)  Nor can you seem to state clearly if you think that tumors are cancer.

You also seem to want to conflate cancer (unrestricted cell division), with inflammation (vascular response to disease or damage) and scar tissue (fibrous tissue with collagen in a particular direction).  All of these are clearly different when looked at under a microscope.

I'm starting to think you're a troll, not just an idiot. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 14, 2015, 02:57:13 PM
http://www.iflscience.com/health-and-medicine/dear-parents-you-are-being-lied-0

Kind of a list of blanket counters to many anti-vaccine positions.   Not exactly a counter to much of SM's postings as they are more like someone randomly smashing keys. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 14, 2015, 03:34:19 PM
Look at the smart response from pirate! It is so ignorant and stupid that what else do you respond to this leech?

http://i.imgur.com/kq5z7ph.png (http://i.imgur.com/kq5z7ph.png)

Notice How i was not speaking to him! lol To be honest I believe his parents never taught him any manners/etiquette!

Now he is all over the place trying to say that what he does is NORMAL 99.9% of the rest of humans do this! lol...poor guy...someone needs to wake him a wake up call!



Below, is the delusional arse kissing butt pirate in a tussle with EMJunkie, but thinking he's battling joel.

Too funny.

Lets just hope he doesn't get mixed up again, and start trying to JB Weld the arses he kisses.

Regards...


Quote from: Pirate88179 on Today at 07:55:42 AM (http://overunity.com/14974/magnet-myths-and-misconceptions/msg432848/#msg432848)<blockquote>Waitress, could we please get some coffee for Joel over here to go with his humble pie?

Thank you.

Bill


Quote from: Cap-Z-ro on Today at 03:01:45 PM (http://overunity.com/14974/magnet-myths-and-misconceptions/msg432891/#msg432891)The apex of hilarity...

Looks like the royal arse kisser got his perceived enemy's cornfused...he's now got joel and EMJ mixed up.

He must be getting punch drunk...rum punch probably.

Heaven forbid, that he starts trying to kiss my arse next, in his many states of inebriation.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MileHigh on January 14, 2015, 06:42:07 PM
Captain Zero,

It's time for your harassment of Bill to STOP.  Enough is enough and this has been going on for far too long.

I know that you bickered with each other.  But at this point you are clearly the instigator.

And you people reading this that agree with me, I challenge you to post your displeasure also.  Do you have the guts to do it?

This has to stop right now.

MileHigh
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 14, 2015, 06:59:35 PM
It's time for your harassment of Bill to STOP.  Enough is enough and this has been going on for far too long.
Good point.  Cap-Z-ro isn't engaging an issue, he isn't even strongly adverse to an idea.  He is just attacking people even when they are not engaging him.  Harassment is a good word for that.

I also don't see him contributing much of technical worth either.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 14, 2015, 08:11:53 PM
Good point.  Cap-Z-ro isn't engaging an issue, he isn't even strongly adverse to an idea.  He is just attacking people even when they are not engaging him.  Harassment is a good word for that.

I also don't see him contributing much of technical worth either.

In my defense, I never had a problem with the forums official arse kisser...he was arse kissing up a storm here, and it never bothered me one bit.

Then came the day when he just didn't like me kicking the ass of the forum's chief naysayer and nitpicker.

How was I to know the butt pirate was still attached to the naysayer's arse at the time ?

To me, it just appeared the naysayer had a big arse.

And to be chastised by 2 of the forum's least respected "members" is laughable.


And lets not forget it was the butt pirate who started attacking me, to increase his standing among the knowitall's, who arses he kisses.

But that wasn't good enough, he had it in his head that he had the upper hand(arrogance has that effect), and began following me from thread to thread, sniping at me.

When he realized I was making a fool out of him, he suddenly lost his enthusiasm, and pretended to put me on ignore.

Then he started picking fights with a number of other members, to the point he doesn't know which member he is addressing anymore.

In life, when you are in the habit of picking on people, its not always up to you when the fight will end.

Thats how we all live and learn, isn't it ?

Those who ignore life's lessons need a little humble pie to aid in digestion.

Regards...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 14, 2015, 09:45:35 PM
Oral Contraceptives linked to Cancer. (http://beforeitsnews.com/health/2015/01/medical-alert-oral-contraceptives-cause-cancer-2560562.html)

We're literally surrounded by disease causing
substances.

Pain Control Medications can be hazardous too. (http://www.naturalnews.com/048287_pain_relief_natural_cures_alternative_medicine.html)

There are alternatives;  Natural alternatives.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: orbut 3000 on January 14, 2015, 10:19:38 PM
Contraceptives (http://kill-or-cure.herokuapp.com/a-z/c#term136) both cause and prevent cancer.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on January 14, 2015, 10:21:35 PM
Captain Zero,

It's time for your harassment of Bill to STOP.  Enough is enough and this has been going on for far too long.

I know that you bickered with each other.  But at this point you are clearly the instigator.

And you people reading this that agree with me, I challenge you to post your displeasure also.  Do you have the guts to do it?

This has to stop right now.

MileHigh
Barring moderation Cap is going to behave as he chooses.  It is very unlikely that he will change his posting habits because they outrage anyone.  Outrage seems to be what he wants.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MileHigh on January 14, 2015, 10:39:06 PM
Well, perhaps some peer pressure will get him to stop.  People have a right to log onto a forum without being demeaned and attacked every day.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 14, 2015, 11:05:55 PM
Oral Contraceptives linked to Cancer. (http://beforeitsnews.com/health/2015/01/medical-alert-oral-contraceptives-cause-cancer-2560562.html)

We're literally surrounded by disease causing
substances.
Speaking just for myself here.  I'm not surrounded by birth-control pills.  So, out of curiosity.  Do you think that article provides a highly accurate depiction of the situation OR a inaccurate depiction.  Considering how interested you claim to be in the truth. I would like to know your views here! :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 14, 2015, 11:11:59 PM
Pain Control Medications can be hazardous too. (http://www.naturalnews.com/048287_pain_relief_natural_cures_alternative_medicine.html)

There are alternatives;  Natural alternatives.
LOL.  Easily the funniest thing I've read all day.  My favorite joke there was the bit about willow bark. :)  It's always awesome to read someone who knows absolutely zero about pharmacology tell you what you should take. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 14, 2015, 11:49:54 PM
Barring moderation Cap is going to behave as he chooses.  It is very unlikely that he will change his posting habits because they outrage anyone.  Outrage seems to be what he wants.

The forum's biggest knowitall hath spoken...again...and, out of his asshole as usual.


Well, perhaps some peer pressure will get him to stop.
 

To think this brain dead twit actually thinks I am affected by "peer pressure" ??


Quote
People have a right to log onto a forum without being demeaned and attacked every day.

And they certainly do...until they start they start hounding other members.

This arsehole likes to have people believe that it was I who initiated the attack...when in fact it was the forum's designated arse kisser to the trolls.

But, apparently his well known hypocritical arseholeness doesn't feel people have a right to log onto a forum without being hounded the likes of him every day.


I guess its only natural that the right and left cheek protect their common arshole.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MileHigh on January 15, 2015, 12:10:00 AM
Captain Zero:

You are just one big Barf-o-Rama.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9S7kg1IhZ7M
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 15, 2015, 01:01:54 AM
Captain Zero:

You are just one big Barf-o-Rama.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9S7kg1IhZ7M (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9S7kg1IhZ7M)

The only people who seem to be upset with me are arse kissers, trolls, and shills...that tell me I'm on the right track.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MileHigh on January 15, 2015, 02:11:12 AM
I'm not sensing a ground rush of support for your colourful metaphors.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: ramset on January 15, 2015, 02:20:23 AM
how could a truce be negotiated ?,[nothing to do with Bill Alek or his Hair]
A ceasefire??


Please??


even just to clear the wounded from the Battlefield....
its a humanitarian thing..


thx
Chet
Maybe just 24 Hrs to start...
?



Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 15, 2015, 02:37:18 AM
I'm not sensing a ground rush of support for your colourful metaphors.

What he really means is that nobody responded to his call for people to castigate me for abusing the forum's arrogant designated arse kisser...who went after me first lets not forget.

Regards...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 15, 2015, 02:43:29 AM
how could a truce be negotiated ?,[nothing to do with Bill Alek or his Hair]
A ceasefire??


Please??


even just to clear the wounded from the Battlefield....
its a humanitarian thing..

thx

Chet
Maybe just 24 Hrs to start...?


Chet, it certainly won't be before the butt pirate demonstrates that he has stopped attacking other members here.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MarkE on January 15, 2015, 02:43:37 AM
how could a truce be negotiated ?,[nothing to do with Bill Alek or his Hair]
A ceasefire??


Please??

even just to clear the wounded from the Battlefield....
its a humanitarian thing..


thx
Chet
Maybe just 24 Hrs to start...
?
What if there was a war and nobody came?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 15, 2015, 02:56:22 AM
What if there was a war and nobody came?

What if there was an overunity.com and he came?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: ramset on January 15, 2015, 03:00:59 AM
Cap
So that sounds like a "condition" [no new attacks]perhaps we can start there and move forward.


?


Like a time out...........


Thx
Chet
ps
I must say that overall the forum has been getting better at self control...
I know its not easy,but its really the way we need to go.


Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 15, 2015, 04:00:15 AM
Cap
So that sounds like a "condition" [no new attacks]perhaps we can start there and move forward.


?


Like a time out...........


Thx
Chet

Well, i had planned to drag it around a little longer...but since you asked so nicely I will hold up my end of the board.

Quote
ps
I must say that overall the forum has been getting better at self control...
I know its not easy,but its really the way we need to go.

Unfortunately, on an unmoderated board, due to disruptive influences running amok....and under those conditions, the only strategy that seems to work is old time hockey.

Nobody pushed the Red Wings around when Probert was on the ice.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: ramset on January 15, 2015, 04:06:27 AM
Thank you


I see you asked EMJunkie about his bucking coil Idea,I remember you did some experiments in years past.
are you considering a build??


thx
Chet
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 15, 2015, 04:28:46 AM
Actually, just lately, I've started stealing a little Dave45, a little Ken W, now a little EMJ, and  mixing a little of mine...plus whatever else I may have absorbed from the other sage contributors here.

I'm still haunted by not paying attention to a small motor greatly increasing its rpm's off of a 9v battery because I was focusing on something else.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 15, 2015, 04:42:12 AM
Like a time out...........
I guess if there's one person who needs one it's Cap-Z-ro. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 15, 2015, 04:46:26 AM
I guess if there's one person who needs one it's Cap-Z-ro. :)

Freudian translation...or shill back masking:

The forum needs a time from the CDC shill...a long one.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 15, 2015, 04:50:22 AM
I guess if there's one person who needs one it's Cap-Z-ro. :)

He doesn't bother me, he is on ignore so I do not have to be bored by his infantile rantings.  He never did offer anything constructive here on this site so, he is not missed.  He does not build, or experiment, or learn for that matter so...no big loss to anyone that ignores his gibberish and rants.

He will get bored and then go try to insult folks on another forum somewhere.

Ignore is a wonderful feature.  My guess is that Crap-Z-ro holds the record for being ignored by the most people.  He deserves it, ha ha.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: ramset on January 15, 2015, 05:06:32 AM
well maybe you should take him off ignore for a moment
he has agreed to a ceasefire based on cooperation from yourself [and others]


so perhaps we try that for a while?


Please...?


thx
Chet
I have seen these ceasefires last for quite sometime .
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 15, 2015, 05:17:39 AM
well maybe you should take him off ignore for a moment
he has agreed to a ceasefire based on cooperation from yourself [and others]


so perhaps we try that for a while?


Please...?


thx
Chet
I have seen these ceasefires last for quite sometime .

Chet:

I know that you are a nice guy with your heart in the right place.  I prefer the ignore feature as it saves me from reading his infantile rants.  He is just begging to be moderated and, this way, I will have nothing to do with it when that happens, and, I can enjoy my time on this forum and continue to learn.

Put it this way, ignoring is much easier.

Thanks,

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 15, 2015, 05:21:10 AM
well maybe you should take him off ignore for a moment he has agreed to a ceasefire based on cooperation from yourself
Here's my counter offer.  Cap-Z-ro has to make an argument about vaccines causing significant harm (or clearly and unambiguously admit they are largely harmless), support it and answer any and all questions on it.   If he can not provide compelling evidence for his position.   He will clearly and unambiguously admit he has little reason for his belief.

I bring this up because the reason I'm ignoring Cap-Z-ro is not because he's abusive but simply that his posts are vapid. :)  I think the more skeptical folk would agree that if Cap was capable of actually doing something other than just insult.  He probably wouldn't be on ignore.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 15, 2015, 05:38:35 AM
He doesn't bother me, he is on ignore so I do not have to be bored by his infantile rantings.  He never did offer anything constructive here on this site so, he is not missed.  He does not build, or experiment, or learn for that matter so...no big loss to anyone that ignores his gibberish and rants.

He will get bored and then go try to insult folks on another forum somewhere.

Ignore is a wonderful feature.  My guess is that Crap-Z-ro holds the record for being ignored by the most people.  He deserves it, ha ha.

Bill

Quote
Chet:

I know that you are a nice guy with your heart in the right place.  I prefer the ignore feature as it saves me from reading his infantile rants.  He is just begging to be moderated and, this way, I will have nothing to do with it when that happens, and, I can enjoy my time on this forum and continue to learn.

Put it this way, ignoring is much easier.

Thanks,

Bill


So, there you have it ladies gentlemen and Chet.

Draw your own conclusions...

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 15, 2015, 05:52:20 AM
Here's my counter offer.  Cap-Z-ro has to make an argument about vaccines causing significant harm (or clearly and unambiguously admit they are largely harmless), support it and answer any and all questions on it.   If he can not provide compelling evidence for his position.   He will clearly and unambiguously admit he has little reason for his belief.

I bring this up because the reason I'm ignoring Cap-Z-ro is not because he's abusive but simply that his posts are vapid. :)  I think the more skeptical folk would agree that if Cap was capable of actually doing something other than just insult.  He probably wouldn't be on ignore.

Ever notice that whenever you place the onus where it belongs they always fall back into the pro wrestler routine...where what when...I didn't see a thing - round 10 !

