Author Topic: 4X3 Permanent Magnet Motor concept (Read 29610 times)

jake · « **Reply #30 on:** June 07, 2006, 03:39:23 AM »

What was unique about the two devices I saw that weakened the magnets was that there was somewhat strong testimony that the device(s) self ran for a period of time, and the magnets weakened.

Kundel's motor is really just a motor as I see it. It is a unique configuration, but I don't see it as a OU device. "Normal" permanent magnet motors run for at least 10's of years without problems unless they overheat or take huge current hits that prematurely damage them. I presume the motors could run for 100's of years if they would mechanically hold up.

Gregory · « **Reply #31 on:** June 07, 2006, 04:51:17 PM »

Last night I read everything what I found about Helmut goebkes's magnetic wheel at the yahoo groups pages.
Interesting... I agree with you, The fact that there are few people who already made a static device to operate is mean something. Yes, the devices demagnetized soon, but we still have the fact, that they worked before they demagnetized.
(And an interesting thought:
Only theoretically, these devices also foreshadow the possibility of a gravity machine. Because gravitiy and magnetism are similar. Of course Only theoretically. Only an inference, not strong)

If I understand right Goebkes's device used a soft steel part, wich is neccesary for its operation. The magnets attracted to this steel part, and after repelled each other strongly. The perendev device also works on a static repulsion state, and if I study it right, it can't work in attraction mode, just stand without a single move.
I guess, In static repulsion the flux lines try to cross each other, but they can't, and maybe this causes swirling flux, what is unnatural, and the power was rejecting out from the magnets. In helmut's design the steel part also can deplete the magnets, maybe, i don't know.

Magnets never want to repell each other, really never, they want to be attracted together, and standing in equilibrium, forever. Gravity (wich appear in nature) is also only attractive force, or we only knows gravitational attraction, wich is the natural way to go. (Planets and galaxies move by gravitational attraction.)
So if we use unnatural ways to operate a device, obviously the device will stop operating soon. I guess this is the essential part of the problem.

I don't know too much about electromagnetic motors, but if i know right (once again

), these motors work in a "balanced mode", with equal attraction and repulsion, or more the attraction. Is this right, or I'm dumb?

So, i have a conclusion: If I can figure out a way, where the static magnetic motor works with equal attraction-repulsion forces, or more attraction than repulsion, and the same time the device not use soft steel and similar parts, just magnets... If I can do this, perhaps I have a chance. Is this the right conclusion, what do you think?

I think if once I can set my wheel into stable motion, I also can set it into full attraction mode, or a more attraction mode, I almost sure about this.
I have already played long hours with my rough test tool, somtimes feel quite close to self rotation, but help it with my hand at the cog point, and I never feel the magnets weaken.

Anyway I don't want to present myself as a f***in clever person... Just my mind runs continously, and this the reason why I wrote too much ideas here.

Hope you haven't got a bad feeling about this, and my mode to communicate.

Regards,
Greg

Liberty · « **Reply #32 on:** June 07, 2006, 05:30:49 PM »

Quote from: Greg & Gregory on June 07, 2006, 04:51:17 PM

Last night I read everything what I found about Helmut goebkes's magnetic wheel at the yahoo groups pages.
Interesting... I agree with you, The fact that there are few people who already made a static device to operate is mean something. Yes, the devices demagnetized soon, but we still have the fact, that they worked before they demagnetized.
(And an interesting thought:
Only theoretically, these devices also foreshadow the possibility of a gravity machine. Because gravitiy and magnetism are similar. Of course Only theoretically. Only an inference, not strong)

If I understand right Goebkes's device used a soft steel part, wich is neccesary for its operation. The magnets attracted to this steel part, and after repelled each other strongly. The perendev device also works on a static repulsion state, and if I study it right, it can't work in attraction mode, just stand without a single move.
I guess, In static repulsion the flux lines try to cross each other, but they can't, and maybe this causes swirling flux, what is unnatural, and the power was rejecting out from the magnets. In helmut's design the steel part also can deplete the magnets, maybe, i don't know.

