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Author Topic: Lenzless resonant transformer  (Read 94247 times)

Offline forest

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Re: Lenzless resonant transformer
« Reply #15 on: January 19, 2014, 09:35:52 PM »
Hi T-1000

What is on picture on left upper black box?

regards zcsaba77


It is Bertonee neon sign transformer.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Lenzless resonant transformer
« Reply #15 on: January 19, 2014, 09:35:52 PM »

Offline zcsaba77

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Re: Lenzless resonant transformer
« Reply #16 on: January 20, 2014, 10:27:54 AM »

It is Bertonee neon sign transformer.

Hi Forest

This transformer work on 12VDC or 110/220VAC?

regards zcsaba77

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline forest

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Re: Lenzless resonant transformer
« Reply #17 on: January 20, 2014, 10:37:12 AM »
Hard to guess, there are various models like that one  http://www.ebay.com/itm/Bertonee-replacement-neon-transformer-04-10947-Cirqus-Voltaire-Star-Wars-Ep-1-/331099247325?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4d170d92dd


Don presented a table top device with inverter so his spark coil was probably 120V rated. He has also a kind of voltage regulator because his nst output was 9kV while he used capacitors for lower voltage.

Offline Jack Noskills

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Re: Lenzless resonant transformer
« Reply #18 on: January 20, 2014, 11:57:16 AM »

verpies: It most certainly is OU, but I have no meters so I cannot say how much. But how much OU is not important at the moment, the working principle is.


My cell phone camera is broken, it refuses to enter in picture mode. Something wrong with the manual switch.


I have nanoperm ferrite which I got resonance effect. Haven't tried with iron because I don't have enough capacitors. I have read that for iron maximum frequency you can use is below 500 Hz.


I have also one small E-I ferrite core from a printer. With that I got OU without using capacitors, just shorted the coils to itself and no resonance effects. After this I started using nanoperm because it was bigger so easier to work with and begin playing with capacitors.


I am using audio amplifier so it can give enough push (amps) to the circuit. If someone is using signal generator they typically do not give out amps so the only way to magnetize the core is to use higher frequency. I think this very effectively rules out iron. You can still look for resonant frequency with signal generator from iron tho.


I have only light bulbs for load. Resonance is disturbed only if load is capacitive but I don't think this matters too much. If there would be only one secondary coil (like in the Utkin paper) then it would be very sensitive to capacitive changes in the total circuit, also resonant frequency would be much lower. In my tests the sweetspot in the output is several kHz wide so it is not necessary to find exact match. Most important is to tune the primary so current consumption is minimised in the driver.


When secondary coils oscillate, they create power in the LC-circuit which is then used by the load. So, when magnetic field collapses in the output LC-circuit, current reversal occurs and it rushes in the other side of the capacitor. Any load in its way gets powered and as a bonus energy is increased when other side of the capacitor is reached.





Offline verpies

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Re: Lenzless resonant transformer
« Reply #19 on: January 21, 2014, 12:38:12 AM »
verpies: It most certainly is OU, but I have no meters...
How do you know without meters?  Did you loop it an witnessed a self-runner?

I am using audio amplifier so it can give enough push (amps) to the circuit.
Analog power amplifiers are good devices to apply stimuli to various windings.
However Amperes are not units of power.

I have only light bulbs for load.
Incandescent light bulbs make reasonably good power meters if they are the sole load at the output of a device, ...especially if they have non-coiled filaments.

Do you compare the brightness of your light bulb with the brightness of another identical light bulb supplied with DC or use a Wattbox (Bulb->DarkBox->PV_cell->Voltmeter) like Grumage ?

Most importantly: How do you measure your input power with a light bulb?
Do you realize that a 12V 20W light bulb can pass 100W of electric power at 325V, ...without even lighting up ?
...because of this.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Lenzless resonant transformer
« Reply #19 on: January 21, 2014, 12:38:12 AM »
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Offline hanon

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Re: Lenzless resonant transformer
« Reply #20 on: January 22, 2014, 12:13:01 AM »
Hi Jack,

Thanks for sharing. This idea makes sense, and I think it has potential.