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 15, 2015, 01:13:10 PM
I seriously see milehigh and sarkeizen being more “intelligent” than pirate88179. I really tried hard to understand his “knowledge” but at this point milehigh and sarkeizen have more brain matter than he does! I honestly only see him as a spoiled little brat!

Nothing to be learned from him! JB weld A metal fan on a motor, being a forum moderator for 30 yrs, saying things that no one will ever learn what he has learned! I think it is time some gives him a cold REALITY check that he is not that SMART!

He is done and over with! He is the perfect example why the saying “you can't never teach old dog new tricks!”

He has been on forums over 30 years (I have probably one year), he has been a machinist over 30 years probably too, and now he is toooo cocky to tell him that he will eventually get phased out and that his ONLY goal in life is to make his kids smarter than his brain! But for some reason I”M GUESSING he still believes that his kids are stupider than he is! = cult leader at it's best!

Milehigh, do you really hang out with this guy in real life?

Sarkeizen, do you really hang out with this guy in real life?

Who wants to hang out with pirate88179 in real life?

NOt me for sure!

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 15, 2015, 01:31:39 PM
Based on what I have seen, milehigh is wayyyy smarter than pirate88179.

Based from what I have seen sarkeizen is wayyyy smarter than pirate88179.

Based from what I have seen MarkE is wayyyyy smarter than pirate88179.

Pirate88179 has 6 thousand eight hundred and one post here?

The I come along and ask him questions and I don't even see him as that smart and it could easilly be proven in real life scenarios. Then i'm wondering, how in the world is he here with 6801 posts in the first place? One would expect, the greater the posts, the greater the "knowledge"!!!

And then he gives me this “i JB welded  3-phase fan motor” so he believes he understands how dishwashers works!

Tehn I tell him that he should NOT speak for others and then he says “i have been a moderator for 30 yrs and you are the only one whom has brought that up”....and then I ask myself “wow, this guy has been a moderator for 30 yrs and I'm here bringing this up”? Then I ask myself, “how long how this guy been ignorant”? Lol...poor guy! He has more EGO than KNOWLEDGE!

Milehigh, sarkeizen, and MarkE, stop the ignorance already!
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 15, 2015, 03:16:53 PM
He is either too dense, shallow, or his ego will not allow him to see it, but he has assumed the role of dupe, or useful idiot to the shills here.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 15, 2015, 03:42:46 PM
Ever notice that whenever you place the onus where it belongs
The burden of proof you mean?  Ok, no problem.  All you have to do is clearly and unambiguously state your position and clearly and unambiguously answer any questions about your position and if it can be shown that you are wrong in some respect you will clearly and unambiguously state that. :)

See no burden of proof....and now you will dodge this too. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 15, 2015, 03:46:20 PM
I honestly only see him as a spoiled little brat!
...and from what I would say that title belongs to you more than he. :)
Quote
no one will ever learn what he has learned!
What he said was that it would be difficult for YOU to.  He was implying that you are not intelligent.

Quote
Sarkeizen, do you really hang out with this guy in real life?
No but that's because I don't know who he is.  He seems reasonable enough. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 15, 2015, 04:05:32 PM
The burden of proof you mean?  Ok, no problem.  All you have to do is clearly and unambiguously state your position and clearly and unambiguously answer any questions about your position and if it can be shown that you are wrong in some respect you will clearly and unambiguously state that. :)

See no burden of proof....and now you will dodge this too. :)

The readers who have read back can see the shill running from the burden of truth...because he has no foundation to stand on.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 15, 2015, 06:43:52 PM
The readers who have read back
Well I called that one.  You complain about the burden of proof being put on you.  I take it off and say that all you have to be able to do is be willing to put effort in to make your position clear to me.   No dice. :) :) :)

Since that's pretty much the minimum required to discuss anything with anybody you disagree with.  This is you admitting that you're not at all interested in conversation.  Which is cool.  Your choice.  However, yet again you've lost any grounds for complaint.   Thanks! 8)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 15, 2015, 07:00:38 PM
Well I called that one.  You complain about the burden of proof being put on you.  I take it off and say that all you have to be able to do is be willing to put effort in to make your position clear to me.   No dice. :) :) :)

Since that's pretty much the minimum required to discuss anything with anybody you disagree with.  This is you admitting that you're not at all interested in conversation.  Which is cool.  Your choice.  However, yet again you've lost any grounds for complaint.   Thanks! 8)

Some readers want to see him prove vaccinations are safe, but i kinda enjoy seeing him squirm away from the subject.

I know I know...its a tad sadistic, but its not as bad as picking the wings off fly's tho.

Regards...


Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 15, 2015, 07:09:06 PM
prove vaccinations are safe,
But you won't let me ask questions and you won't reply with clear responses about your assertion right?  Ok, again thanks for admitting that you're not interested in talking. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 15, 2015, 07:33:12 PM
But you won't let me ask questions and you won't reply with clear responses about your assertion right?  Ok, again thanks for admitting that you're not interested in talking. :)

Gotta love it... the squirm of the worm is a thing of beauty folks.


Shill speak:

" step right up - inject this snake oil...its gooood for you...cures all that ails you.

But...the onus is on YOU, to you to prove that its bad for you."

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MileHigh on January 15, 2015, 07:57:37 PM
"The Flight of the Hypocrite" is also a thing of beauty and a wonder to observe.

This is just a pure hypothetical:  A really really nasty "super flu bug" infects the population and has a 30% mortality rate.  It's an airborne bug and spreads like wildfire.  However, the people that work on vaccines make a breakthrough and fortunately within a month the serum is perfected and goes into mass production.  There are massive queues everywhere as people wait to get their injections.  Heaven forbid, they actually use a mercury compound in the vaccine to prevent any nasty bacteria from culturing in order to make it SAFER.

Little Cappy Nada and the SeaHorse would also get in that line FOR SURE.  If you have a choice between a 30% chance of death vs. a little pin-prick on your skin it's a no-brainer.  The Grouch Marx glasses they are wearing don't disguise their identities as they wait in line.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 15, 2015, 08:08:43 PM
Shill drowning in massive pool of own urine...troll to the rescue with mouth to mouth - chooses wrong end.

Both now floating face down.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MileHigh on January 15, 2015, 08:23:38 PM
The classy metaphor guy entertains us with another song and dance.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 15, 2015, 08:27:07 PM
But...the onus is on YOU, to you to prove that its bad for you."
Actually that's the absolute opposite of what I said.  I said all you have to do is clearly and unambiguously answer questions about your position. 

That is, by any standard or measure the minimum for conversation.  Since you refuse.  You lose the argument. :)

Keep on being that kind of loser. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MileHigh on January 15, 2015, 08:32:09 PM
His position would be IN LINE.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 15, 2015, 11:14:43 PM
Actually that's the absolute opposite of what I said.  I said all you have to do is clearly and unambiguously answer questions about your position. 

That is, by any standard or measure the minimum for conversation.  Since you refuse.  You lose the argument. :)

Keep on being that kind of loser. :)

One reader opined that it is impossible to debate a shill...particularly when they refuse to present any evidence that supports their snake oil - er, I mean position.

That was quite the selfie the troll took, I wood say.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 16, 2015, 12:01:41 AM
refuse to present any evidence
Actually I have but obviously I have not answered your particular question.  So if we are going to talk you have to let me ask questions about your assertion.

You refuse.  Hence you don't actually want to talk.  Again, you lose. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 16, 2015, 12:41:09 AM
Slimy shill says...

"Trust me...inject this mercury and other strange stuff into your kids body...never mind that I don't have and evidence that its safe or effective.

And don't listen to all those whiners who say their kids coincidentally turned into zombies afterward."

Shill now stuck in tar baby.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: allcanadian on January 16, 2015, 12:48:29 AM
In the news
Flu Vaccine Not Working Well; Only 23 Percent Effective
http://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireStory/flu-vaccine-working-23-percent-effective-28249610 (http://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireStory/flu-vaccine-working-23-percent-effective-28249610)
 
AC
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 16, 2015, 12:50:01 AM


Quote from: Zen Gardner
How many times have we been faced with the decision to move on to the next level of commitment to truth? How often has a new level of personal sacrifice been standing at our door, beckoning? How did we respond? Were we willing to go further, no matter the cost?

That’s pretty much what it takes in the pursuit of truth. A constant shedding of the old, no matter how attached we’ve become to our self image and familiar surroundings; to be relentlessly following the signal from this esoteric siren of love and a greater reality that we know awaits. Much like mountain climbing, the decision comes first, then the climbing. But each step of the way presents more decisions. Will we go on in spite of fatigue, doubts, discouragement and obstacles? Which path will I take at each upcoming juncture?
...
Those still attached to their status, income, good deeds, moral high ground, or sense of superior intellect or spirituality in an exclusive and judgmental manner can be the worst enemies to full on truth and spiritual freedom. It takes on many forms and we all fall for these attitudes when in an unconscious or semi-conscious state. After all, it’s fiercely reinforced by the matrix and its tear down mentality.

They will dis and dismiss anything that surpasses their little ledge of advantage they think they’ve climbed to, and be quite militant and aggressive about it. If it doesn’t meet their criteria, it’s to be vigorously attacked as false information. A very sad psychological state to be in, but we see it in society at every level and have all experienced it from both ends.

The most obvious manifestation of this mindset is how anything contrary to the mainstream narrative is marginalized as “politically incorrect”, “conspiracy theory” and now even “terrorist activity”. But this permeates every level of information sharing, and is a huge hindrance to those seeking the full on clarity and empowerment awaiting anyone with the will to pursue it.
...


Source (http://www.zengardner.com/further-the-oft-neglected-path/)


Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 16, 2015, 12:55:45 AM
Quote from: allcanadian
In the news
Flu Vaccine Not Working Well; Only 23 Percent Effective
http://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireStory/flu-vaccine-working-23-percent-effective-28249610 (http://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireStory/flu-vaccine-working-23-percent-effective-28249610)

Aye, other studies (U.S. Navy) confirm this reality
but with much less effectiveness:  perhaps 3% tops.

But, the Flu Vaccine, like all vaccines, is a huge
money-maker.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 16, 2015, 01:00:03 AM
Maybe they put to much emphasis the sterilization of the victims-er, I mean patients ?

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 16, 2015, 01:49:46 AM


Tehn I tell him that he should NOT speak for others and then he says “i have been a moderator for 30 yrs and you are the only one whom has brought that up”....and then I ask myself “wow, this guy has been a moderator for 30 yrs and I'm here bringing this up”?




Wow Joel, I know you have problems with simple math but...really?  I said I have been a Moderator in certain areas of this forum for 6 years, not 30...that is 6.
There is a big difference between 30 and 6.  30 is not 6 AND 6 is not 30.  You can go back and read my post for yourself.

Also, please try to use real English words when posting, it makes it easier for others to read without having to decipher it.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 16, 2015, 01:49:55 AM
"Trust me...
Nope.  Never said you had to trust me.
Quote
never mind that I don't have and evidence that its safe or effective.
I do and I've provided some.  However apparently this is not sufficient for you.  So I need to clarify some things about your position....but that would require you participating.

Again I really appreciate all this evidence that you are not at all interested in talking. :) :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 16, 2015, 01:58:55 AM
Flu Vaccine Not Working Well; Only 23 Percent Effective
Depending on the age group the CDC estimates are as little as 14%.  However I've already explained the problem with these estimates.  :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 16, 2015, 01:59:42 AM
Aye, other studies (U.S. Navy) confirm this reality but with much less effectiveness:  perhaps 3% tops.
Please provide a cite. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 16, 2015, 03:43:21 AM
Nope.  Never said you had to trust me.

A rose by any other name, is but a rose.


Quote
I do and I've provided some.
 

Nothing unbiased has emanated from that vessel.


Quote
However apparently this is not sufficient for you.
 

Nothing plus nothing is still nothing...well, in earth based reality anyway.


Quote
So I need to clarify some things about your position....but that would require you participating.

A reader offered that 'Cap almost never addresses shills and trolls directly - and uses a mirror when gazing upon them'...except for when he is referring to himself in the 3rd person(a crowd favorite I might add).


Quote
Again I really appreciate all this evidence that you are not at all interested in talking. :) :)

Op...did anyone see that ?...he just placed the burden of proof back on to Cap !!!

That wood be the same 'burden of proof' which he acknowledged and accepted in an above post quoted below...

Cap:  mimiking shill in mocking fashion:  "never mind that I don't have and evidence that its safe or effective."

Shill's terse reply:  ''' I do and I've provided some.  However apparently this is not sufficient for you.'''


So now we have a real live mystery on our hands...right here on overunity.com, I said, right here on overunity.com.

Who's the dirty scoundrel that absconded with one of our Shill's evidentiary post ?

I may have to consult my personal friend, world famous psychic Clara Voyant, in order to get to the bottom of this.

Now, this may not have been done maliciously, it may simply have been one of the readers pranking our erstwhile shill.

There may also be a freedom of speech issue involved...I will leave that to the shill to address, as he wood be the alleged victim.

I have a feeling he will gracefully overlook the incident...as we all know how loosey goosey he is in with everybody else's intellectual property.

Lets hope all's swell that ends swell.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 16, 2015, 04:12:59 AM
Quote from: Cap-Z-ro
Op...did anyone see that ?...he just placed the burden of proof back on to Cap !!!
Nope.  I just said that I provided evidence, you claim it is not sufficient.  Since you are the one deciding what evidence is acceptable and what is not.  Then clearly the only way I can meet that burden is to be able to ask you questions.

Which you have not agreed to.  As soon as you do.  We can talk. :)  If you don't well again that's pretty enormous evidence that you don't want that. :)   But go ahead, prove me wrong.  Call my bluff.  Let me ask you questions.  8)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 16, 2015, 04:18:18 AM
Nope. 

Well, i guess that clears up that mud.

I don't know about the rest of you, but the word of an evasive shill is good enough for me.

Vaccines is good !

Do they have a DIY vaccination kit for sale...I wooden trust people who stick needles in other people to do it ?

Regards...



Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 16, 2015, 04:23:50 AM
I don't know about the rest of you, but the word of an evasive shill is good enough for me.
I've not asked you to take my word.  I've just pointed out that:

i) I've accepted your request to take on the burden of proof.
ii) Evidence has been presented - you agree
iii) You do not consider the evidence sufficient to support the claim that - vaccines are safe and effective - you agree
iv) In order to meet your standard of evidence I have to be able to determine what it is by asking questions that you will answer clearly.
v) You obviously don't want that.

