Storing Cookies (See : http://ec.europa.eu/ipg/basics/legal/cookies/index_en.htm ) help us to bring you our services at overunity.com . If you use this website and our services you declare yourself okay with using cookies .More Infos here:
https://overunity.com/5553/privacy-policy/
If you do not agree with storing cookies, please LEAVE this website now. From the 25th of May 2018, every existing user has to accept the GDPR agreement at first login. If a user is unwilling to accept the GDPR, he should email us and request to erase his account. Many thanks for your understanding

User Menu

Custom Search

Author Topic: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE  (Read 2334888 times)

Doug1

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 763
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #3045 on: January 30, 2016, 11:52:45 AM »
Hanon

 Sorry for the long delay im a little bit ill and it will be a few more days before this fever goes down. So while i said your rig looks nice that was just me being nice toward your effort and the clean appearance of the windings. The path of the flux in your E cores is not going avoid the short pah and take the long one through the y core and coil. It will just jump back and forth between the legs of the E in each core. It's curious why you used such a large Y winding. The E core primaries are already made for those E cores to run at mains voltage as a transformer. Wouldnt you think one of those windings would be better suited for a Y coil. If you can get enough flux to move back and forth over the already provided primary you should be able to figure out what size inducer coils you would need to do that. If not for the fact the E core will not work that way. Where are the I 's? For gods sake stop calling part G a commutator. It's a regulated splitter. I'll try to come up with a way to give you a image you can make in your head from something you might have on hand to watch  after I rehydrate so my head is not pounding.

hanon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 616
    • https://figueragenerator.wordpress.com/
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #3046 on: January 30, 2016, 11:41:00 PM »
Doug,
Thanks for making the effort in those conditions. Rest and cure that fever. I guess that you are saying that closing the magnetic circuit is bad for the flux moving along the Y coil, and that I should use a shorter induced core. As far as I understand your post is about not having a contrary pole near the one emitting the field. Your post is suggesting a design as the one in this post: http://overunity.com/12794/re-inventing-the-wheel-part1-clemente_figuera-the-infinite-energy-machine/msg468602/#msg468602. I will try to discard those E cores and use just straight bar cores. My previous idea about the design is the one included in the sketch below, but I will try now with straight cores. I also tried time ago with shorter Y cores as the pic attached, but also with those E cores. Maybe I also should try with more than one set at the same time, and just straight cores. My other problem is the commutator, aka regulating splitter of current, that I use with electronic firing and without a proper scope I am not really sure what I am really feeding.I call it commutator following the words of Figuera, but I have clear in my mind that it splits the total current to one or other set of coils sequentially. It is not an on/off commutator, but a incremental current splitter.


hanon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 616
    • https://figueragenerator.wordpress.com/
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #3047 on: February 01, 2016, 09:01:59 AM »
Summaryzing the last recomendations I´ve received for building the device I post here a list of those features:


- Short induced core to make sure of the field crosses the whole length of the core


- No use of a closed magnetic circuit


- Use the primary winding of a MOT (microwave oven transformer) also as the winding for the induced coil  (thick wire in the secondary)


- Use of straight cores (instead of E cores) in order to avoid the inducer field from jumping to a near opposite pole


- Use of two or mor sets -instead of just one set- to enhance the output, and arrange the poles to have always the same pole toward the induced coil  (all north poles or all south poles)



shylo

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 540
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #3048 on: February 02, 2016, 12:16:28 AM »
I think the thin wire gives off more spikes, or vibrations.
Collection is the hard part ,because as it changes, so does the ways of doing it (collecting it that is).
Lenz, is just another form of the magnetic field.
Don't fight it, use it.
It's all in the switching, when to flip that field, It's field reversal where to collect.
artv

Doug1

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 763
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #3049 on: February 02, 2016, 01:23:16 PM »
- Short induced core to make sure of the field crosses the whole length of the core

   (yes but with enough flux to be productive without overheating. Core size is also a factor. For the best materials a max of 10k lines per centimeter square dont expect to get anywhere near that. The filed being generated will attract the adjacent core converting it's own field to match up with the direction of the more active field/ stronger of the two.

- No use of a closed magnetic circuit
 
  Maybe one day but that day is not this day and a closed path does not have to be completely closed one.

- Use the primary winding of a MOT (microwave oven transformer) also as the winding for the induced coil  (thick wire in the secondary)

  If that is source of reliable windings that are easy for you get in numbers and they are all are actually the same.Not a bunch of them from different mots for different size ovens. The two in your rig are not even the same size. If you end up needing 10 coils for the Y's combined up to reach a appreciable output they should be the same.