Here I post a couple of videos which may be useful in this thread:

Magnetic Lines Energy: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTb5q9o8F8c

Magnetic Flux Cancellation: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sc9bt5Yo0H8 

Regards

Offline e2matrix

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Re: Lenzless resonant transformer
« Reply #21 on: January 22, 2014, 02:21:40 AM »
JackNoskills,   Very nice writeup and thanks for sharing this.    Would you be okay with letting us (or me) know what country you are in?   I'll assume U.S. as you have good English.   I ask because it's hard to imagine not having a single meter knowing they can be had for between $5 and $10 for a digital multimeter.   Harbor Freight, Walmart or eBay...   Not having a meter while having enough $$ to buy anything Nanoperm just seems odd to me.   I'd consider shipping you one if money is really that tight.   Enough of the meter  quandary ...  ;)     
I would like to understand as verpies mentioned though just how you have determined this is OU or I think it would be better to say you are getting more power out than YOU are putting in and thus you are tapping an unseen power source from somewhere or something.    Unless you have it self running I have a hard time with that statement of it being OU since you don't know your power out or even power in.   

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Lenzless resonant transformer
« Reply #21 on: January 22, 2014, 02:21:40 AM »
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Offline wistiti

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Re: Lenzless resonant transformer
« Reply #22 on: January 22, 2014, 05:23:03 AM »
Thank you Jack!
Hey guys!
Why just try to replicate and comment with our result...?!!
Good luck to all.  :)

Offline Jack Noskills

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Re: Lenzless resonant transformer
« Reply #23 on: January 22, 2014, 10:08:00 AM »
How do you know without meters?  Did you loop it an witnessed a self-runner?
Analog power amplifiers are good devices to apply stimuli to various windings.
However Amperes are not units of power.
Incandescent light bulbs make reasonably good power meters if they are the sole load at the output of a device, ...especially if they have non-coiled filaments.

Do you compare the brightness of your light bulb with the brightness of another identical light bulb supplied with DC or use a Wattbox (Bulb->DarkBox->PV_cell->Voltmeter) like Grumage ?

Most importantly: How do you measure your input power with a light bulb?
Do you realize that a 12V 20W light bulb can pass 100W of electric power at 325V, ...without even lighting up ?
...because of this.



I have 1:1 transformer and stepup transformer.
First I tested using 1:1 transformer. I used 5 watt halogen on primary side and 10 watt halogen on secondary side. I got lots of light on primary and little light on secondary side. Normal transformer action. 
For second test I step up transformer. It is quite good, it can light 220 volt 40 watt bulb to more brightness compared to grid power. Watt meter hooked in front of audio amp showed power consumption as expected. Then I put 10 watt halogen on primary side and used 40 watt 220 volt light bulb on secondary side. I got full brigthness in the halogen but no output light at all, just little warmer than hand.


This proves that my setup is good enough to detect changes in power usage at the source. So, if I can light up 18 watt worth of light without a sign light in the primary side tells me something good is going on here.



My guess is that my audio amp gives out 5 volts.


I did some more testing with primary coil length, I kept the secondary coils that worked so I can see effect when only one parameter is changed. Reducing the amount of turns from about 90 to 25 and the effect was gone. 5 watt halogen in primary side was lit while there was no light in the output side which had now 10 watt bulb. Maybe it was little warm. Seems that primary requires high inductance and low capacitance while output requires high capacitance and low inductance for this to work. I will test using shorter secondary coils next when I have time.


Offline Jack Noskills

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Re: Lenzless resonant transformer
« Reply #24 on: January 22, 2014, 10:19:43 AM »
JackNoskills,   Very nice writeup and thanks for sharing this.    Would you be okay with letting us (or me) know what country you are in?   I'll assume U.S. as you have good English.   I ask because it's hard to imagine not having a single meter knowing they can be had for between $5 and $10 for a digital multimeter.   Harbor Freight, Walmart or eBay...   Not having a meter while having enough $$ to buy anything Nanoperm just seems odd to me.   I'd consider shipping you one if money is really that tight.   Enough of the meter  quandary ...  ;)     
I would like to understand as verpies mentioned though just how you have determined this is OU or I think it would be better to say you are getting more power out than YOU are putting in and thus you are tapping an unseen power source from somewhere or something.    Unless you have it self running I have a hard time with that statement of it being OU since you don't know your power out or even power in.