Tell you what I'm going to put you back in the box.   Whenever you want to call my bluff, just let me know that you're willing to answer questions.  Okay?  Great. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 16, 2015, 04:25:41 AM




I am, and have been a Moderator in certain areas of this forum for over 6 years now.

Bill

Here is my post Joel as I know that you have real problems with research.

How the hell do you get 30 years out my saying 6 years?

Is this some sort of overunity?  A new type of QEG perhaps?

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 16, 2015, 04:32:39 AM
It just seems like 30.

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 16, 2015, 05:06:31 AM
I've not asked you to take my word.  I've just pointed out that:

Word twisting or yet another honest misunderstanding of meaning...you be the judge.


Quote
i) I've accepted your request to take on the burden of proof.

Op...now he's back on the horse again...this is like playing 'Where's Waldo'.


Quote
ii) Evidence has been presented - you agree

Word twisting or yet another honest misunderstanding of meaning...you be the judge.


Quote
iii) You do not consider the evidence sufficient to support the claim that - vaccines are safe and effective - you agree

Word twisting or yet another honest misunderstanding of meaning...you be the judge.


Quote
iv) In order to meet your standard of evidence I have to be able to determine what it is...

Op...and now he as much as says he hasn't presented evidence...a little Freudian action going on there.

This is like playing Beatles songs backward, and hearing John say 'I buried Paul'.


Quote
v) You obviously don't want that.

And oddly enough, the Beatles recorded 'You Can't do That'...which contrastingly actually had some meaning and relevance to something.


Quote
Tell you what I'm going to put you back in the box.


I think the readers pretty  knew who was in a box long before now.


Quote
Whenever you want to call my bluff, just let me know that you're willing to answer questions.  Okay?  Great. :)


And...back to me again.

I guess if your head is spinning all the time, you almost adjust to it, and think nobody notices the dysfunctional behavior.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 16, 2015, 05:13:37 AM


Tell you what I'm going to put you back in the box.   Whenever you want to call my bluff, just let me know that you're willing to answer questions.  Okay?  Great. :)

I am telling you that IGNORE is a wonderful feature.  Last time I checked, 32 people have Crap-Z-ro on ignore.  Of course, that number is still climbing and may have gone up already.  My suggestion is, that when this number hits 60....sell.

(Past performance is not indicative of any stocks future returns. Invest at your own risk.  Publisher not responsible for the content of this message.)

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 16, 2015, 06:20:52 AM
Quote from: Sark-Eizen
Please provide a cite. :)

Un-published study results may never be cited
although it is possible to make mention of them
with certain limitations.

Any study result which would raise questions or
criticisms of current vaccination policy (90%
manpower requirement) are never officially
acknowledged.  Only those studies which
demonstrate an efficacy of approximately 25%
(for flu) are made available to the public and the
rank and file military members.

Government contracts for military vaccinations are
lucrative business.  A certain percentage of the vaccines
are experimental which makes the military members
equivalent to 'guinea pigs.'

Refusal to 'take' a required military vaccination is an
offense punishable under the UCMJ.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 16, 2015, 06:31:43 AM
Un-published study results may never be cited
So you're saying you have no idea what the figure you quoted means.  Very like you. :)
Quote
Any study result which would raise questions or criticisms of current vaccination policy are never officially acknowledged.
Since we are taking about citing.  I'll assume that "officially acknowledged" you mean published in a journal that can be cited.  Which is clearly untrue but to know that you would have to read studies in journals.  Which you don't seem capable of.  In fact for all your whining about truth you seem to just regurgitate things on websites. :)
Quote
(90% manpower requirement)
Made up figure?
Quote
Only those studies which  demonstrate an efficacy of approximately 25% (for flu)
14% isn't approximately 25% and I've already mentioned that figure. :)

Any chance you'll say you were wrong.  Didn't think so. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 16, 2015, 06:40:57 AM
I am telling you that IGNORE is a wonderful feature.


Especially with the ego concussions I gave the forum's self appointed arse kisser.


Quote
Last time I checked, 32 people have Crap-Z-ro on ignore.


Bill


Well, I have been here doing the spade work for what...30 years now, I believe.

And Yeah, I may have snapped a troll spine or 3 along the way...but I may be over selling myself here...who knows how many of them were simply multiple moniker trolls.

And of course, browned off the self appointed and incredibly stupid arse kisser to the shills and trolls.

Everyone has seen too many members leave or be hounded by those very same naysayers nitpickers and trouble makers that end up whining after taking runs at me...my, what another coincidence.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 16, 2015, 07:00:08 AM
Sark-Eizen,

Within the military establishment there exists a
body of research knowledge which is 'classified'
and made available only to those within the
compartmentalized environment with a 'need
to know.' 

The research data relating to vaccines and vaccinations
is more extensive than you might possibly imagine.
The knowledge which is being withheld from 'the public'
is astonishing.

There is much deception in all that is fed to the public.

The numbers of military men and women who've been
gravely incapacitated or lost their lives as subjects of military
vaccine research is staggering.

Military deaths 'in the line of duty' or 'in service to the country'
are exempted from normal legal remedies.

You are either aware of this and are engaging in purposeful
deception or you are one of the deceived 'useful idiots.'

The power of the 'contract' is awesome.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 16, 2015, 03:10:33 PM
Within the military establishment there exists a body of research knowledge which is 'classified'
and made available only to those within the compartmentalized environment with a 'need to know.' 
In other words there is a very low degree of transparency and therefore it is less reliable than non-military research.
Quote
The research data relating to vaccines and vaccinations is more extensive than you might possibly imagine.
We're talking about efficacy (and potentially safety) data.  The reason you think this is so easy is because you don't understand how research is done.  It's not your fault.  You probably don't have much more than high-school math and all you appear to do is read the absolutely lowest quality information written by some of the most ignorant people imaginable. Ok, that last part is your fault but being unable to differentiate is probably the fault of however you were educated. :)

The truth is the military can do all the studies it wants, it can spend it's entire budget and all the shadow budgets you can imagine and employ every enlisted, reserve and start kidnapping civilians at random and...would still be unable to get a significantly different result.  See there is, to anyone who took even an introduction to statistics - a law of diminishing returns when it comes to research.
Quote
There is much deception in all that is fed to the public.
There is, but the vast majority comes from websites like the ones you post...and people like yourself. :) Again when it comes to efficacy you can believe that the military spends all it's time inoculating people then exposing them to a disease.  However it's not likely that they will get a different result.
Quote
You are either aware of this and are engaging in purposeful deception or you are one of the deceived 'useful idiots.'
This is what logicians call a false dichotomy.  You are stating there are two possibilities when there are more than two.  For example one other possibility is that you are simply mistaken...another is that you're deluded.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 16, 2015, 09:45:18 PM
Sark-Eizen,

It really isn't your fault that you have no substantive
knowledge regarding military Biological Warfare
research and related studies.  In truth, very few people do. ::)

What has been accomplished opaquely within classified
programs (mostly deep underground) in the fields of
disease, genetic modifications and preventatives/cures
is decades ahead of the 'knowledge' which is made
available to modern institutions of learning. 8)

If you are truly interested in acquiring such knowledge
pursue it.  Not all who seek entry are approved and
the demands are rigorous.  But then, you have no idea
where to initiate the journey. ???

One day, in the future, if you're lucky you'll be approached
by a headhunter who is looking for fresh meat.  If you go
for it (the program) you'll be forever changed.  You'll have
ninety days to change your mind (back out) if your first
experiences are not in accordance with your expectations. :o

Maintain a 'high visibility' so that you'll be noticed by those
who are looking for new blood. ;)

It might be helpful to speak with a Navy Recruiter with a view
towards entering the Naval Medical Corps.  That would be like
getting your foot in the doorway. :)

Not to worry - if you do receive an invite to join the party you'll
be given a discharge 'at the convenience of the government'
and a new 'identity' as a civilian contractor.  Then you'll be on
your way... ;D

The Measles is back! (http://www.newsmaxhealth.com/Health-News/measles-disney-outbreak/2015/01/16/id/618977/?ns_mail_uid=6604460&ns_mail_job=1603897_01162015&s=al&dkt_nbr=fb9om9gc)
 
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 16, 2015, 11:25:50 PM
is decades ahead of the 'knowledge' which is made available to modern institutions of learning. 8)
This is actually irrelevant.  Remember this was about a alleged navy study that said efficacy of the flu vaccine was 2%.  Again you can have all the money and people you want.  You can have technology 100000000000000000000 years ahead of our time.  You still have a hard time coming up with a significantly different answer. 

Why?  The law of diminishing returns isn't a technological constraint.  It's a mathematical one....and math looks at all the dollars, people and future tech that you pretend the government has and says: yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaawwwwwwwwwwwwwwnnnnnnnnnn!

The fact that you are kind of an idiot in this way is only partially your fault but you don't help by not being interested in the truth. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 16, 2015, 11:31:17 PM
This is actually irrelevant.  Remember this was about a alleged navy study that said efficacy of the flu vaccine was 2%.  Again you can have all the money and people you want.  You can have technology 100000000000000000000 years ahead of our time.  Math looks at all of that and says: yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaawwwwwwwwwwwwwwnnnnnnnnnn!

The fact that you are kind of an idiot in this way is only partially your fault but you don't help by not being interested in the truth. :)

Said by the shill/idiot who can't produce any evidence that his vaccines are safe and effective...unless he starts playing with text again.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 17, 2015, 03:52:24 AM
Quote from: Sark-Eizen
...
Remember this was about a alleged navy study that said efficacy of the flu vaccine was 2%.
...

The study indicated that the actual efficacy of the
public administered flu vaccine was 3% tops.

But, there was much more to the study than that.

Suffice it to say that vaccines which are 100% effective
against all 'strains' of flu are capable of being produced.

And more.

There are some members of the military who never get
any illness.  Well, apart that is, from mental illness.
They're intensively 'mind controlled' to make them
supermen.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 17, 2015, 05:35:11 AM
A most interesting take on living life which
many of us could find beneficial. (http://www.zengardner.com/how-to-unfck-the-world/)

Bottoms up!

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 17, 2015, 05:52:36 AM
So, are there really folks that believe that small pox, polio, and TB just stopped in society by accident?  Vaccinations had nothing to do with it?
Now, of course, some of these are making a comeback BUT, could that be that folks are entering this country by the droves have not had vaccinations?

I do believe that the shots have achieved much more good than the bad side effects, which, there are some.  It is a statistical choice.  Your kid has a 1 in 5 chance of dying from some horrible disease but, the shot to prevent it has only a 1 in 100,00,000.  This, of course, does not mean there is 0 risk...but...play the odds is what I say.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 17, 2015, 05:56:53 AM
The study indicated that the actual efficacy of the public administered flu vaccine was 3% tops.
So unless you are using the term "efficacy" in a way entirely different from the way researchers do.  This is very good evidence that whatever source you are relying on is entirely wrong.

Quote
Suffice it to say that vaccines which are 100% effective against all 'strains' of flu are capable of being produced.
Unlikely.  Information theory probably makes achieving that difficult.  That said there have been at least two articles about a "universal flu vaccine" in the past few days.  Which explains your incorporating this into your delusion.  This is based on the work of Miller published two years ago.   At least two phase II clinical trials for a broad antibody called CR8020 which is based on that work have happened in that time.  I haven't seen the results but even us lowly academics know:

a) This isn't a universal flu vaccine - at absolute best it's a universal Influenza A vaccine.
b) It's not even that, there are already (uncommon) viruses which are not affected like H7N9. 

So again your information sources are inferior to what is readily available from medical journals.  If you have the education to read them.   Which you don't. :) 
Quote
There are some members of the military who never get any illness.
Think, for once in your web-regurgitating-moronic life.  What would have to be true for that to be true.  See if you can figure out why that's stupid before I post back.  Ok?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 17, 2015, 07:35:08 AM
Quote
So, are there really folks that believe that small pox, polio, and TB just stopped in society by accident?  Vaccinations had nothing to do with it?
Now, of course, some of these are making a comeback BUT, could that be that folks are entering this country by the droves have not had vaccinations?

That is really not that hard to understand! And it is true. You just JB weld some molecules here and there and they are squeaking and then you make a vaccine.

Quote
I do believe that the shots have achieved much more good than the bad side effects, which, there are some.  It is a statistical choice.  Your kid has a 1 in 5 chance of dying from some horrible disease but, the shot to prevent it has only a 1 in 100,00,000.  This, of course, does not mean there is 0 risk...but...play the odds is what I say.

This is your common IMMUNE SYSTEM at it's best!

There is no cure for anything only the IMMUNE SYSTEM learning to cope with the virus.

Take for example the flu virus, the vaccine does not “cure” it but only helps the immune system to deal with it. Don't we have the flu virus getting people sick every year?

The flu shot is only for the MOST SPREAD flu viruses and does not guarantee 100% you will not get the flu. And once the flu virus gets in your system, your body YMMUNE SYSTEM remembers their genetic code, IOW, you will always carry that virus in your body. If you go to a reservation where no one has being had the “immunity” that your body has, they would, you will get the sick and will kill their population!

We actually do benefit from vaccinations here and there but that does not mean that the dinosaurs where going to the clinic to get flu shots! Where the dinosaurs have live thousands of more years than we have. Have you seen the TV show “monsters inside me”? Do you believe that the dandruff fungus will ever get outside your body just by using “headndshoulders” shampoo? The fongus will live for the rest of your living life in your body and will “mutate” here and there which in return the “creators” of the shampoo will have to add that MUTATION to their shampoo for LIFE! Since the fongus never leaves your body!

The actual solution is not vaccines but EDUCATION! The same happens to our IMMUNE SYSTEM, it learns how to LIVE WITH THE VIRUS IN THE BODY! The flu virus that you had 10 years with you is still living in your body, the body has just been immune to it. That is all!

Even with out vaccinations, the body would soon learn to deal with it because humans are not the same as microbial viruses. Humans are actually are encoded in their genetic code to keep on living. And with out vaccinations, the body will soon learn to immune itself from the viruses since the viruses need the human to survive too!

But your simplistic mind cannot understand that!

