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Author Topic: Moving magnet=AC, static magnet=DC ?  (Read 5223 times)

Offline dieter

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Moving magnet=AC, static magnet=DC ?
« on: March 20, 2014, 02:05:05 PM »
Simple thought, great dogma, tho the lobby scientists certainly claim to know the explanation:


When we apply DC then we get a "permanent" magnet. At least as long as there is the DC on. So why  I ask you, don't we get DC when we apply a static magnet ?!?!?!?


This contradicts the basic modus operandi of nature. And to make things even worse, why is a closed magnetic loop in a low-leakage core permanent when dc is turned off? (see permanent motion holder)


I tell you, I ain't got a solution, but I'm pretty sure that the sooner or later someone willl come up with something like a magnet diode, that would be THE simplicity, by definition. Maybe a crystal mesh. Maybe elementary magnets follow schaubergers theorem about the drop shape?


Regards


Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline Newton II

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Re: Moving magnet=AC, static magnet=DC ?
« Reply #1 on: March 20, 2014, 03:48:21 PM »

If you inject a DC pulse in a superconducting coil and close the coil,  current flows in the coil permanently without any losses producing a magnetic field permanently around it. 

A permanent magnet also produces a permanent magnetic field around it.    Does it mean that magnet is a superconductor??!!


Offline gyulasun

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Re: Moving magnet=AC, static magnet=DC ?
« Reply #2 on: March 20, 2014, 05:36:37 PM »
Hi Dieter,

On your second question:

"why is a closed magnetic loop in a low-leakage core permanent when dc is turned off? (see permanent motion holder)"

The answer (by conventional science) is remanence magnetism,  for those in need of looking it up what it is, see here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Remanence   

Please watch these 2 videos made originally by member Nali2001 but some guys uploaded his tests on two kind of transformer cores again:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DR1TaQJAxWQ    Part 1 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BsN2sr3U0PY       Part 2

The tests show how important the ferromagnetic properties of cores are when used in DC pulsed mode.  When used in normal AC current mode, the reversing current direction 'resets' the particles in the core,  they would not maintain their previous state like they tend to do with a single directional DC pulse.

Gyula


Offline dieter

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Re: Moving magnet=AC, static magnet=DC ?
« Reply #3 on: March 20, 2014, 09:44:02 PM »
Newton,


absolutely. A permanent magnet is a superconductor, in terms of permeability, at least below the curie temperature.


Gyula,


I disagree with the remanence explanation. If that was the case, you could open the loop and close it again without to alter the remanent orientation or stenght. But you can't, as soon as you open the loop mechanicly, the magnetism vanishes. But remanence is the feature of permanent magnets. I think this shows how quickly established science comes up with answers, not bothering too much about the truth.


Although I agree, in core materials remanence is a serious issue.


Regards



Offline gyulasun

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Re: Moving magnet=AC, static magnet=DC ?
« Reply #4 on: March 21, 2014, 12:04:11 AM »
Hi Dieter,

I think you are too fast when saying that established science comes up quickly with answers, not bothering about the truth. Ferromagnetic material science is a vast territory to digest, see this just to peep in:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferromagnetism and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hysteresis_loop#Magnetic_hysteresis 

You surely have heard about soft and hard ferromagnetic materials, the difference is between their crystal structure where the 'hard' materials have much more defect in their crystal lattice than the 'soft' materials and this can be influenced during the various manufacturing processes and treatments. A big difference is seen between these two material types when you look at their hysteresis curve: a soft ferromagnetic material has a relatively narrow while a hard material has a wide, fat B-H curve. This means that a soft material is able to respond to an outside magnetic field or excitation much more readily than a hard core material, this latter is already in a "perpetual" saturation, it is difficult to influence.

Of course in case a soft material is suddenly exposed to a huge current pulse like Nali 2001 gave to his laminated transformator core then many particles were arranged into their saturation state but due to the originally soft magnetic characteristic of the crystal structure, the particles would gradually retain to their unmagnetized state, while in case of a hard material structure this could not readily happen because of the lattice defects.

So if you just consider that conventional science produces for instance ferrite cores (which does forget magnetization) and permanent magnets (which maintain their magnetism for several hundreds of years) then you may ponder on how much this material science bother about the truth. My problem rather is that the operation of the 'perpetual motion holder' can be explained by established science, hence there may be no free lunch from them.

Remanence is not exlusively the feature of permanent magnets: it is a feature of many so called 'hard' magnetic materials and can also be a temporarily feature of soft magnetic materials when they are overexcited, when their crytal structure is 'shocked' by heavy current pulses and their particles need time to recover to their 'soft' state.

Of course you do not need to accept these answers conventional science give you, you are free to find your own answers, for which I wish you success.

Greetings,  Gyula

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Moving magnet=AC, static magnet=DC ?
« Reply #4 on: March 21, 2014, 12:04:11 AM »
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Offline dieter

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Re: Moving magnet=AC, static magnet=DC ?
« Reply #5 on: March 21, 2014, 07:38:41 AM »
Well then, can you explain me why this remanent magnetism disappears then the loop is mechanicly opened? BTW. PMHs stick together for years.


I didn't want to discredit you and I also rely on accepted science, basicly. I just don't think it is Remanence in this case, unless the word is used for multiple things.


Regards


Offline gyulasun

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Re: Moving magnet=AC, static magnet=DC ?
« Reply #6 on: March 21, 2014, 11:43:15 AM »
Hi Dieter,

I did not think you discredit me in any way, I simply meant you are free to refuse conventional science and explore and develop your own science. 

Regarding why the remanence magnetism disappears when a PMH loop is mechanically broken:  I have answered this in my above mail, see these quotes:

"in case a soft material is suddenly exposed to a huge current pulse like Nali2001 gave to his laminated transformator core, then many particles were arranged into their saturation state but due to the originally soft magnetic characteristic of the crystal structure, the particles would gradually retain to their unmagnetized state, while in case of a hard material structure this could not readily happen because of the lattice defects."

"Remanence is not exlusively the feature of permanent magnets: it is a feature of many so called 'hard' magnetic materials and can also be a temporarily feature of soft magnetic materials when they are overexcited, when their crytal structure is 'shocked' by heavy current pulses and their particles need time to recover to their 'soft' state."

It is okay that PMHs can stick together for years: until any magnetic effect from outside influences the particles of the material, these particles (domains, spins, whatever they are called) can rest in their position where the initial huge pulse forced them to turn. The moment you remove the keeper part of a PMH  (the keeper is also a temporarily kind of permanent magnet with many particles forced to a certain direction), you give a magnetic influence to the whole structure and this influence is already enough for most of the particles to return to their original state they acquired during the manifacturing process.  (The full U shaped core can also become a temporal horse shoe magnet of course.)

Regards,  Gyula

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Moving magnet=AC, static magnet=DC ?
« Reply #6 on: March 21, 2014, 11:43:15 AM »
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