- Use of straight cores (instead of E cores) in order to avoid the inducer field from jumping to a near opposite pole

  I cant believe you asked that.

- Use of two or mor sets -instead of just one set- to enhance the output, and arrange the poles to have always the same pole toward the induced coil  (all north poles or all south poles)

   Well some what unbelievable question, Big cores are dangerous hard to make and hard to justify. You have the option to combine the output of lots of modest size cores.Even full scale power plants use a lot of smaller coil/core sets and combine them up. For you own use you can make them fairly small it's a balance of resources. If you want to be the next Con Ed utility I don't have anything nice to say to that. I would rather it be less to build then the cost of a couple months bills for the same service from the utilities. 

darediamond

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 178
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #3050 on: February 06, 2016, 12:31:58 AM »
"If the current is given to move in series it will not produce COP>1 without the Earth batteries. If the current is given in parallel maintaining the same polarity it will increase the voltage experienced in the secondary in the middle 4 times and if the powerful magnetic field is compressed and magnetic saturation attained in the secondary core  you get the cop>1 results. If you connect to Earth batteries it is automatic."
With this statement, do you mean that the Multifilar Wires must not be connected in series?

Glenn_FR

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 20
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #3051 on: February 07, 2016, 03:27:38 PM »
Hi all.
A quick update, I'm not dead or ill - I'm self-employed and sometimes I don't get much time for my own tinkering...
First a couple of pics :
(Coils_in_use)
The coils I'm currently using.  The outside primaries are still my (ex. MOT) ~26AWG windings.  Still the same solid steel cores.  They can cope with about 1.5A at 12v without getting too warm.  I don't have any means to measure the field strength.  Does anyone have links/info on how to DIY a scope probe for magnetic fields - and how to calibrate?
(Bench_mess)
The breadboard is one of about 20 different designs I've been playing with to SIMPLY drive the two coils with the correct phase between them.  Two major design problems are persistent : how to minimise losses (mainly heat) using standard bipolar transistors in linear mode; how to bias the system to have almost zero idle current and minimum distortion of the sinewave (at 50 or 60Hz).  Ignore the mess aroundabout : I leave everything as-is and come back and tinker when I get time and inspiration.

One thing I did try was this simple inverter circuit ('cos I have built it on a pcb for a customer).  It outputs perfect 50% on/off out of phase signals to drive power mosfets.  For the primaries it is VERY efficient even at 50Hz : mosfets stay cool - even without heatsinks - and the coils get barely warm.  I had to add some shotky diodes to get rid of back EMF (yes, I know that I could recuperate the spikes to charge caps or batteries - but that's not the issue here).  The output signal in the secondary coil is of little use, though : just two tiny spikes each cycle - no real power.  Here's the circuit if anyone wants it :
(Inverter_circuit)
I haven't yet found the graal : simple, low power wastage, simple, only driving the coils in one direction, and simple...

Glenn_FR

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 20
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #3052 on: February 07, 2016, 03:33:22 PM »
(part 2) :D
Some questions :

- It's not easy to see in the photo, but my secondary coil has no core - it's air cored.  Has anyone info on this ?  Should it be cored ? 

Ciao,
Glenn

marathonman

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 860
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #3053 on: February 07, 2016, 09:58:56 PM »
Does any one on this crazy forum actually read and study the Patents.
it seems not.

hanon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 616
    • https://figueragenerator.wordpress.com/
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #3054 on: February 07, 2016, 11:31:15 PM »
Glenn,
I also recommend to study the patents to find most of the details.
Sorry I do not understand your inverter circuit. It seems just a one step driver instead of the 7 steps used by Figuera. I do not know if it could work fine or not. Anyway I think it does not include a base DC current for the minimun current always present in both inducers.
I would recommend to use a core in the induced coil

Glenn_FR

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 20
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #3055 on: February 08, 2016, 09:15:43 AM »
Glenn,
I also recommend to study the patents to find most of the details.
Sorry I do not understand your inverter circuit. It seems just a one step driver instead of the 7 steps used by Figuera. I do not know if it could work fine or not. Anyway I think it does not include a base DC current for the minimun current always present in both inducers.
I would recommend to use a core in the induced coil
Thanks for the info about the induced coil.  I have read the patents that I've been able to find (mainly thanks to you), and I think that I have understood what was done bu Figuera.  I'm working with just one set of coils for the moment to see how everything fits.  Figuera used a commutator and resistors to acheive his two inversly varying magnetic fields.  I'm experimenting to find the most efficient (and simplest) means of doing this with today's electronics.  Efficient meaning not having banks of resistors getting hot.  The fact that the coils should be driven 'in one direction only' and possibly with an idle current are design constraints that are not easy to meet with simple electronics.  To make it more complicated I've added my own design constraint to run everything from 12v.  Aiming for OU is one goal, aiming for something practical is another.