You see this all over nature how things work. And if there was one virus that gets rid of the human body, I HAVE NEVER HEARD OF A VIRUS GET RID OF A WHOLE MASSIVE POPULATION! And if that is even possible, that would only have to be in the low percentages! = they both depend on each other and they both need to keep each other in check!

How do you think the rest of the animals have survived for billions of years with out any vaccines? But I guess your brain cannot comprehend that far!


Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 17, 2015, 07:40:40 AM



That is really not that hard to understand!
The actual solution is not vaccines but EDUCATION!


Yes, I agree.  Please try to get some.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 17, 2015, 07:45:37 AM
That is really not that hard to understand! And it is true. You just JB weld some molecules here and there and they are squeaking and then you make a vaccine.


Great line...post of the week material for sure.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 17, 2015, 07:47:17 AM
Quote
I do believe that the shots have achieved much more good than the bad side effects, which, there are some.[

you also have to take in consideration what gives is air to breath and what gives us food to eat! You are only focusing on YOUR EGOTISTICAL VACCINATION, what about the rest of the animals vaccinations?

I already told you that 50% of all animals (that are left) have been reduced half their existence! This is very simplistic and I don't believe you are able to think that far that when there are 100% humans in this world and zero% animals zero% plants is your remedy for your brain farts!

That is just looking, like I said, AT ONLY ONE ANGLE OF THE 360* knowledge of life!

What good would it be to help the immune system when you are killing everything else that gave you life in the first place? Then we go in to the analogy that I have mentioned before....you are stuck in an island with vaccines and medicine with no animals and no plants, and then see what happens in 40 more years of you taking man made drugs in your island full of drugs!

You have no way of looking that far from your nose! I don't even know how have you made it this far in the evolution game! The only thing I can think of is that you have more bark than a bite, sort of like a little chihuahua dog barking behind his fence, bet then we all know that there are wolfs, and pittbulls too! So 100% sure your mentality is not universal nor the key to life! Just based on that.

All I will expect from you is to reply to one sentence that you “believe” to grasp from everything that I have said...lol....i'll wait for it :P
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 17, 2015, 08:04:30 AM
Quote
Yes, I agree.  Please try to get some.

Yes coming from a person whom believes that vaccinations are the cure and not by EDUCATING the population how viruses get in your body in the first place, since, YAWN, if one avoids the virus in the first place, we would not have to pay medical virus vaccination support for the rest of our lives! Get it or do you need someone to explain that for you?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 17, 2015, 08:10:10 AM
Yes coming from a person whom believes that vaccinations are the cure and not by EDUCATING the population how viruses get in your body in the first place, since, YAWN, if one avoids the virus in the first place, we would not have to pay medical virus vaccination support for the rest of our lives! Get it or do you need someone to explain that for you?

JB Weld is the best preventative medicine.  Trust me on this.  If that does not work for you, try duct tape.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 17, 2015, 08:28:41 AM
Quote
JB Weld is the best preventative medicine.  Trust me on this.  If that does not work for you, try duct tape.

That SARCASM did not work as you expected it would lol
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 17, 2015, 02:58:48 PM
JB Weld is the best preventative medicine.  Trust me on this.  If that does not work for you, try duct tape.

Bill


A sad example of someone who has never been relevant his entire life, struggling to be relevant.

Regards...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MileHigh on January 17, 2015, 05:36:07 PM
I hate this stupid debate and only glance at it from time to time.  Cappy and Munkee will stand in line to save their own lives if a superbug ever threatens the population, FOR SURE.

If you sit in front of a camp fire and the wind blows smoke in your face for two minutes you probably get more "chemicals" in your bloodstream than a vaccination gives you.

I don't search for this stuff, the default home page for IE fed it to me:

http://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/us/too-rich-to-get-sick-disneyland-measles-outbreak-reflects-anti-vaccination-trend/ar-AA8hejd?ocid=iehp (http://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/us/too-rich-to-get-sick-disneyland-measles-outbreak-reflects-anti-vaccination-trend/ar-AA8hejd?ocid=iehp)

"The outbreak has triggered recrimination towards an eclectic group of activists who are accused of sabotaging immunisation campaigns by peddling medical myths."

"The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (http://www.cdc.gov/measles/) (CDC) calls measles, a virus that lives in the nose and throat, the “most deadly of all childhood rash/fever illnesses”. About 90% of those who are not immune will become infected if they come close to an infected person, according to the CDC."

"A debunked and withdrawn 1998 Lancet report linking vaccines to autism still lingers in some parents’ minds along with other worries, such as overloading a child’s immune system with multiple, simultaneous vaccinations – a concern lacking scientific basis, said Zahn."

"On Friday, the LA Times published an editorial and letters (http://www.latimes.com/opinion/readersreact/la-le-0116-friday-measles-vaccination-20150116-story.html) excoriating the anti-vaccine movement. “Ignorance cannot dictate public health,” wrote Richard Wulfsberg, a Studio City-based physician. “No unvaccinated child should be allowed to enter public school.”"

And I know our resident anti-vaccine linkers will rebut this with links from websites that are nothing more than virtual rags that want to sell you magnetic belts for improving your bioforce accumulator energy and "all natural" protein absorption complex beta-inhibitor pills so you can all decide for yourselves.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 17, 2015, 05:51:21 PM
I wood die before injecting that crap into my body.

That guy will die AFTER injecting that crap into his body.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MileHigh on January 17, 2015, 05:53:00 PM
Darwin Award candidate in waiting.  (And it's not me.)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 17, 2015, 06:08:11 PM
Darwin Award candidate in waiting.  (And it's not me.)

You'll have to excuse him, he also stood in line for the H1N1 "vaccine"...twice.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MileHigh on January 17, 2015, 06:19:20 PM
I did take the H1N1 vaccine and I felt absolutely nothing.  Then I died.  Then I got some magnetic bracelets and took Becky's "Orgone-a-Gasm" "all natural" bioforce pills and slept under a pyramid on a bed of razor blades and came back to life.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 17, 2015, 06:21:27 PM
I did take the H1N1 vaccine and I felt absolutely nothing.  Then I died.  Then I got some magnetic bracelets and took Becky's "Orgone-a-Gasm" "all natural" bioforce pills and slept under a pyramid on a bed of razor blades and came back to life.

The really amazing thing is, all of those razor blades are now sharp once again from being under the pyramid.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 17, 2015, 06:52:22 PM
All I will expect from you is to reply to one sentence
I'll choose a half-sentence.  Why?  Because your posts aren't cogent.  They are barely English.  If you focused on one particular point - even acknowledging that said point does not represent the entire issue - you might be able to talk with people more.  Instead you sound like a child or someone with some kind of social disorder (but my money is still on "troll").
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 17, 2015, 06:58:55 PM
The really amazing thing is, all of those razor blades are now sharp once again from being under the pyramid.

Bill

And yet another brilliant quote from the arse kisser to the trolls.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MileHigh on January 17, 2015, 07:03:23 PM
That was an amusing little follow-up line but you are just too c-r-e-e-p-y to even acknowledge that.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: ramset on January 17, 2015, 07:18:23 PM
Just one little search [nothing too specific]
sorry if its not as up to date as the 1998 studies mentioned here.
why yes I suppose there is nothing to see and its all figured out..
sorry for the trouble... Move along

ohh and as Sarc has said disregard the 167 peer revued papers mentioned in the MIT study
why ..Sarc is Just SSOOoooo smart  ,just ask him He'll tell you!!
he has a mirror in front of his desk ,it has sooo many Kissy marks on it I am not sure he can see himself anymore thru all the smudge marks...
http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/categories/autism

Potential for early detection of autism offered by advanced 3-D facial imaging16 Jan 2015
Autism symptoms frequently missed by pediatricians during brief checkups 14 Jan 2015
Ritual circumcision linked to increased risk of autism in young boys13 Jan 2015
Systematically tracking subtle brain mutations 10 Jan 2015
How a protein crucial to learning and memory works 9 Jan 2015
Autism-linked protein for sculpting brain connections pinpointed by study 8 Jan 2015
Automated method detects activity of mouse neurons during specific behaviors, brainwide, at cellular resolution8 Jan 2015
Study identifies part of brain key to controlling attention7 Jan 2015
Potential treatment for Huntington's disease suggested by animal study 7 Jan 2015
Molecular network identified underlying autism spectrum disorders6 Jan 2015
Diverse autism mutations lead to different disease outcomes5 Jan 2015
Tiny gene fragments discovered that are linked to brain development and autism1 Jan 2015
Living with pets linked to stronger social skills in children with autism31 Dec 2014
Autism, cancer mutations found in unexplored regions of the genome31 Dec 2014
Scientists uncover molecular map of autism-related genes30 Dec 2014
Machine learning reveals unexpected genetic roots of cancers, autism and other disorders28 Dec 2014
'Master regulator' gene - long tied to autism disorders - stimulates other genes in early brain development23 Dec 2014
Therapeutic strategy identified that may treat a childhood neurological disorder - neurofibromatosis type 1 21 Dec 2014
Maternal exposure to air pollution linked to offspring autism risk18 Dec 2014
Memory formation in fragile X syndrome strengthened by multiple, short learning sessions15 Dec 2014
Brain study shows inflammation is a marker of autism11 Dec 2014
Preeclampsia during pregnancy and child's autism risk linked9 Dec 2014
Researchers pinpoint chemo effect on brain cells, potential link to autism 5 Dec 2014
Autism and gender nonconformity combined present unique challenges5 Dec 2014
Altered 'thought-markers' of autism identified by new tool4 Dec 2014
Minute movements of autistic children and their parents provide clue to severity of disorder3 Dec 2014
Why faces are seen differently in autism30 Nov 2014
Researchers identify drug target for behavioral symptoms of fragile X syndrome28 Nov 2014
Missing gene linked to autism26 Nov 2014
Mouse study identifies malfunctioning neural circuit at the root of motor impairments seen in autism26 Nov 2014
Findings presented at the Society for Neuroscience meeting by Johns Hopkins scientists24 Nov 2014
Serotonin's early role in the assembly of brain circuits21 Nov 2014
New insights that link Fragile X Syndrome (FXS) and Autism Spectrum Disorders (ASD)18 Nov 2014
New player identified in brain function and memory 18 Nov 2014
Recognising changing facial expressions a problem in autism17 Nov 2014
Study shows how brain maps develop to help us perceive the world17 Nov 2014
New mouse model demonstrates how the brain develops in individuals with autism14 Nov 2014
New genetic links in autism13 Nov 2014
Clues to ADHD, autism and bipolar disorder offered by 'darting' mice 13 Nov 2014
New findings challenge assumptions about how information is encoded in the brain12 Nov 2014
Black, Hispanic children underrepresented in autism identification11 Nov 2014
Images captured of a protein complex that keeps hearts beating7 Nov 2014
Brain changes linked to prematurity may explain risk of neurodevelopmental disorders7 Nov 2014
Link discovered between oxytocin levels in blood and cerebrospinal fluid 6 Nov 2014
Researchers determine that brain anatomy differences between autistic and typically developing individuals are mostly indistinguishable 5 Nov 2014
Autism spectrum disorder: ten tips guidance article5 Nov 2014
Increased prevalence in autism diagnoses linked to reporting in Denmark3 Nov 2014
Unparalleled gene-sequencing study has identified dozens of high-confidence autism genes and hundreds more worthy of study31 Oct 2014
Children with autism benefit from 'integrated play groups'30 Oct 2014
Effective autism therapy taught to parents in group classes29 Oct 2014
Early exposure to air pollutants linked to autism risk23 Oct 2014
Pitt Public Health finds association between air toxics and childhood autism23 Oct 2014
Siblings of children with autism can show signs at 18 months22 Oct 2014
Gene duplications associated with autism evolved recently in human history22 Oct 2014
A tool enhances social inclusion for people with autism16 Oct 2014
Could a chemical in broccoli, sprouts help treat autism?14 Oct 2014
UCLA study finds link between neural stem cell overgrowth and autism-like behavior in mice12 Oct 2014
Early intervention program benefits young children with autism, improves parent-child interactions7 Oct 2014
Assessment protocol shows potential to diagnose autism in Tanzania3 Oct 2014
New learning mechanism for individual nerve cells3 Oct 2014
More sedentary behaviour found in children with autism30 Sep 2014
Interpregnancy intervals of less than 1 year or more than 5 years increases risk of autism26 Sep 2014
Boys with autism demonstrate surprising strength in grammar processing24 Sep 2014
Blocking one gene could aid social behavior in some forms of autism, IU scientists report24 Sep 2014
Autism diagnosis and classification could be improved by brainwave test24 Sep 2014
Brain differences in autistic males with early language delay23 Sep 2014
Maternal iron intake linked to offspring autism risk23 Sep 2014
Mutations in gene linked to brain development 'may be a cause of autism'22 Sep 2014
Symptoms of autism common in people with Jacobsen syndrome22 Sep 2014
Risk of adolescent mental health disorders affected by size at birth20 Sep 2014
Parts of the brain's cortex develop differently in people with schizophrenia18 Sep 2014
Discovery of "seesaw circuit" in brains of mice has implications for autism16 Sep 2014
Autism treatment in infancy 'may prevent further symptoms'9 Sep 2014
How do  hormones influence autism risk?9 Sep 2014
Autism medications' effectiveness may be reduced by poor stomach absorption of drugs5 Sep 2014
Researchers find possible root of autism in early cerebellum injury4 Sep 2014
Pilot study of socially-assistive robots that help children with autism to learn imitative behavior2 Sep 2014
Changes in ADNP gene may be among the most common causes of autism2 Sep 2014
Previously reported autism risk appears to be attributable to mother's prenatal antidepression, not medication28 Aug 2014
In stress hormone regulation, maturing brain flips function of amygdala23 Aug 2014
Children with autism 'have too many synapses in their brain'22 Aug 2014
Algorithm developed to uncover genomic insertions and deletions involved in autism, OCD19 Aug 2014
Sexual victimization a greater risk for adults with autism19 Aug 2014
How information flow in the brain is centrally regulated for sleep and wakefulness19 Aug 2014
Brain 'switchboard' identified that is important in attention and sleep, suggests new targets for treating psychiatric disorders18 Aug 2014
Protein implicated in Alzheimer's disease has important treatment potential in genetic form of epilepsy16 Aug 2014
Autism interventions should focus on identifying and harnessing the autistic child's strengths14 Aug 2014
Patients with autism spectrum disorder are not sensitive to 'being imitated'7 Aug 2014
In children with autism, blood-oxytocin levels found to be in normal range6 Aug 2014
Scientists unravel a neural circuit that could play an important role in autism4 Aug 2014
Biomedical discoveries accelerated by see-through organs and bodies4 Aug 2014
Timing of neuronal generation is linked to how neurons achieve specific brain wiring4 Aug 2014
Children with sensory processing disorders and autism have measureable brain differences1 Aug 2014
Adaptive behavior important in inherited intellectual disability syndrome1 Aug 2014
The autistic brain found to be less flexible at taking on tasks31 Jul 2014
Little-known supportive cells, astrocytes, essential for memory31 Jul 2014
Peers with strong language skills help preschoolers with special needs30 Jul 2014
Research suggests early warning sign for babies at risk of autism29 Jul 2014
Protein once seen as a promising anti-cancer compound helps to stabilize neural circuits28 Jul 2014
Deleting enzyme favorably impacts behaviors associated with Fragile X syndrome

page 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 2-----------------------------------
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Dustcloud on January 17, 2015, 07:32:03 PM
Reply to Mile High,
I accept your point of view but have done a far bit of research myself into the latest immerging vaccines that are being suggested as necessary by the WHO etc.
Mile High, what you are discarding as dis-info about dangers of vaccines to a large extent now has become fact.
Of course if you wish to be naive and just accept the Bush Cabal's New World Order agenda then sweet dreams. On the other hand if you wish to actually inform yourself and become more aware of what the globalists have planned for you then check out the findings from these PhD's & Doctors:

http://andreaskalcker.com/en/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2tWDi1-ETHI
http://youtu.be/PelTWCUmTsU