Magnets never want to repell each other, really never, they want to be attracted together, and standing in equilibrium, forever. Gravity (wich appear in nature) is also only attractive force, or we only knows gravitational attraction, wich is the natural way to go. (Planets and galaxies move by gravitational attraction.)
So if we use unnatural ways to operate a device, obviously the device will stop operating soon. I guess this is the essential part of the problem.

I don't know too much about electromagnetic motors, but if i know right (once again ), these motors work in a "balanced mode", with equal attraction and repulsion, or more the attraction. Is this right, or I'm dumb?

So, i have a conclusion: If I can figure out a way, where the static magnetic motor works with equal attraction-repulsion forces, or more attraction than repulsion, and the same time the device not use soft steel and similar parts, just magnets... If I can do this, perhaps I have a chance. Is this the right conclusion, what do you think?

I think if once I can set my wheel into stable motion, I also can set it into full attraction mode, or a more attraction mode, I almost sure about this.
I have already played long hours with my rough test tool, somtimes feel quite close to self rotation, but help it with my hand at the cog point, and I never feel the magnets weaken.

Anyway I don't want to present myself as a f***in clever person... Just my mind runs continously, and this the reason why I wrote too much ideas here. Hope you haven't got a bad feeling about this, and my mode to communicate.

Regards,
Greg

The part that you said about: "If I can figure out a way, where the static magnetic motor works with equal attraction-repulsion forces, or more attraction than repulsion, and the same time the device not use soft steel and similar parts, just magnets..."

Yes, you are on the right track. Soft steel (or any conductive metal) will have eddy currents while in a magnetic field. (Electricity that is induced in the metal shorts out in the metal resulting in heat loss). This was the downfall of Helmut Goebkes's magnetic wheel in my opinion (but it was a very creative attempt).

It sounds like you are trying to make a gravity wheel? You could use a Wankel style gate (but RPM's will be limited with a Wankel style gate due to the lock/unlock of attracting magnets on the path). Or you could try a Kundel style gate with a mechanical device for the release before lockup.

Liberty

Gregory · « **Reply #33 on:** June 07, 2006, 06:44:01 PM »

Quote from: Liberty on June 07, 2006, 05:30:49 PM

Yes, you are on the right track. Soft steel (or any conductive metal) will have eddy currents while in a magnetic field. (Electricity that is induced in the metal shorts out in the metal resulting in heat loss). This was the downfall of Helmut Goebkes's magnetic wheel in my opinion (but it was a very creative attempt).

It sounds like you are trying to make a gravity wheel? You could use a Wankel style gate (but RPM's will be limited with a Wankel style gate due to the lock/unlock of attracting magnets on the path). Or you could try a Kundel style gate with a mechanical device for the release before lockup.

Liberty

Thanks Liberty.
I agree with you, Helmut Goebkes's device was a creative attempt.

No, I don't want to try to create a gravity wheel now. I just tried to talk and explain, that permanent magnetic motors and gravity wheels are "brothers". If one is possible, that means the other is also possible, theoretically. I think it's almost useless and an insane effort to try to make a gravity wheel, without an operating permanent magnetic motor created before. We can adjust the direction of magnetic forces, and place the magnets to every form and geometry we want. But gravity on earth always points in the same direction, we can't change it. We only can position the weights, which ones are attracting to the center of the globe. Plus few mechanical tricks. Not too much possibilities... So, I think it's make much more difficult to thinking about gravity wheels.
But yes, if my magnets begin to move one day, and I perfect the design to reach usable power level (what needs much more than a single month), after I will try the gravity wheel, too. Just for fun... (Gravity can't "demagnetize".)

However, at the moment too much if stand inside the equation, between my words. And I don't like if-s.

Thank you for the tips. I've already read about the Kundel motor, looks an interesting idea. I will read soon about the wankel gate you mentioned. But now I must sleep some hours, I almost didn't sleep in the last two days.

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Author Topic: 4X3 Permanent Magnet Motor concept (Read 29610 times)

jake

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