I tried the inverter circuit because I had it to hand.  I wanted too see how the system reacted to being switched hard on/off both sides alternately instead of the progressive variations.  That's what experimenting is all about, no?  I now have the answer - it's not the right path.
Thanks again.

hanon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 616
    • https://figueragenerator.wordpress.com/
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #3056 on: February 08, 2016, 01:53:03 PM »
Glenn,


IMO If you want to swing the magnetic lines you will always need a minimun current present in order to get a collision of both magnetic fields along the core of the induced coil. If you do not use that base DC current then you are just powering one inducer on and the other off (ON+OFF), then the second inducer on  and the first off (OFF+ON) but not both at the same time.  IMO it doesn´t have to reach zero volts (see image below)


I guess you may skip the resistor array if you use 7 batteries in a series and you power more or less batteries in series to one or other inducer set: 6-1 / 5-2 / 4-3 / 3-4 / 2-5 / 1-6. Adding their voltage you will get a higher or lower intentsity along each set of electromagnets.


Also, as I appeared long ago in the forum, you may also use 7 coils for each electromagnets and you could fire 1,2,3,...7 in order to get a higher or lower magnetic field in each electromagnet, being the second electromagnet fired in the opposite sequence: 7,6,5...1
« Last Edit: February 08, 2016, 04:54:32 PM by hanon »

antijon

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 230
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #3057 on: February 08, 2016, 04:33:20 PM »
Hey guys, Glenn, dude you're working hard. I hate to say it, but I think unless we use a different model for coils, we'll just end up with a transformer driver.

If you view the two images, the first is a set of coils driven by 2.5V AC, and the second is a set driven by 5V DC, in the pulse that we believe Figuera used.

The coils are 1:1:1 ratio to make EMF easier to understand. First photo, both primaries are driven in phase. The total EMF is the sum of the voltages, so, 5V AC. In this case, because the turns are 1:1, the output current will be equal to the current in each primary. So 5V at 1A output is equal to 2.5V at 1A on each input coil. 5W in and out.

Second image represents what we've discussed as the Figuera generator. Both coils driven by pulsed 5V DC, opposing. Output is 5V AC. Now notice the similarities in each image. Whether it's 2.5V AC or 5V DC the total change is equal to 5V. Here again, 1A in the output is equal to 1A in each input coil, but because they come from the same 5V source, it's 5V at 1A, or 5W in and out.

So what I mean is, yes it's possible to use DC, but in a normal transformer model it's still only 100% efficient. I think it's important that he uses series of primaries in all patent images. In Figuera's patent, I could see excess output greater than 100% if all of the cores were attached, side by side. This would be similar to a parallel path transformer, which I described before. But in Buforn's patent, where they are all arranged in a series makes it appear like a very long transformer. Unless all the output coils are wired in parallel.... anyway, I don't think anything out of the ordinary will show without multiple sets.

If anyone wants to say, " It's not a transformer," or, " You don't read the patent," then please substitute that with a decent theoretical model. It's easy to show voltage and power to explain your understanding.

NRamaswami

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 490
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #3058 on: February 09, 2016, 08:32:45 AM »
Hi Antijon:

Patrick has taught me that the Figuera device is an Asymmetrical transformer. Whether single module can provide OU or not who knows? It may or may not.

Darediamond...I apologize for delay. I'm not able to understand your question and not able to answer. I have some litigation work and may not post for some time. Have to take rest. Thanks.


NRamaswami

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 490
Re: Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE
« Reply #3059 on: February 09, 2016, 08:57:32 AM »
Very complicated electronics is not needed. An ordinary step down transformer with diode bridge at out put of transformer and split primary connected to diagonal opposite ends of two primaries with the ends being connected to diode bridge will do the trick of both primaries having different current flowing in them always. I'm not able to understand the need for electronic circuitry here. It is a simple device. Multiple modules may be needed to do it. Electronics does not work in my experience and is a waste of money and time and effort and every component is so sensitive that it burns out easily.