More food for thought about the big Pharma Industry  http://youtu.be/FrwZN1cPfX8

Sorry for the rude awakening.
Dustcloud
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 17, 2015, 10:24:13 PM
Quote from: MilesHigher
...
"The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (http://www.cdc.gov/measles/) (CDC) calls measles, a virus that lives in the nose and throat, the “most deadly of all childhood rash/fever illnesses”. About 90% of those who are not immune will become infected if they come close to an infected person, according to the CDC."
...

As a child in the 1940s getting a case of
the Measles, the Mumps and Chicken Pox
were common experiences.

When children then were afflicted we were
Quarantined to our homes for several weeks
(like a vacation away from school), a Quarantine
sign was placed on the home to notify all passers
by and a Nurse came to our home daily to monitor
our progress.  The family Doctor would come by
each week for a checkup and then finally decide
when the Quarantine had served its purpose.

In those days Doctors made very affordable house
calls, Quarantines at home were very common and
there weren't any mass vaccinations.  We acquired
our immunity to disease the 'old fashioned' natural
way.

As children of about age 10 we did receive a Small Pox
vaccination on the arm and periodic 'shots' for Tetanus
as injuries demanded them from time to time.

Those were the days of the Ice Man, the Milk Man, the
Radio, the Movie Theater, the neighborhood Grocery
and the $1.00 per hour minimum wage.  A glass of Beer
at the neighborhood Beer Joint was 10 cents.  A bottle
of 'pop' for the kids was 5 cents there.

Life was good.  The Police were respectful and helpful
and violent crime was nearly unknown.

Fast Food was available at Drive-In establishments where
Car Hops both took and delivered orders to the car.  The
food was healthy and not loaded with additives and/or
animal medications.

We who are in our advanced years remember fondly
those days of the Good Life and wonder often how
on Earth things ever got so screwed up.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 17, 2015, 10:37:19 PM
ohh and as Sarc has said disregard the 167 peer revued papers mentioned in the MIT study

Actually what I said was...

Quote from: me
Well, as we all know you haven't read any of them.  So actually all you have is someone's claim that 167 papers exist.  I'd point out that what we are discussing are vaccines and unless you've described the character poorly.  None of them have to be about vaccines or any ingredient in them. 

For example let's just take the first one there.

Quote
Potential for early detection of autism offered by advanced 3-D facial imaging - 16 Jan 2015
I'd just point out a few things here:
a) This isn't a journal article.  It's an article about a journal article.
b) The journal article - which I read and you just mindlessly vomited up a web page which indirectly referenced it - isn't about early detection.  It's about subtyping autism based on 3d models.
c) It has absolutely, nothing whatsoever to do with vaccines.  Again because I read the paper and you didn't.

So are you claiming this was one of the illustrious and mythical 167?  If so, then you better hope the remaining 166 actually have something to do with vaccines. :)

If, out of that list you have anything you think is really strong evidence about vaccines and autism.  Then please by all means, point it out....idiot. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 17, 2015, 10:57:29 PM
Life was good.
Do you mean that racism was much more common, violent crime was more common or that women could be legally barred from practicing law or had trouble getting supervisory jobs (at least until the war) or that life expectancy was between one and two decades shorter than it is today?
Quote
violent crime was nearly unknown.
...but was actually slightly more common than today. :)
Quote
The food was healthy and not loaded with additives
Seriously?  The FDCA had only just been passed in 1938 and hardly had been enforced.   Manic depressives could self-medicate by drinking 7-up until 1948. :) 
Quote
We who are in our advanced years remember fondly
...and fabricate nice thoughts to help fuel your fantasies.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: ramset on January 17, 2015, 11:30:28 PM
Sarc
maybe your getting to close to your kissy mirror [the one on your desk with your lip prints and drool all over it...]
your glasses must be fogging up from such passionate moments of appreciation with yourself...


you have typed / Ranted MUCH more than the above quote..


and as I have stated before there are volumes of research going into this Epidemic ,
and your grandiose ramblings here are pathetic and similar to what would be expected from a very young or inexperienced man.
  certainly not from a person who is old enuff to have  children or considering having children.


 no you keep on Patting yourself on the back , maybe slow down a bit its getting breezy in here.
and Kissing yourself in the mirror and winking with that Thumbs up smile [yes we can see you]]


have a good life.


Chet
ps i will not be playing in your sand box anymore ,your  whole self Kissy mirror thing gives me the heeby Geebies

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 17, 2015, 11:47:57 PM
you have typed / Ranted MUCH more than the above quote..
I looked through the message history and that was the most recent quote I found about the 167 studies by me.  That was it. If there is some other point that I made that you wanted to discuss.  Then it probably would have been a good idea the MENTION IT SPECIFICALLY.  Rather than leave me to guess. No? 

Quote
and as I have stated before there are volumes of research going nto this Epidemic
There is a lot of research being done on autism.  However that's not what you were on about.  You were talking about the statements of a particular person, you stressed their credentials which, from where I stand do not give them any significant weight.  You then pointed to the 167 studies as support of this unqualified person's opinion.  More precisely you pointed to the number 167 and said that that many studies existed and they somehow supported your point.  Which at the time was about vaccines and autism but now?  Who knows.  It might be the effect of gamma rays on man-in-the-moon-marigolds.

Quote
grandiose ramblings here are pathetic and similar to what would be expected from a very young or inexperienced man.
Personally, I'd say it's people who swallow anything that fits with their preconceptions.  People like you.  Who are entirely unable or unwilling to READ A SINGLE STUDY and yet PREACH about the arrogance of someone who objects to the strength being placed on such categorically flimsy evidence.  People like that are those who are immature, ignorant or both.
Quote
ps i will not be playing in your sand box anymore
Well make sure you take your ball when you stomp off and go home...in a very mature way. :)
Quote
,your  whole self Kissy mirror thing gives me the heeby Geebies
Well it would bother me too if it wasn't entirely a fabrication of yours. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 18, 2015, 01:31:03 AM
Sarc
maybe your getting to close to your kissy mirror [the one on your desk with your lip prints and drool all over it...]
your glasses must be fogging up from such passionate moments of appreciation with yourself...

Noooooooooooooooooooooooooo, now even Chet has succumbed to making bodily fluid references

What hath I wrought ??


Quote
...your grandiose ramblings here are pathetic and similar to what would be expected from a very young or inexperienced man.
  certainly not from a person who is old enuff to have  children or considering having children.

Well, let us all just hope he is in a committed gay relationship, or has a barren womb.


Quote
no you keep on Patting yourself on the back , maybe slow down a bit its getting breezy in here.

I think that may be just him farting...lets face it, all that hot air has to escape sometime.

Else, he'll bloat and blow up real good.


Quote
and Kissing yourself in the mirror and winking with that Thumbs up smile [yes we can see you]]

And we can also see the butt pirate working his back end.


Quote
Chet


Quote
ps ...,your  whole self Kissy mirror thing gives me the heeby Geebies

Does it qualify as multi-tasking if the butt pirate is cleaning up his back end at the same time ?

Regards...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 18, 2015, 06:09:09 AM
Quote
As a child in the 1940s getting a case of
the Measles, the Mumps and Chicken Pox
were common experiences.

When children then were afflicted we were
Quarantined to our homes for several weeks
(like a vacation away from school), a Quarantine
sign was placed on the home to notify all passers
by and a Nurse came to our home daily to monitor
our progress.  The family Doctor would come by
each week for a checkup and then finally decide
when the Quarantine had served its purpose.

In those days Doctors made very affordable house
calls, Quarantines at home were very common and
there weren't any mass vaccinations.  We acquired
our immunity to disease the 'old fashioned' natural
way.

As children of about age 10 we did receive a Small Pox
vaccination on the arm and periodic 'shots' for Tetanus
as injuries demanded them from time to time.

Those were the days of the Ice Man, the Milk Man, the
Radio, the Movie Theater, the neighborhood Grocery
and the $1.00 per hour minimum wage.  A glass of Beer
at the neighborhood Beer Joint was 10 cents.  A bottle
of 'pop' for the kids was 5 cents there.

Life was good.  The Police were respectful and helpful
and violent crime was nearly unknown.

Fast Food was available at Drive-In establishments where
Car Hops both took and delivered orders to the car.  The
food was healthy and not loaded with additives and/or
animal medications.

We who are in our advanced years remember fondly
those days of the Good Life and wonder often how
on Earth things ever got so screwed up.

That makes perfect sense. The IMMUNE system finds a way to keep a balance in the body. And the same goal is transferred to the WAY OF LIFE too. Since the way of life influences our way of thinking cause some thoughts are parasitic too. As a poor person only focuses on money and a rich person only focuses on 'luxuries' while a humble man (the cure) focuses in the middle.

We don't need vaccinations to get rid of 'rodents' in our houses. We just need to keep them out, as simple as that. As simple as fishing for a catfish or fishing for a whale. I know is hard to understand for most but it is the truth like you just explained. People do not need drugs nor vaccinations to get rid of a virus. We only need the SIMPLE way of teaching the person how they are transferred in the first place and engrave that in their head like they engrave that in our heads with commercials. REPETITION repetition repetition repetition till it is in our heads what will prevent the rodent getting inside your house.

Anyway, thanks for your story. A look to the past that it is our teacher for the future of society.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 18, 2015, 06:26:11 AM
That makes perfect sense. The IMMUNE system finds a way to keep a balance in the body. And the same goal is transferred to the WAY OF LIFE too. Since the way of life influences our way of thinking cause some thoughts are parasitic too. As a poor person only focuses on money and a rich person only focuses on 'luxuries' while a humble man (the cure) focuses in the middle.

We don't need vaccinations to get rid of 'rodents' in our houses. We just need to keep them out, as simple as that. As simple as fishing for a catfish or fishing for a whale. I know is hard to understand for most but it is the truth like you just explained. People do not need drugs nor vaccinations to get rid of a virus. We only need the SIMPLE way of teaching the person how they are transferred in the first place and engrave that in their head like they engrave that in our heads with commercials. REPETITION repetition repetition repetition till it is in our heads what will prevent the rodent getting inside your house.

Anyway, thanks for your story. A look to the past that it is our teacher for the future of society.

This from a fellow that does not know how JB Weld works.  It is an epoxy which is made up of 2 parts.  You mix them together and you can fix anything including cylinder heads on a car, a radiator, dishwasher motor fan, and you can also drill and tap it to make or fix threads.  I even used it to fix a motor mount on my jet ski once.  I also used it to repair a broken window closer bracket on my van's window.  Good as new and I saved $50 just on that one repair.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 18, 2015, 06:38:33 AM
Quote
I'll choose a half-sentence.  Why?  Because your posts aren't cogent.  They are barely English.  If you focused on one particular point - even acknowledging that said point does not represent the entire issue - you might be able to talk with people more.  Instead you sound like a child or someone with some kind of social disorder

I already figured you out and you are a FOLLOWER kissing pirates “BELIEFS”. There is nothing else to figure out from you but other than to support your “master”. Lol go read a book about the ALPHA and the BETA male.

Other than that we all have wondering thoughts and 100% socializing is mostly a distraction....so you must be the clown of the party like nikola tesla was? Socializing with you would not be brain pleasing.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 18, 2015, 06:52:56 AM
Quote
This from a fellow that does not know how JB Weld works.  It is an epoxy which is made up of 2 parts.  You mix them together and you can fix anything including cylinder heads on a car, a radiator, dishwasher motor fan, and you can also drill and tap it to make or fix threads.  I even used it to fix a motor mount on my jet ski once.  I also used it to repair a broken window closer bracket on my van's window.  Good as new and I saved $50 just on that one repair.

Quote
... you can fix anything...

lol, I've used it many times and also is an epoxy. But like I mentioned before it is not as strong as doing it right in the first place, JB weld is like 'being lazy' or using duct tape to repair stuff. The cold hard truth is that you don't know how to repair things PROPERLY since i'm 100% sure NASA would never repair their space ships with JB “WELD”.

That shows how much your mentality is “reliable” to your actions.

Are you trying to tell me that an “epoxy” weld is better than an actual metal to metal weld, or plastic to plastic weld?