As long as I don't have a meter or even a camera to prove this it is just me and my gut feeling. I wanted to share this still in case someone is interested. I am not going to try to make a self runner, make money or anything like that. For me this is just a puzzle and I like solving this kind of stuff rather than watching TV. Thanks for the offer though. If I get high enough output power I try to learn how to move picture from N70 to my PC, if camera starts working again that is.


For me there is just one experiment left to do, effect of thicker wire and shorter secondary coils. To continue from this I would need signal gen to try higher frequencies and maybe oscilloscope. And off course learn to use them. I am sure there are members here who already have this hardware. Problem is that I don't know if this works with signal generator. So if one tries using signal gen and fails, he might give up too soon.


I will update the pdf when done and put it here, it should give a sort of guideline what to do.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Lenzless resonant transformer
« Reply #24 on: January 22, 2014, 10:19:43 AM »
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Offline forest

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Re: Lenzless resonant transformer
« Reply #25 on: January 22, 2014, 11:05:11 AM »
Jack


I have a problem to visualize how you are finding the resonant frequency of secondaries , or  you did that for whole circuit after winding primary and attaching bulb to primary to see the effect of impedance ?

Offline penno64

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Re: Lenzless resonant transformer
« Reply #26 on: January 22, 2014, 11:06:36 AM »
Hey Jack,

You need to take 5 minutes and watch -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQdcwDCBoNY

Regards, Penno


Offline Jack Noskills

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Re: Lenzless resonant transformer
« Reply #27 on: January 22, 2014, 12:06:32 PM »
Jack


I have a problem to visualize how you are finding the resonant frequency of secondaries , or  you did that for whole circuit after winding primary and attaching bulb to primary to see the effect of impedance ?


There is a picture of it in the pdf. I think primary is not need to be wound when resonant frequency is looked using secondary coils. I put bulb for detecting current flow in the secondary before parallel LC circuit. When the light went from bright to dim and back to bright I got reasonably close. It does not have to be exact match.

Offline forest

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Re: Lenzless resonant transformer
« Reply #28 on: January 22, 2014, 02:55:34 PM »

There is a picture of it in the pdf. I think primary is not need to be wound when resonant frequency is looked using secondary coils. I put bulb for detecting current flow in the secondary before parallel LC circuit. When the light went from bright to dim and back to bright I got reasonably close. It does not have to be exact match.


Ah, I see... so you test the same way as primary with parallel tank circuit and a bulb between audio amp and tank circuit. Good , I didn't noticed that in pdf.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline vince

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Re: Lenzless resonant transformer
« Reply #29 on: January 23, 2014, 12:41:36 AM »
Hi Jack

I had some time today, so I put together a quick replication of your transformer. I took 2, 120 to 12 volt transformers and cut them apart then welded and bolted them to get a similar setup to your 2 output coil version in your paper.
The output coils have about 40 to 50 turns of heavier gauge wire and the input outer coil has 190 turns. I used the existing coils from the transformer which were factory wound to the laminated core and I unwound one of the input coils from one of the transformers  and rewound it onto the other two as per your drawing.

I do not have the proper capacitors yet so I tried it without them .
At first I tried a 12volt ac input and measured 1.9 volts on each of the output coils. when I wired the output coils together like your diagram I measured 3 volts.
The input wattmeter measured 35 watts to my power source transformer.
If you short out either of the output coils on the output seperately there is no change to input watts. However, when the two output coils are wired together as per your diagram and then shorted the input wattmeter jumps to 45watts.
I attempted to feed 120 volts in so that I could use my larger capacitors to test the circuit but the input coil gets way to hot.

Is this somewhat similar to your setup?
Can any body explain  why my primary gets so hot with 120 volts. It is the same length of wire used on the original transformer which did not get hot.
Thanks

Vince


Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Lenzless resonant transformer
« Reply #29 on: January 23, 2014, 12:41:36 AM »

 

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