I'm 100% sure if your dishwasher fan fix lol, gets a sudden stop via the “unexpected” it will become loose and you will use JB weld again to repair it. Lol

You know why that is funny? Cause I have been fixing things ever since I was little! I was born with that genetic “code”. And i've learned through out the years that JB weld and duct tape are for advertisers or IGNORANT people of what is really going on the reality of how anything works. Lol

But now you went out off topic in a thread regarding vaccines? is not that against the forum rules?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: ramset on January 18, 2015, 07:17:33 AM
Joel
quote
since i'm 100% sure NASA would never repair their space ships with JB “WELD”.
-------------------------------------------
actually remember that issue with the tiles  coming off the space shuttle [due to extreme heat
yes that was solved with an epoxy...
and yes epoxys will do most of what Bill has stated ,I spent many years of my life using epoxies on everything from seismic remediation of high rise buildings  to High speed rail attachments and other high stress high risk applications.
laguardia airports epoxy repair of the cantilevered peer expansion joint  of the main runway comes to mind .


however when it comes to tensile equivalency repairs of structural metals or exotic alloys[/size]
welding is always preferred [so far] however things are changing and soon we maybe "growing" these repairs as well as all manner of miracles yet to be seen in the 3D printing world.


times they are a changing....


respectfully


Chet
PS
and yes JB weld is amazing stuff in a pinch but the things you can do with a truly high quality epoxy wood amaze .
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 18, 2015, 07:31:35 AM
lol, I've used it many times and also is an epoxy.
...i'm 100% sure NASA would never repair their space ships with JB “WELD”.

I'm 100% sure if your dishwasher fan fix lol, gets a sudden stop via the “unexpected” it will become loose and you will use JB weld again to repair it. Lol

...JB weld and duct tape are for advertisers or IGNORANT people of what is really going on the reality of how anything works. Lol

Just for sh!ts and giggles, wooden it be funny if during the nigh when everyone is fast asleep, somebody JB Welded the arses of all the forum's trolls and shills ?

I wonder how much of a tongue lashing they'd all get before the arse kisser caught on that he'd been pranked ?


Quote
But now you went out off topic in a thread regarding vaccines? is not that against the forum rules?

Thats how trolls roll joel,
even a wanna be troll.

Regards...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 18, 2015, 07:42:05 AM
Thanks Chet.  I agree.

A funny story....

Back when I owned my machining company, my Dad was the Chief Engineer and we were working on a very special aerospace project that
required epoxying 2 pieces of ceramic together.  The choice of epoxy was critical so I asked my Dad about it and he consulted his Bell Labs phone directory
and made a call to a guy he knew.  He later told me this fellow recommended Armstrong C-4 and Activator W.  I asked my Dad if he was sure that this fellow knew what he was talking about, and he said "Bill, this is the guy that invented epoxy."  That was good enough for me, ha ha.

The really cool thing was, following this guy's instructions, which required using gravity (weight) during the critical setting phase that took place inside an oven,
the epoxy flowed so thin that when completed, you could not even measure it.  In other words, you take 2 blocks precision machined to .5000", epoxy them together as described, and then measure the total height and it was 1.0000"!  The guy said that when you can not measure the epoxy layer, that is the strongest possible bond you can get.  We tested this over and over and the ceramic material always gave way and not the joint.

Off topic for sure but, I still think it was pretty cool.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 18, 2015, 08:45:37 AM
Quote
actually remember that issue with the tiles  coming off the space shuttle [due to extreme heat
yes that was solved with an epoxy...
and yes epoxys will do most of what Bill has stated ,I spent many years of my life using epoxies on everything from seismic remediation of high rise buildings  to High speed rail attachments and other high stress high risk applications.
laguardia airports epoxy repair of the cantilevered peer expansion joint  of the main runway comes to mind .

Yes chet thanks for answering BUT we can both understand that was just a last desperate fix. I can also THINK of welding metal to metal as being a metal “epoxy”. All epoxies are not the same and the mere word of “epoxy” is just not strong enough but rather the last desperate measures.

Quote
however when it comes to tensile equivalency repairs of structural metals or exotic alloys[/size]
welding is always preferred [so far] however things are changing and soon we maybe "growing" these repairs as well as all manner of miracles yet to be seen in the 3D printing world.

Yes I understand, it all BOILS down to the molecular level. But it also has to do with understanding the past since MISTAKES MAKES PERFECTION. I don't know if I can explain myself right. It is bright as day in my mind. An 'epoxy' cannot replace the mother nature structural stregth. Epoxy is artificial and not as strong as the actual DNA encoded strands! Molecular 'level".

I don't know if I'm making myself clear here but we can do some tests if you are for it since facts speak better than words. We can conduct experiments and find a replacement for real life molecular strengths VS man made epoxy strength.

Then we can 100% know that “epoxy” is just not as strong as the real molecular level strength. In fact, welding two metals together, their weakest point is in the welding. Since that is just a repair. So we can all types of “welding” in a scale and see which one is the strongest of all! And i'm pretty sure JB weld is in the bottom of them all. Of course I understand that there are some 'epoxies' that work better than others, but they will NEVER be as strong as the actual metal, plastic, glass. Molecular 'level".

In the case of those tiles, most of the holding was also due to the INTENSE helping of the the REPULSION mostly than the jb weld. IOW, the "weld" was not the same as the other tiles where being held together. If that was 100% true, in the beginning, they did not "epoxy" the rest of the tiles did they? What I mean, where the rest of the tiles "epoxied" in?

I can go on and on and become an 'epoxy” expert and get paid to come up with a BETTER epoxy, but at the end of the day, the epoxy is still and epoxy.

Thanks for your thoughts chet! I like the way you didn't attack me. There is so much to be learned yet and so little time to argue about the present reality.

As a matter of fact, I find it that talking about 'epoxies' is childish when looking at the BIG PICTURE of life.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 18, 2015, 09:34:23 AM
Quote
Back when I owned my machining company, my Dad was the Chief Engineer and we were working on a very special aerospace project that
required epoxying 2 pieces of ceramic together.  The choice of epoxy was critical so I asked my Dad about it and he consulted his Bell Labs phone directory
and made a call to a guy he knew.  He later told me this fellow recommended Armstrong C-4 and Activator W.  I asked my Dad if he was sure that this fellow knew what he was talking about, and he said "Bill, this is the guy that invented epoxy."  That was good enough for me, ha ha.

Now I see where the 'love' for epoxy comes from. Father and son. Which is the 'epoxy' of sperm to a vagina lol...just a little inside joke. (well in my mind)

Dude, I don't mind hearing your stories at all! I welcome them and tell me how your thoughts came to be! It's all understandable and you deserve a cookie....but the ultimate goal is LIFE! To keep on living and keep on living. Plus since we are CIVILIZED animals, keep on fighting with each other. Nothing good comes from that but negative ENERGY! That or pockets full of money for the investors.

Quote
The really cool thing was, following this guy's instructions, which required using gravity (weight) during the critical setting phase that took place inside an oven,
the epoxy flowed so thin that when completed, you could not even measure it.  In other words, you take 2 blocks precision machined to .5000", epoxy them together as described, and then measure the total height and it was 1.0000"!  The guy said that when you can not measure the epoxy layer, that is the strongest possible bond you can get.  We tested this over and over and the ceramic material always gave way and not the joint.

Off topic for sure but, I still think it was pretty cool.

Hey cool guy, what makes you think that your “coolness” is the only cool? I have my own beliefs of cool that do not relate to epoxy what so ever cause I have other things to figure out. You don't even sound like an epoxy expert, you just sound like the guy whom taught you how “epoxy” works IS the expert! So I can picture myself you being amazed by others inventions only!

This ONLY implies that you are not EVEN an 'epoxy' expert but rather an 'groupie'. Or to be nicee, what you have learned from your PAST experiences.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 18, 2015, 03:47:33 PM
I already figured you out
The fact remains that what you write is barely cogent English.  I wonder if this is deliberate or if you simply don't understand how poorly you are communicating.  As i said, before my money is on "troll".  Like profitis your poor language tends to look a little forced. 
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 18, 2015, 09:50:18 PM
More about the Flu Shots 'not working.' (http://www.newsmaxhealth.com/Health-News/flu-vaccine-effectiveness-cdc/2015/01/15/id/618803/?ns_mail_uid=6604460&ns_mail_job=1603977_01182015&s=al&dkt_nbr=kbc4x4ph)

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MileHigh on January 18, 2015, 10:08:33 PM
More about the Flu Shots 'not working.' (http://www.newsmaxhealth.com/Health-News/flu-vaccine-effectiveness-cdc/2015/01/15/id/618803/?ns_mail_uid=6604460&ns_mail_job=1603977_01182015&s=al&dkt_nbr=kbc4x4ph)

For a guy that I assume hates the political system, you sure as hell go to great lengths to doctor and spin information so that if people are too lazy to think then you just might win them over.

From the article (the first bloody sentence):

"More than  three-quarters of Americans who got this season's flu shot could get the  virus anyway, given a mismatch between the flu strains covered by the  shot and those actually causing illness in people, U.S. officials said."

Also:

""There  are some years when the virus drifts and the vaccine still provides  pretty good protection. This is not one of those years," he said."

And many people when they read things like this will invoke what I sometimes call, the "cry baby syndrome."   Waaa!  I expect people that give me government services to be perfect all the time.  Waaa!

If heaven forbid a real superbug breaks out akin to the 1918-1919 influenza pandemic that killed 20 million+ people, don't forget to register online for your appointment for your flu shot.  You might end up standing next to Captain Zero, you never know.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 18, 2015, 10:57:42 PM
don't forget to register online for your appointment for your flu shot.  You might end up standing next to Captain Zero, you never know.

...And if his eyes are glazed over and he has a dark brown smell about him, he's MilesHigh, and it may or may not be a flu shot line you're in.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 18, 2015, 11:29:35 PM
Miles Higher,

No, it is not a matter of 'hating' the political system;
like all systems it is capable of accomplishing either
good or bad for the people it purportedly 'serves.'

Even the people who acquire power and influence
within the system are not to be 'hated.'  In truth,
they cannot help that they are obsessed with Love
of Money and care not who they step on as they
'advance' in their chosen profession.

Here is a bit of insight  (http://www.tomatobubble.com/id574.html)into what the problem really
is.

Those who exhibit such unwholesome characteristics
are not to be 'hated' but rather, pitied.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 19, 2015, 03:06:51 AM
More about the Flu Shots 'not working.' (http://www.newsmaxhealth.com/Health-News/flu-vaccine-effectiveness-cdc/2015/01/15/id/618803/?ns_mail_uid=6604460&ns_mail_job=1603977_01182015&s=al&dkt_nbr=kbc4x4ph)
In what respect is this "more" than what has already been discussed?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 19, 2015, 06:56:13 AM
More about the Flu Shots 'not working.' (http://www.newsmaxhealth.com/Health-News/flu-vaccine-effectiveness-cdc/2015/01/15/id/618803/?ns_mail_uid=6604460&ns_mail_job=1603977_01182015&s=al&dkt_nbr=kbc4x4ph)

Wow that is really eye opening. No matter what these non-educated people about vaccinations believe and say, the facts ARE IN! This is a new study just done recently not 10 yrs ago! I like to look at the dates as a matter of looking for outdated facts jan 15 2015.

I mostly like to take things apart and study them in a scientific way based on my past experiences but words can also be taken apart and be studied in a scientific way based on past experiences!

Quote
More than three-quarters of Americans who got this season's flu shot could get the virus anyway, given a mismatch between the flu strains covered by the shot and those actually causing illness in people, U.S. officials said.

More that 3 twenty five cents? This should not be very shocking considering how the flu virus works for those nerds.

Quote
An interim CDC report found the shot was only 23 percent effective overall, a performance about in line with what the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention predicted last year, experts said.

I'm sure these experts where not milehigh nor sarkeizen nor pirate which I'm kinda insulted by that since they seem to know the cure but do not make their own vaccines!! /sarcasm.

Quote
At the time, CDC warned that the predominant flu virus, influenza A (H3N2), had "drifted" or changed genetically since the shot was made.

I already mentioned this in my broken English. The “flu shot” is only a shot to help the immune system to help the body of ONLY the PREDOMINANT flu virus strand ONLY. The virus “genetically” changes so fast that this is what happens. Hence, the best course of action is EDUCATION rather that flu shots!!! plain and simple...immune shot engineers can only cure the flu virus one the patient is infected ONLY. Allegedly.

Quote
Effectiveness varies widely by age, working best in young, healthy people and least well in the elderly, a pattern reflected in the report released Thursday.

This is very obvious for many years in nature. One also needs to understand how vaccines work in the first place blah blah blah....solution EDUCATION to avoid it in the first place. Every year, they ONLY make vaccines after people get sick in the first place! Yara yara yara. Tell me of a vaccine they make before a number of people get sick....= “ predominant flu”

Quote
It showed effectiveness against H3N2 viruses was highest - at 26 percent - among children aged 6 months to 17 years. It was roughly 12 percent effective in people 18-49 and 14 percent effective in those 50 and older, but those estimates were not statistically significant because there was too little data at this point in the flu season.

12% EFFECTIVE in people 18-49 lol. Not to mention the people that die from taking the flu shot....well, it comes to a point that your can see the smart intelligent more stupid than what they need to learn from mother nature.

I never take a flu shot because I always try to stay away from sick people. The times I get sick is when a stupid uneducated person coughs in my face while being sick or blocks his caugh with his palm and them shakes my hand. Stupidity kills more than EDUCATION. Though keeping people stupid makes the investors more money!!! blah blah blah. Everything is SOOO hard to figure out.

Right milehish, pirate, sarkeizen.... ::)


Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 19, 2015, 12:58:06 PM
Wow that is really eye opening. No matter what these non-educated people about vaccinations believe and say, the facts ARE IN! This is a new study just done recently not 10 yrs ago! I like to look at the dates as a matter of looking for outdated facts jan 15 2015.
I've already explained what can be wrong with these estimates.  Most cases are not subtyped.
Quote
I mostly like to take things apart and study them in a scientific way
No, that's more like the opposite of what you do. :)
Quote
I already mentioned this in my broken English.
I'm not sure why trolls want to act like they don't know English. 
Quote
12% EFFECTIVE in people 18-49 lol. Not to mention the people that die from taking the flu shot
What percentage is that again?
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: MileHigh on January 19, 2015, 01:25:50 PM
For starters, if this year's vaccine was not that effective because of virus mutation, it does not mean your flu shot is going to harm you.  For the vast majority of people the effect will be nothing.  However, you end up having more antibody combinations in your body.  I am no medical expert but perhaps a "stockpile" of antibodies could help you with _future_ variations on viruses?

This is a purely hypothetical example:  If I have a choice between a 20% chance of death and a 0.000003% chance of death I am going to go for the 0.000003% chance of death.  I am also conscious of the fact that there is no  practical way to prevent yourself from coming in contact with an invisible virus.  Of course you can take perfectly reasonable common sense precautions.  The problem is that when you go to the supermarket you actually have to touch things.  Ain't real life a bitch.  Or change your body condom on a regular basis.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 20, 2015, 06:25:07 AM
Quote
I've already explained what can be wrong with these estimates.  Most cases are not subtyped.

I think you need to step down from your high horse and admit that vaccinations are not the cure for EDUCATION.

You may feel that you have this mentality of that SOME DAY I WILL MAKE A MAGIC PILL TO CURE THE WORLD DECEASES because that is what pays your bills, but that is not the absolute truth.

Very simple. There are two kids jimmy and diego.

I tell diego how to prevent the flu and how it is transferred.

You tell jimmy that he is better off with the flu shot.

By me educating diego how the flu virus gets inside the body, he has more “cure” for all year viruses flu strands that jimmy only being “protected” by the most common at the time....to add to that, you forget that a lot of people have to get sick in order to determined which one is the MOST COMMON!

So it is very clear that EDUCATING diego how the flu virus WORKS will have a greater inpact than trying to “make vaccines” for all flu viruses every year! YAWN!

Quote
No, that's more like the opposite of what you do.

Oh, “science” is very hard to do. Well let me write it down, do some graphs, compare stuff, and then come up with the most probable scenario. Do you believe that regular common sense does not work that way? We are all scientists in our brains!!!

Quote
I'm not sure why trolls want to act like they don't know English. 

my native language is Spanish and I know for a fact that I struggle to transfer my thoughts in Spanish and even have a harder time to transfer them in English. This is 100% facts!

I know English but I'm not an expert at transferring my electronic neuron pulses into English words. Wow, you are trying to say that i'm lying about that! That is not even a good insult bro.

Quote
What percentage is that again?

I don't know the percentage of people that die from taking the flu shot but there are people who die from it....even if I gave you a percentage you seem to not see the BIG PICTURE!
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 20, 2015, 06:43:36 AM


my native language is Spanish and I know for a fact that I struggle to transfer my thoughts in Spanish and even have a harder time to transfer them in English. This is 100% facts!




Hechos al cien por cien ? ¿Te importaría publicar una fuente para esto, por favor ?

Gracias.

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 20, 2015, 06:44:54 AM


I know English but I'm not an expert at transferring my electronic neuron pulses into English words.


Your english may not be perfect joel, but there is one english word you have mastered...that word is respect.

A word, which those who like to insult you for having a different opinion, seem to be totally unfamiliar with.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 20, 2015, 06:54:51 AM
Quote
Hechos al cien por cien ? ¿Te importaría publicar una fuente para esto, por favor ? Gracias ,

lol, Google translate is not that accurate, i read that in Spanish and does not make sense.

Well I'm Mexican if you want to dig deeper into the Spanish language i speak but then I'm sure you can't...

ohhh pirate, lol you are entertaining at least lol. If this was intended as to prove a point it was more funny than anything for me bro. lol

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 20, 2015, 07:03:05 AM
lol, Google translate is not that accurate, i read that in Spanish and does not make sense.

Well I'm Mexican if you want to dig deeper into the Spanish language i speak but then I'm sure you can't...

ohhh pirate, lol you are entertaining at least lol. If this was intended as to prove a point it was more funny than anything for me bro. lol

It was just a test to see if you were telling the truth about your language.  I had 2 years of Spanish in school and I have no idea what Google translate did to my question. (I can't read it either.)

If your language is really Spanish, then I apologize for any remarks I may have made making fun of your English.  Your English is actually pretty good considering.  It is certainly much better than my Spanish.

So, please accept my apology.

Thanks,

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 20, 2015, 07:42:44 AM
Quote
It was just a test to see if you were telling the truth about your language.  I had 2 years of Spanish in school and I have no idea what Google translate did to my question. (I can't read it either.)

One of the thoughts that will always stay with me for life is when I was being bullied. I did not understand the language the teachers where speaking to me, so I asked a Hispanic bilingual person next to me “how long does it take for you to learn English?” ...he told me that in one year I would learn English....now I see it obvious he was trolling me lol. And MAKES SENSE why his friends laughed too. In two years you cannot learn “full” English unless you are a prodigy = “I had 2 years of Spanish”....

Either way, to get back on point, would you rather get educated how the flu virus works or get a flu shot every year?



Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 20, 2015, 07:47:25 AM
One of the thoughts that will always stay with me for life is when I was being bullied. I did not understand the language the teachers where speaking to me, so I asked a Hispanic bilingual person next to me “how long does it take for you to learn English?” ...he told me that in one year I would learn English....now I see it obvious he was trolling me lol. And MAKES SENSE why his friends laughed too. In two years you cannot learn “full” English unless you are a prodigy = “I had to years of Spanish”....

Either way, to get back on point, would you rather get educated how the flu virus works or get a flu shot every year?

I don't take flu shots.  I have no medical plan and have not had a shot since 1976.  I wash my hands, take a lot of vitamin C and use oil of oregano when I start to feel like I am coming down with something.  I have not had the flu since 1976.

Bill

PS  I am crossing my fingers since I said this, I really do not want to get the flu.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 20, 2015, 08:01:54 AM
Quote
I have not had the flu since 1976.

You are shitting me right? Lol, just like you shit all the time with your answers....

Not trying to be an a-hole butt you find it easy to be one, and I already figured you out!  More EGO than KNOWLEDGE lol.

No flu virus since 1976? man the more I talk to you the more IGNORANT i find you, no disrespect, but "you are who you hang around with"...
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 20, 2015, 03:09:24 PM
I think you need to step down from your high horse and admit that vaccinations are not the cure for EDUCATION.
I might be able to admit that if it was stated in English.  My knowledge of crazy-troll-speech-affectations is limited.

Quote
So it is very clear that EDUCATING diego how the flu virus WORKS will have a greater inpact than trying to “make vaccines” for all flu viruses every year!
Except that we already do educate people on limiting transmission.  However, even when people are very, very, very careful it still happens and it happens considerably less when we vaccinate. :)
Quote
Do you believe that regular common sense does not work that way?
Again attempting to translate from crazy-troll.  If what you mean is that people normally or reflexively think in a manner comparable with rigorous science.  The answer is absolutely not.  People have all sorts of biases that science simply can not have.  There have been all sorts of studies done on people's cognitive biases.
Quote
my native language is Spanish and I know for a fact that I struggle to transfer my thoughts in Spanish and even have a harder time to transfer them in English. This is 100% facts!
It may be but your errors are inconsistent.   This makes me think you are to some degree putting on some kind of show. 
Quote
I don't know the percentage of people that die from taking the flu shot but there are people who die from it..
...and the number of people who die from influenza...
Quote
the BIG PICTURE!
The fact that you can't do a simple risk/reward calculation kind of excludes you from having much to say about the big picture.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Dustcloud on January 20, 2015, 06:43:24 PM
Hold on for a second,
What the hell has this female mud wrestling got to do with vaccines ?
Furthermore what the hell has any of this got to do with Over Unity ???????????
Give me a break already  >:(
Dustcloud

If you want to really know watch this:

http://youtu.be/Gz_wWS1GMls
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 20, 2015, 09:09:57 PM
If you want to really know watch this:
Why do people insist on videos?  Seriously one of the absolute worst ways to disseminate information.  The first 8 minutes can be summed up:

- Trying to remember when they last talked, what day it was, describing the weather and a cow bell (3:10!)
- The swine flu has disappeared from the media, people no longer feel pressured to get vaccinated. 
- Some portion of people have taken the vaccine.
- Talking head seems to think this figure is very low and attributes this to information being shared about how the vaccine is worse than the disease and critical thinking and the examination of the facts.
- Some reference to the idea that the government thought that people wouldn't take this vaccine.
- Reference to seeeeeecret government plans on the internet. 
- More vague references to people's decision not to take the vaccine was really a rational response to the information out there.

Just speaking from the US.  The H1N1 vaccination coverage is probably just around or just under 30%.  The seasonal vaccination rate for that year (and most years onward) was about 40%.   

So a) This person doesn't know what they're talking about with regard to actual coverage and b) considering that people needed to take a second vaccine (which in some cases was difficult to get early in the season) a drop in 10% isn't exactly large.

Can anyone who has the patience for this tell me if there's anything non-stupid in the rest.  I have some video games which aren't going to play themselves.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 20, 2015, 10:56:15 PM
Hold on for a second,
What the hell has this female mud wrestling got to do with vaccines ?
Furthermore what the hell has any of this got to do with Over Unity ??? ??? ??? ??
Give me a break already  >:(

If you want to really know watch this:

http://youtu.be/Gz_wWS1GMls (http://youtu.be/Gz_wWS1GMls)

Fair question.  When it comes to 'over-unity' the human body
must be at the top of the list.  We have yet to produce any sort
of machine which even approaches the incredible efficiency of
the living body of man.  When it is in good health, that is.

The material presented in the video is pertinent.  I wonder
though if Jane and Bill Ryan understand the vast interconnectedness
of the 'shadow government' which is pushing the New World
Order?  It has acquired so much power, wealth and influence
that it may be beyond any hope of dissolution.  At least, by any
effort of the People.

It will in Truth be overcome and destroyed - in its due time which
is rapidly approaching.


Quote from: Sark-Eizen
Why do people insist on videos?  Seriously one of the absolute worst ways to disseminate information.
...

Those with a Love of Truth will endure nearly
any video which brings substance to the quest.
Most videos offer considerably more edification
than your diatribes and whine-rants.

Video games eh?  No wonder then, that answers
the question!

 
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 21, 2015, 12:48:27 AM
Those with a Love of Truth will endure nearly any video which brings substance to the quest.
LOL.  Uh except that your criteria is only available post-hoc.  Which is typical of someone who doesn't think through what they're saying. :) :) :)
Quote
Most videos offer considerably more edification than your diatribes and whine-rants.
Must be getting to you if I have you breaking character. :) :)  Anyway as usual you assert something you can't know.
Quote
Video games eh?  No wonder then, that answers the question!
You need to actually pose a question before you use that idiom. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 21, 2015, 01:17:10 AM
:)  Anyway as usual you assert something you can't know.

Yeah, SeaM...next you'll be claiming that vaccines are safe and effective.

"...something you can't know"...without first providing accurate information, of course.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Pirate88179 on January 21, 2015, 01:41:34 AM
You are shitting me right? Lol, just like you shit all the time with your answers....

Not trying to be an a-hole butt you find it easy to be one, and I already figured you out!  More EGO than KNOWLEDGE lol.

No flu virus since 1976? man the more I talk to you the more IGNORANT i find you, no disrespect, but "you are who you hang around with"...

What part of "I have not had the flu since 1976" means I am shitting you?  I got the flu shot because it was free on campus and that is the last one I have had.  No flu since then.  (Not claiming that that shot had anything to do with it)  I am fortunate to have been very healthy thus far in my life.  I have not seen a Dr. in over 20 years also.  Maybe it's the bourbon?

Bill
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 21, 2015, 02:18:51 AM
Quote from: Pirate88179
...
I am fortunate to have been very healthy thus far in my life.  I have not seen a Dr. in over 20 years also.  Maybe it's the bourbon?

That is entirely possible!  It has been well established
that those people who are content, have an optimistic
outlook, maintain a low stress lifestyle and imbibe of
alcoholic refreshments daily generally are quite a lot
healthier than those who are ensnared by the Rat-Race
and all that it entails within the MATRIX.

Goodonya!  Bottoms up!  Knock-er-back!
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 21, 2015, 02:24:21 AM
Quote from: Sark-Eizen
...
You need to actually pose a question before you use that idiom. :)

Hmmm.  I suppose you missed the question
which you hinted at:  "What could possibly be
the reason for Sark's Arrested Development and
Unusually High Degree of Establishment Gullibility?" ???

Video Games covers that nicely. ;)

You may return to your Play-Time. 8) :) :o ::)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 21, 2015, 03:06:31 AM
Hmmm.  I suppose you missed the question which you hinted at
"Hinted at" is used incorrectly.  It implies intent of the subject.  Since I implied that you asked no question.  I'm clearly not hinting at any question.  You could say "You missed the question which I hinted at". :)  Just trying to give you a hand when you're not taking like a dime-store mystic.
Quote
Video Games covers that nicely. ;)
LOL.  What about the jitterbug granddad?  Will that really turn us into reefer addicts like minister Jones says?  Is rock and roll really the devils music?

Sadly I don't have enough time to play video games with any regularity.  However they are preferable to listening to vapid ramblings of someone who can't even get the simplest of facts correct.  Then embellishing them with ridiculous hyperbole.  Again if there's some clear strong piece of evidence there.  Please point it out.  Since you can't - isn't that a sign that playing games was a better use of anyones time? :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 21, 2015, 03:31:01 AM
Is rock and roll really the devils music?


Well, its certainly satan worshiping pedophile music these days though, isn't it ?

 
Quote
Sadly I don't have enough time to play video games with any regularity.  However they are preferable to listening to vapid ramblings of someone who can't even get the simplest of facts correct.  ...- isn't that a sign that playing games was a better use of anyones time? :)

Sadly, what does it say about human(I think) when they wood spend their time..."listening to vapid ramblings of someone who can't even get the simplest of facts correct"...to the extent that they..."don't have enough time to play video games with any regularity"...which they just stated they wood prefer to do ??

It begs the question...then what are you doing wasting his time...unless perhaps he's not wasting it, but getting paid for it...just sayin'.

Psst..i think he may have me on ignore, so this shouldn't upset him...don't anybody let the troll outa the bag...so to speak.

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 21, 2015, 04:41:50 AM
Unusually High Degree of Establishment Gullibility?
This is kind of interesting.  So somehow I'm just believing what "the establishment" says.   Well again, I'm much closer to believing that SeaMonkey now being just a plain old troll like Cap-mo-ron.  See the term "establishment" doesn't actually have a useful definition - which means of course it can mean anything SM wants - although I highly doubt she's thought it through that far.  More likely it's just like "shill" - a generic insult - it doesn't mean anything in and of itself.

See if SM was right she would be able to produce quote after quote of me saying something is true or not true purely on the basis that someone said it.  However that's really going to be hard to do.  When I'm talking about vaccines I'm saying nothing different than the vast majority of studies which publish their methods and data.

If I agree with views that SM ad-hoc constructs as "establishment" in order to support his delusion/trolling it's just because the people behind those positions provide high-quality evidence.  The sources SM cites provide moron-level evidence.  So if SM wants to pretend that I'm under someones influence it doesn't seem for any other reason than I want good evidence and he wants evidence which confirms what he already believes.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Cap-Z-ro on January 21, 2015, 05:01:54 AM
It...sure...looks...like...somebody...else...is...pretending...to...have...me...on...ignore.

The other one has been spotted on numerous occasions in the vicinity of the hind quarters of the one getting paid for his time here.

--Just sayin'

Regards...

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 21, 2015, 05:28:13 AM
Sark,

"Establishment" is 60s jargon much used by the
infamous Hippies of Haight and Ashbury (https://duckduckgo.com/l/?kh=-1&uddg=https%3A%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FHaight-Ashbury) fame. 8)

Anti-Establishment was the sought after status
amongst  those amazing youngsters of that era. ;)

In today's lingo 'anti-establishment' would be
equivalent to 'conspiracy theorist.' :o

The 60s were GREAT.  Too bad you weren't there. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 21, 2015, 05:35:31 AM
"Establishment" is
...whatever goes against your pre-existing beliefs. Yeah I dig. 8)

Kind of telling that you're not really interested in talking about what position has the best evidence.  :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 21, 2015, 06:09:29 AM
Quote from: Sark-Eizen
...
Kind of telling that you're not really interested in talking about what position has the best evidence.  :)

Fear not;  as you continue on into adulthood that
dilemma will be self-resolving.  Experience is one
helluva teacher. ;)

Eat well, get plenty of sunshine, walk to and from
school and avoid vaccinations then you'll grow into
a strong and healthy specimen. ;D

Oh yeah;  don't cheat.  Never permit others to bail
you out or otherwise deprive you of the full range
of experiential learning.  The 'school of hard knocks'
is the best. 8)

AR

A more colorful accounting of Haight Ashbury. (http://www.extranomical.com/HTML_PAGES/HAIGHT_ASHBURY.htm)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: joel321 on January 21, 2015, 10:02:20 AM
Quote
I might be able to admit that if it was stated in English.  My knowledge of crazy-troll-speech-affectations is limited.

I don't even know what your “knowledge” about medicine is but you have to understand that dinosaurs have been living longer then us with out vaccinations?

And that the experience/education is more VALUABLE than ignorance.

Every vaccinations has a side effect! Because the “doctors” do not really know how sub-atomic viruses work. I don't know if you know this but the flu shot is just a semi-dead flu virus strand being injected in the body. Semi-dead means the human body will be able to detect it and since it's half dead, it is expected that the human immune system will have no trouble using it's defense cells to over take it, hence become IMMUNNE.  Regarding the nasal “flu shot”, it is the same virus strand semi-dead but it is more alive than with the flu shot. That is because the nasal is more for healthy people. Blah blah blah.

Nothing is hard to understand once you do your search!

Now, we can understand:

1- the flu shot is protecting you from the PREDOMINANT flu virus strand ONLY.
2- the flu shot is just injecting you the VIRUS half dead to make it easier on the body to become IMMINUNE to it. Plus the shot has some enhancers for the immune system too...don't know what those enhancers are.
3- people who take the shot can still get sick BECAUSE the flu shot is only “protecting” you from the PREDOMINANT VIRUS. And if we look deeper, what some may call call predominant may not even be that predominant...yara yara yara.

The “vaccination” for the flu virus is EDUCATION! Since that is how EVOLUTION WORKS....where  EDUCATION is learning. All cells learn! Even your skin cells learn! The skin cells can repair themselves up to a limit and doctors know this. A simple paper cut will heal your skin with no stitches. And 2” cut is harder to heal but it will eventually as soon as it does not get infected. To prevent infection (we have viruses in our bodies 24/7) the faster one closes the door, the less chance of an infection...blah blah blah.

But I'm sure you already knew this?

Quote
Except that we already do educate people on limiting transmission.  However, even when people are very, very, very careful it still happens and it happens considerably less when we vaccinate.

Do you even meet people in real life?

The majority are soooo stupid and do not even understand how viruses get spread out! An STD can be transferred via a hand shake or via a toilet too.

In the USA, we have sick days that are like 3 per year, from my experience. That is so stupid because they only think about GREED.

Show me the statistics of how many people go to work sick and show me how many people that go to work sick CONTAMINATE OTHERS! You don't even think that far which really makes you sound like a not very intelligent person. Tell me how many people at work get others the flu virus? I know from watching with my own eyes, that GREED makes people go to work even if sick and the flu virus loves it because it gets spread around. Then the company owners bitch about why others that get infected get sick but their stupidity shows that they only think about money!

How have you educated people on limiting transmission? Are you living in a cave by yourself? Show the facts!

Quote
Again attempting to translate from crazy-troll.  If what you mean is that people normally or reflexively think in a manner comparable with rigorous science.  The answer is absolutely not.  People have all sorts of biases that science simply can not have.  There have been all sorts of studies done on people's cognitive biases.

I would never disagree with a righteous person! But you have to see all the suffering first to see the real truth. You seem to not being taking in consideration all the suffering around the world?

And science has no BIAS....lol, I'm 100% sure that I can study and learn what you have studied and surpass you because it's all a matter of learning. Is not like what you have learned some one else cannot learn!

The IMPORTANT part is that some people see the future. And look at things from different angles. YOU seem to believe that you are some type of “special” person that I'm wrong and you are always 100% correct...you keep on calling me a troll which obviously i'm not trolling here but DEBATING only!

Quote
...and the number of people who die from influenza...

Oh dear, I'm sure it's in the thousandths. Well, let me see, mostly from the weak immune system disorders and from the elderly?

But i'm pretty sure you are not even thinking from a 360* angle.


 
 

Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 21, 2015, 02:30:49 PM
Fear not;
Awww...it's the "I'm going to avoid answering the question but pretend that I speak from some higher level of experience" troll.  It's cute!

The problem still remains.  The highest quality evidence appears to come from my position and only the lowest from yours (or what I can only guess what your position may be from things you've posted).  You are effectively demanding that people take your views on faith. :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 21, 2015, 03:14:35 PM
I don't even know what your “knowledge” about medicine is but you have to understand that dinosaurs have been living longer then us with out vaccinations?
Again, I don't speak troll very well.  Are you trying to say that a dinosaurs lifespan is longer than a humans or that they existed as a species for longer then we did.

Quote
Every vaccinations has a side effect!
Every action has an effect.  Even inaction.  So refusing a vaccination has a side effect of making you more likely to get a disease.
Quote
“doctors” do not really know how sub-atomic viruses work.
There are "sub-atomic viruses"?  Who knew?  Do you mean you don't know how they work at a sub-atomic level?  Doubtful but we do know quite a lot about how they work at an atomic level and an enormous amount about how they work at the cellular level.

Quote
I don't know if you know this but the flu shot is just a semi-dead flu virus
The word we tend to use is "inactivated" which means dead.  However since antibodies look for the "shape" of the virus (I'm oversimplifying here a bit) it will cause the body to produce antibodies for the live virus.  Enough for someone who comes in contact with the virus to be asymptomatic or sometimes merely have a mild case.  The nasal vaccine is a "attenuated" virus which means that the virus is still live and capable of infection but greatly weakened.  This is similar to the inoculation done for small pox via cow pox.

Quote
1- the flu shot is protecting you from the PREDOMINANT flu virus strand ONLY.
Absolutely wrong.  Antibodies are simply not that specific - if you read Sea Monkey's post about the scary shadow government having a flu vaccine which covers 100% of the flu.  While he is an idiot and incorrect there are antibodies which attack more broadly.   Another example is the varicella vaccine which has been shown to provide protection to people with the herpes virus.
Quote
2- the flu shot is just injecting you the VIRUS half dead to make it easier on the body to become IMMINUNE to it. Plus the shot has some enhancers for the immune system too...don't know what those enhancers are.
Unless you are taking the nasal vaccine.  You are getting a virus that is all dead.  Vaccines contain adjuviants which make the body make more antibodies than they usually would.
Quote
3- people who take the shot can still get sick BECAUSE the flu shot is only “protecting” you from the PREDOMINANT
Yes people can still get sick but not for the reason you stated.  See above.
Quote
The “vaccination” for the flu virus is EDUCATION! Since that is how EVOLUTION WORKS....where  EDUCATION is learning. All cells learn! Even your skin cells learn! The skin cells can repair themselves up to a limit and doctors know this. A simple paper cut will heal your skin with no stitches. And 2” cut is harder to heal but it will eventually as soon as it does not get infected. To prevent infection (we have viruses in our bodies 24/7) the faster one closes the door, the less chance of an infection...blah blah blah.
This needs to be translated into English.

Quote
The majority are soooo stupid and do not even understand how viruses get spread out! An STD can be transferred via a hand shake or via a toilet too.
Exceptionally unlikely - especially with a handshake.
 
Quote
How have you educated people on limiting transmission?
In our workplace, in subways and trains.  There are all sorts of signs educating people on proper hygiene.  We provide hand-sanitizer in the office. Children from kindergarten up are educated on hand sanitation.  Schools have procedures in place to allow them to isolate and send kids home if they think they are ill.

However you can do this all you want.  The problem isn't greed it's just that viruses are infectious even when you are asymptomatic.  Furthermore outside of wearing protective gear everything you do isn't 100% (protective gear isn't 100% either as we learned with the ebola outbreak) furthermore because your immune system is, through constantly never coming into contact with viruses is now much, much, much more likely to get a disease when you slip up.

Which is why vaccines save many, many, many, many more lives than they ever harm.

Quote
And science has no BIAS....lol
People have biases.  Math doesn't.  Sorry. 
Quote
I'm 100% sure that I can study and learn what you have studied and surpass you because it's all a matter of learning.
No, it's a matter of being not 100% sure. :)  Something you don't seem capable of learning. :)

Quote
YOU seem to believe that you are some type of “special” person that I'm wrong and you are always 100% correct
You're only wrong about the things I've mentioned you're wrong about.  For all I know you're right about pumping gas or serving fries or whatever you do from day to day.  The only person who uses the phrase "100% correct" to describe themselves is you. :)
Quote
you keep on calling me a troll
Because that's what you appear to be.  You don't show any capacity to consider yourself incorrect in even the smallest thing. :)

Quote
I'm sure it's in the thousandths
About 53,000 in 2010.  It varies the number of vaccine preventable deaths per year is also in the thousands.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Dustcloud on January 21, 2015, 04:06:01 PM
To Sea Monkey,
Regarding the New World [Dis][/Order], yes Bill Ryan is one the worlds leading researchers. His current website is going through an upgrade but you can find a whole lot of interesting stuff here on Project Avalon forum and also  Kerry Cassidy's Project Camelot
Cheers Dustcloud

http://projectavalon.net
http://projectcamelotportal.com
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 21, 2015, 04:23:24 PM
To Sea Monkey,
Regarding the New World [Dis][/Order], yes Bill Ryan is one the worlds leading researchers. His current website is going through an upgrade but you can find a whole lot of interesting stuff here on Project Avalon forum and also  Kerry Cassidy's Project Camelot
Cheers Dustcloud

http://projectavalon.net
http://projectcamelotportal.com
That was awesome.  I especially like the stuff about Raptors walking among us.  It reminds me of reading "The jet propelled couch" where a delusional confabulated all these grand interstellar stories to the point that the psychiatrist was almost convinced.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: Dustcloud on January 21, 2015, 05:12:07 PM
to sarkeizen
You reckon these people are just 'takin' the piss'? Why would they spend half there lives researching it if it hasn't affected them and obviously thousands of others as well. If you just stick your head in the sand the NWO is likely to aim for the but... :o
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 21, 2015, 05:26:04 PM
You reckon these people are just 'takin' the piss'? Why would they spend half there lives researching it if it hasn't affected them and obviously thousands of others as well.
So your assertion is that if some group of people believe something it is unlikely to be untrue if they reach a certain size and appear to be sincere.  So if a few thousand people believe the earth is flat and research that.  Did that make the earth flat?  If a few thousand people believe the universe was sneezed out of the nose of the great Arkleseizure and live in perpetual fear of "the coming of the great white handkerchief" is that true too?
Quote
If you just stick your head in the sand the NWO is likely to aim for the but... :o
Well if you listen to people here.  I'm more likely to be one of the people on top of the NWO.  So wouldn't it be better not to piss me off? :)
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: sarkeizen on January 21, 2015, 06:14:01 PM
or even more to the point...what about the thousands of people sincerely researching things that are contrary to Project Camelot like vaccine effectiveness and safety.  How is that large group of sincere people wrong and your smaller group of sincere people right?

They all have interests, people who run websites dedicated to showing the truth about vaccine harm.  Have a clear strong interest (probably stronger than any tangential pharma company tie for a researcher) in keeping their ideas alive.
Title: Re: Vaccinations; recent developments
Post by: SeaMonkey on January 21, 2015, 08:17:42 PM
Quote from: Sark-Eizen
...
The problem still remains.  The highest quality evidence appears to come from my position and only the lowest from yours (or what I can only guess what your position may be from things you've posted).  You are effectively demanding that people take your views on faith. :)

Whatever 'problem' you perceive exists only within
your imagination.  There are no demands being made
that anyone accept anything; even by 'faith.'

Adults have the ability to process 'information' as
they desire and to whatever extent they deem
necessary or adequate.  'Spoon Feeding' may be a
requisite characteristic of the Totalitarian Establishment
but while some measure of Freedom still exists the
preferred modality is that each Person think for themselves.

Standing on one's own two feet without the 'crutch'
of Media Administered Propaganda is becoming a rare
state of existence.

But then again, as you mature and acquire wisdom
you'll begin to notice these things. ;)

For the Adults or the 'adult minded' who wish to
know and understand more:

Rethinking Polio (http://liamscheff.com/2011/02/rethinking-polio/)

Hugs are incredibly healthy
 (http://earthweareone.com/hugs-the-ultimate-mind-body-medicine/)
The healing power of touch (http://www.sunwarrior.com/news/the-power-of-touch/)

Our modern World is very, very sick.